Yet again. People need to be more careful.
Fatal Hunting Accident Near Rotorua - national | Stuff.co.nz
Printable View
Yet again. People need to be more careful.
Fatal Hunting Accident Near Rotorua - national | Stuff.co.nz
Yeh Normie, just read it on the Herald website. It is always tragic when something like this happens but this one sounds a bit dodgy as the police are talking to the guy that reported it but are looking for someone else that has done a runner. I think we will find that there is more to this than initially reported.
Far out, maybe I should stay home this weekend?? :oh noes:
Where are you off to Dougie?
What are we doing wrong with our training of people in the use of firearms??
My young fella and his cobber both have just sat their firearms tickets...should this include a HUNT's course..should everyone be taken out into the scrub with an instructor and shown how to clearly identify their bloody target not sound not movement not colour? MAKE BLOODY SURE!!! Should they also be taken to a range to be taught how to safely handle a firearm and made to sit down at a range and shoot of a shit load of ammo to get the 'Rambo" (all new and exciting) urge out of em. I have done these things with both my lad and his mate.... The one thing I drilled into them is you CANNOT PUT THE BULLET BACK IN THE GUN!!
I'm not bloody perfect but come on people this is not acceptable!! We as a hunting community have to do a shit load better and do it NOW.
AOS are out looking for a guy. Also, word is that it might not be on public land. Area cordoned off too. Looks like a bit more than just 'failure to identify target'.
Yep, they wouldn't have an armed cordon wearing ballistic armor if it was an accident. Unless the offender has done a runner.
This is not good why is this happening
Well said Stingray!!!
I was quite surprised when getting my ticket that I was not even required to HOLD a firearm? Wtf? Luckily for me I have had an AWESOME best mate who has taught me very good range ettiquette and also had y ears bleed with toets and safety info while in the army.
It might be interesting to trace back how long ago and where these offenders have obtained their licences.
I could well be very wrong but I absolutely think by the way the news articles are worded that there will be more to this and I wouldn't be surprised at all if it turns out not to be a "mistaken for an animal" hunting accident. Still tragic whichever way it falls.
I'm getting a bit stir crazy and excited about a three day trip to Q town next week (hoping to get me some winning shots for that photo comp!) so I'm planning on a day walkies in the Rimutakas with my four legged boy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rushy
Absolutely your rite, but apart from hunts courses and dads/mums training there young hunters themselves theres nothing but you tube.
Ive said before on here when you get your fire arms ticket it should include a practicle test with criticle passes and if you fail it no gun license.just like a car.
Reminds me of somewhere....I think both the instructors and students wear green.. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Neckshot
Whats it going to be like when my 8 year old wants to sit his license in 8 years time? will he be allowed, will the age go up! the gov is good at knee jerk reactions this is going to impact on him.We have to do something im an advocate of rifle safety so were do you start?. hopefully ive jumped the gun no pun intended.
Neckshot I certainly agree that there needs to be a strong element of practical assessment in the firearms licensing regime and you are right on the money by drawing a parallel with driver licensing. The difficulties that will attach to such a dramatic shift is the cost element (finding the money to fund the assessors and the assessment program) and the hue and cry that would come from the less safe among current license holders that would see the change as a threat to their continued ability to own firearms. All of that aside, there would remain the issue of non licensed people in possession of firearms which again I would not be surprised to learn was involved in this recent tragedy. If I was a betting man, reading between the lines in the article and considering the police reation, i would put ten bucks on the horse that says this has the undertone and flavour of someone protecting his patch.
Tougher consequences....
5 years jail instead of a few months!!!!
I don't agree on tougher sentences as that is trying to fix the issue after it happens and in the heat of the moment it won't stop anything.
Better training is the key. Make everyone sit a practical
I agree better training ! . And this needs to come from the hunting clubs/ associations etc. Why ? Is that if it doesn't gun laws will get tougher, affecting all of us . With out getting political, tougher licensing will prevale over education !. Wouldnt be a bad idea to make it compulsory to join a club for maybe a year ? I cant see why this would not work .
There has just been an update on the Herald website and they are now saying that this is definitely another case of one hunter shooting his friend and the involvement of the AOS was merely because they were in the area on another matter at the time. As we all seem to agree, these sorts of incidents should never occur and are dreadfully tragic when they do. I for one would happily undergo a physical assessment requiring me to prove I can safely handle firearms and properly identify target animals to retain my firearms license.
Condolences to the families of both parties.
My brother in law in Austria has to sit an exam on firearms safety, an exam on flora & fauna and an exam on animals & birds recognition. He has to do 18hrs practical on shotguns at a clay club and at a rifle range. He has to belong to a club - All this before he gets a licence. If drops club membership they by law have to notify the police and he'll lose his licence. It's pretty tight.
I would like to see attendence at a practical session such as a mini-hunts course a requirement. A club membership a bit impractical if you're a cocky in the backblocks, but would be a benefit.
I still think a club membership could work for all , I'm not pointing the finger but have seen some very dodgy gun practices by farmers in the past . Where you expect they would be experts because of there exposure to guns from a young age.. This is where the experience comes into light again , if you have never had been taught safe gun practice , experience alone may not teach you gun safety?Quote:
Originally Posted by scottrods
There is a great deal of wisdom in that Munsey. I saw a sergeant put his boot up the arse of a baggy that was wildly spraying 9mm bullets out of an old Thompson sub machine gun in Brnham back in 72. I bet that silly young bugger never forgot that safety message ever again. Not advocating violence but affirmative training definitely works.Quote:
Originally Posted by Munsey
Another unecessary loss of life.
I feel some sort firearms competency test neds to occur during the licence application process. I would prefer to see better education than stricter regulation of firearms.
When I was living in Canada I got a Canadian Firearms Licence and we had to do night courses going over legislation, rules regarding safety and use and learn how to safely handle/load/clear the different firearm action types commonly used by the general public (they had disabled examples of all the standard action/rifle types) . It was run by their version of mountain safety council and mandatory in order to get a licence. You sat both a written and practical test on the last night.
Cost was not too bad considering the information you got out of it and the cost included the Licence IIRC.
This will help all new firearms users (and current) to better understand all aspects of firearm handling/safety.
Some sort of decent course should be compulsory, dunno about compolsory club membership tho, (There's none out there that would suit me)...................
Condolences to the families of both parties as well.
I would just like to say that I have only a few months ago had to renew my license after a few years over seas and had to do the full test. I have to say it does not give you a lot of confidence in the system when you have guys that have failed the test when they take it up to the instructor but the instructor talks the failed questions over them them and then just passes them.
I noted one guy that must have incorrectly answer 10 out of the 30 and he did not look like a guy that you wanted to have a license, yet after the instructor talked the questions over with the person he was passed.
"WHAT IS THE POINT OF HAVING A TEST" !!!!!!!!!!!
Why do the media call it a hunting accident. It makes us look bad. Headline should be firearms "accident" half the cu@ts with guns don't know how or even go hunting
+1 the test alone is a joke, they even go to the extent to say that they prefer people to pass so they have the basic concepts yet those that fail still pass after a chat, the question i have if they fail the test on basics yet still receive a pass how can they have the basic concepts down? The logistics of a change may be costly, but then what value do you put on a life that may be saved by having better trained/prepared individuals in the field.
RIP dodzy.
Gutted, just gutted. No point having tougher sentencing for this type of thing.
Chris
I would suggest compulsory military training in a teeth arms trade. If you fire your weapon in the military without following ROE's or correct instruction really bad things happen to you.
It may have got all touchy feely now tho and you just get a stern talking too. :D
Na, I agree, a course of some description should be funded by the govt and run by suitably qualified instructors, either military or police with yrs of firearms training and hunting under their belt not just any old knob.
All I will say is condolences too the family:( Otherwise I will upset to many. RIP dude
+ 1Quote:
Originally Posted by Dundee
Agreed, but unlicensed firearms is beyond our control becuase the cops cant even control it.But could the mountain safety council be buffed up? its the police who issue the lisence but thats were they stop.Ultimately it will all be governd by money but can someone tell me were the money goes from our gun lisence i e; what it pays for and shit like that.there are over 300 thou gun lisences arnt there?.I only get on this bandwagon becuase i take my boy with me and i have three more waiting at home wanting there turn, as a dad I want to know things are being done to atleast add a bit more safty out there aside from the practices that i already preach to him.
Like a fire lane! with deer targets, live rounds and then you add in the curve balls! like all the 7 rules in the arms code walk around one corner theres a deer 20m out from you but 20m behind the deer is a person(cut out) tell the guy if you see a deer shot it and then see what happns,If he shoots the deer FAIL.That is a rough example.
I completely disagree with the rule " Identify your target"..... Before you all jump on me with foul words hear me out.
This should be replaced with " identify what part of your target you are shooting at".......this makes people take a whole other step in there heads and im sure most people do.
Have you ever heard of a bow hunter shooting someone by accident???????
This is because they have to be very picky on where they can place the shot.
The way i see it if a deer (for example ) is shot in the hind quaters then what is the point of shooting it?? 80% of the meat is fucked!
People need to hound there fellow hunters who shoot any thing other than a head , neck or chest shot.. this make people hook harder at what and where they are shooting instead of just throwing lead in the direction untill it stops moving!
Complacency is a dangerous thing around firearms. Just because someone uses a firearm constantly, does not make them a responsible user. How many hunting fatalities are caused by an experienced user - quite a few recently. From what i have read, many of the culprits have been absolutely convinced that they were shooting at a deer, and these guys have shot many deer. The brain can apparently draw on past experiences and convince you that what you see is a deer. Makes me shudder to think that it could happen to me and I could make the same mistake. My number one safeguard is to ALWAYS assume the noise/shape etc is human, until absolutely proven otherwise. I never want to be complacent and think I could never make the same mistake as those guys.
Don't mean to sound all ponsy on my first posting (new member), but this is as serious as it gets.
Welcome Lentil..... I always thaught lentils were bland ... you seem to be a bit more interesting!
But Totaly agree.. it is scary!!!
Thanks oneshot. I fully endorse the shot placement principle. Just seeing an eye and maybe something that could be the neck and shooting is bloody stupid, but I bet it happens plenty of times. Might be correct 99 times, but number 100 ????
By the way, Lentils are pretty bland, but can surprise.
Papamoa.... i work there! Good to see BOP people here in force!
Bloody sad and mad about this.
Dodzy was a man who lived his life to the full . I met him a few times over the years and he was always at full speed no matter what.
I see new license holders all the time .Some have done their homework and have an idea on what they want or have a mate to help them with the choice.
Others dont know the difference between a .22 and a .223 . We as a store try our best to get a new shooter to the range and at least get the rifle sighted in + show the basics of cleaning and care along with a range rules talk.
More in depth training may help but adhering to the rules will help more.
Cant fucken believe this shits keeps happening . For some fucken venison. Wake up people , this literally was in my back yard . The access to the bush there was across my old farm. Ive taken my kids for walks in there , makes me feel fucken sick.
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2c