S43A Form (Firearm/Ammo Mail Order)

Don't know if anyone has this form on file, but I thought it would be a good idea to put it on here.

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Thank you! Hard little bugger to find without branding on it.

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Originally Posted by Timmay

Thank you! Hard little bugger to find without branding on it.

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Yeah you'd think it would be available on the police site in PDF form or something

if you tell me how to attach it I will do it with the latest version of this form in pdf.
Attachment 40382

Not sure bro, I'm crap with computers.

I always use this link http://www.pistolnz.org.nz/media/581...order_form.pdf, prints off nice.

New forms to use....

https://www.police.govt.nz/sites/def...m-nzp-s43a.pdf


or here...
FA Mail Order Form

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Originally Posted by cambo

New forms to use....

https://www.police.govt.nz/sites/def...m-nzp-s43a.pdf


or here...
FA Mail Order Form

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Be sure to leave the Serial Number info off the form. It's not required.

Use this one instead, provided by COLFO.

http://www.colfo.org.nz/component/ph...mmunition-2017

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Originally Posted by stretch

Be sure to leave the Serial Number info off the form. It's not required.

Use this one instead, provided by COLFO.

http://www.colfo.org.nz/component/ph...mmunition-2017

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And what do you do when the local arms officer won't sign it because it's not the official police form?

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Originally Posted by systolic

And what do you do when the local arms officer won't sign it because it's not the official police form?

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Did you even read the notes at the bottom of the form?

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Originally Posted by systolic

And what do you do when the local arms officer won't sign it because it's not the official police form?

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Lee, you really ruin any positive contributions you make here by being a complete fuckwit the rest of the time. By the way, how's the new boss?

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Originally Posted by stretch

Did you even read the notes at the bottom of the form?

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My arms officer does what his sergeant tells him too. Not COLFO.

Do COLFO issue their own lost property or robbery reports for the police to use too?

Why the fuck would I drive all the way to the cop shop to start an argument over a piece of paper?

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Originally Posted by systolic

My arms officer does what his sergeant tells him too. Not COLFO.

Do COLFO issue their own lost property or robbery reports for the police to use too?

Why the fuck would I drive all the way to the cop shop to start an argument over a piece of paper?

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I agree that your arms officer (or any constable) should follow the orders passed down from his superiors UNLESS they are unlawful.

Nowhere in legislation does it say that a mail order purchase must be done via the Police-provided S43a. They (Police) have authored a form that goes above the minimum required by law. If you have no problem with giving serial numbers and whatever other info the Police are asking for, then by all means, use their form.

It seems odd to me that you're arguing FOR giving away more info than necessary, or even that you're using mail order at all, since you've claimed to be so cagey about it in the past:

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Originally Posted by systolic

There's shit loads of people who have signed it with comments like "I'm a firearm collector" or "I shoot pistols in competition".

It took me less than three minutes to search their names and locations through White Pages and get their home address. And of course their phone number to ring to see if they're home. Another click give me a map and street view of their house.

Not everyone of course, but I found six in about 15 minutes. All had comments indicating endorsements and had easy enough names to Google search to confirm who they were through facebook or linked in.

Names and addresses along with photos and maps of houses guns are stored in. All found from the comfort of my office while sipping cold beer.

They are fucking stupid idiots for putting personal information online. How much would the Mongrel Mob pay for a list?

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http://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co.n...78/index7.html

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Originally Posted by stretch

I agree that your arms officer (or any constable) should follow the orders passed down from his superiors UNLESS they are unlawful.

Nowhere in legislation does it say that a mail order purchase must be done via the Police-provided S43a. They (Police) have authored a form that goes above the minimum required by law. If you have no problem with giving serial numbers and whatever other info the Police are asking for, then by all means, use their form.

It seems odd to me that you're arguing FOR giving away more info than necessary, or even that you're using mail order at all, since you've claimed to be so cagey about it in the past:



http://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co.n...78/index7.html

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They have the serial numbers of all the endorsed licence stuff I have. I'm not going to lose any sleep over the cops knowing what A cat guns I buy online.

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Originally Posted by systolic

They have the serial numbers of all the endorsed licence stuff I have. I'm not going to lose any sleep over the cops knowing what A cat guns I buy online.

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Plus even if they do get the serial number of the A cat rifle or shotgun you buy, its only as accurate as when completed. Plenty of people will buy a rifle today and sell it tomorrow. So having the number doesn't mean much, other than potentially helping if it gets stolen and you didn't record the number.
Most times I don't include it, and have never had an issue. Plus some of them don't care for it, as it can be easily onsold so there is no benefit for them to record it. Also helps them to search for potentially stolen firearms as well.

I see the arguments for not giving the number, but the AO is the one that issues the form, so you can chose to argue it and they may not complete the form. Cause no where in the law does it say that the AO must complete the form for you.

Just to stir things up some what, you can use skype to sight the license as it is an admissable comunications medium in court.

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Originally Posted by jim160

I see the arguments for not giving the number, but the AO is the one that issues the form, so you can chose to argue it and they may not complete the form. Cause no where in the law does it say that the AO must complete the form for you.

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Police, as public officials, have a duty to carry out the functions that they are paid for. Refusing to perform their duties is likely to be nonfeasance, and can court action can be taken against them.

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Originally Posted by Walker

Just to stir things up some what, you can use Skype to sight the license as it is an admissable communications medium in court.

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@Walker

So, I want to buy, say, an A-cat SKS, from you. Your suggestion is interesting. How would you see that working by Skype? I'm particularly stuck on the necessity to "sight" the buyer's FAL?

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Originally Posted by Cordite

@Walker

So, I want to buy, say, an A-cat SKS, from you. Your suggestion is interesting. How would you see that working by Skype? I'm particularly stuck on the necessity to "sight" the buyer's FAL?

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I would say that skype would not suit. The licence could be a good photocopy with letters added and names changed/altered and you would never know.
I would guess that the Police would say its unacceptable.

An easy way to find out is ask the Police if it complies.

It's a 'grey' area I think, the wording of the whole act is ambiguios. It say's you must sight the license but not 'how' you sight the license. With current tech. you can see the holograph thats printed on the License which is there to stop counterfitting. As I said it's out there. how about a photo copy of your license thats signed by a JP as sighted? There are quite a few options that comply with the law.

@Walker @jim160

Would a really good camera substitute for sighting a document (I don't know if sighting it is sufficient, do you actually have to examine / handle the FAL in detail?). A legally recognised personal interaction is a different matter and Skype has its niche there.

I can see the Police system of checking your registered address too when doing the forms adding to security of the mail order form system, but then again that is not a legal requirement, given that this is not an issue when buying firearms/ammo in person.

One option is, if you send the FAL itself (not a copy) to the seller for inspection, and then front up on Skype for him/her to eyeball that you indeed look like the person in the photo, that would seem to do. It could be helpful for someone without a local readily accessible police station that is actually open, read rural.

Must say, I prefer my local sports shop to order in stuff for me, including stuff from on the Gun City web site.

43A Mail order sale of firearm or ammunition
(1)
Every person commits an offence and is liable on conviction to a fine not exceeding $1,000 who sells by mail order a firearm or any ammunition for a firearm or restricted weapon otherwise than pursuant to a written order—
(a)
signed by the purchaser; and
(b)
bearing an endorsement signed by a member of the Police and stating that the member of the Police—
(i)
has inspected the purchaser’s firearms licence; and
(ii)
is satisfied that the purchaser is a fit and proper person to purchase that firearm or ammunition.

Question: is an online purchase which is completed by a legal personal meeting (read skype interaction) a "mail order" sale?

And there lies the question! Personally I'm not going to try it.:)

@Walker,

Safest ground is if both ordering and purchase is completed via Skype.

And me neither - such a setup would have to be initiated by dealers. It would cut a lot of time waste by NZ Police processing mail order forms and de-disadvantage rural shooters.