Thread: ARMS OFFICE NEWSLETTER WAIKATO DISTRICT

FYI

ARMS OFFICE NEWSLETTER
WAIKATO DISTRICT



WINTER 2013


Greetings to all Waikato Firearms Dealers, Pistol Clubs, Gun Clubs, MSC groups, Deerstalkers Clubs and anyone with a Firearms Licence!!

Once again it has been a long time since I flicked out the last newsletter, so I suppose that gives a fair indication as to how busy the office has been.

We are heading into a very busy period due to the 10 year Re-Licencing system, and are gearing up to hit the peak period which will see us being extremely flat out for the next 2 or 3 years.

Closest to my heart are matters concerning gun safety in our part of the world, so here we go......


CHANGE OF ADDRESS

You are required by law to notify Police of your change of address within 30 days of moving.

We get very annoyed when we find out that a burglary victim had guns stolen and that they had failed to notify us of their change of address (which enables us to get a Security Check done & verify that they have taken reasonable precautions against theft). Be aware that under such circumstances the licence holder could easily have their firearms licence Revoked, and in fact this usually does occur. There is little sympathy for someone who has failed to meet their security obligations.

Under section 34 of The Arms Act 1983, 'Failure To Notify Change Of Address' is a punishable offence subject to a fine.


MENTAL HEALTH

Every few weeks it is my very sad task to become involved with a person who has suffered a serious setback in their life, and mental health has become a major issue which in turn can affect their Firearms Licence.

A lot of people fail to advise us of issues until it is too late. Sometimes it can involve an elderly family member who is developing problems and starts to act aggressively and may even lead to threats of violence with firearms or unsafe shooting practises.

Sometimes a person may be involved in self-harm.

Such issues are extremely difficult to sort through and at times we are very dependant on family members helping to make the situation safe by quietly removing the guns from the home and ensuring that the Firearms Licence card is surrendered to us.

Ignoring this problem is not a good option. Please - do something about it before someone gets hurt. If you need advice, call me.


CUSTOMS, D.O.C. AND FISH & GAME

This last year has seen the further growth of information passing from the above agencies to our office. This has enabled us to respond quicker to those that break the rules & regulations relating to importing and hunting, and we are getting onto such offenders sooner than in previous years.

Every incident is treated on a 'case by case' basis, but as a general rule those who are involved in minor infringements (eg hunting ducks without a permit) will receive a Warning Letter. Of course, the other government agency involved may still choose to prosecute and that is their decision. If the occurrences are serious or too regular then we may even look at Revoking their Firearms Licence

Be aware too, that Police are taking a hard-line on poachers. A poaching gang operating in the vicinity of the Kaimai's was recently busted. These folks had effectively destroyed a deer-farmers livelihood. They have all been prosecuted in court and their Firearms Licences have been Revoked.

There is zero-tolerance for poachers in the Waikato!


DANGEROUS SHOOTERS

There is certainly a growing trend of city/town folk who move to life-style blocks and believe that they are "living in the country", and that it is acceptable to discharge their firearms on their property. BE AWARE THAT TO DO SO MAY BE AN OFFENCE!

Please be aware of the following extract from the Arms Act 1983:

48: Discharging firearm, airgun, pistol, or restricted weapon in or near dwelling-house or public place
• Every person commits an offence and is liable on summary conviction to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 3 months or to a fine not exceeding $3,000 or to both who, without reasonable cause, discharges a firearm, airgun, pistol, or restricted weapon in or near—
• (a) a dwellinghouse; or
• (b) a public place,—
so as to endanger property or to endanger, annoy, or frighten any person.

Note that it states "annoy or frighten", and that's enough to get a visit from the boys in blue, which then comes through to me, which then can very easily bounce back to you via a Notice of Consideration to Revoke a Firearms Licence.

Although it's still early days, I have been made aware of only a small amount of incidents due to the recent duck hunting season. The main one which you may have read about in the papers is in regard to some shooters who used their power-boat to cruise the Waikato River within the boundaries of Hamilton City and shoot at some ducks!



We are currently investigating this occurrence so I can not yet say what will happen. However, given the fact that Police received several calls from frightened locals including one from a person who felt the bird-shot swishing around his legs, then it is highly likely that charges could follow and Firearms Licences could be Revoked as a result.

Luckily no one was hurt!!!

And there is still the odd person who believes that it is ok to go 'spotlighting' around DOC campsites. It is not. It never will be. There are no excuses. It is dangerous and it will not be tolerated.


PISTOL CLUBS

It's that time of year again folks, where I will soon need your club attendance list. Please send these to me as soon as possible for the 2012/2013 year.

It has come to my attention that some members may be getting 'signed in' but not are not actually attending. There is a huge amount of trust in place between Police, the Pistol Clubs and Pistol NZ. Let's not blow it folks - please ensure that this point is raised within your committee and that steps are in place to prevent this from occurring.

'3 Gun' shooting is gaining in popularity. However this is relatively new to the Waikato clubs, and there has been a lot of confusion about what clubs can and can not do in this regard. In fairness this is due to some mis-information available in the internet, and also an honest lack of experience.

If your club conducts MSSA style shooting events, please contact me and I can steer you down the right track. It is extremely easy to sacrifice safety for 'fun' at these events, and in accordance with Pistol NZ there are strict guidelines.

Remember - one 'accident' and the results could be catastrophic not only for some poor person who may receive an unwanted hole in their body, but also for your club.


ENDORSEMENT APPLICATIONS

We are getting an ever increasing amount of applications for endorsements. Sometimes for more than one endorsement at a time, and although this is not illegal we can't help but think that this is done mainly to save $$$$$, which is definitely not a suitable reason. Such multiple applications do make us somewhat doubtful as to the validity of the applications.

It can be very difficult for a person to gain an endorsement, and there is a lot of work involved in processing such applications. If you do not meet the requirements, and we are very strict in this matter, then your application must be Refused.

To be a Collector - you must be able to prove to us that you have a specific interest and evidence of being a collector (ie in other areas such as A Cat guns, militaria etc).

To get an E endorsement for an MSSA - you must provide good reason such as proof of being a professional 'culler', or of belonging to a club/organization that participates in regular shooting events with MSSA guns.

To get a B endorsement for a Pistol - you must be a current member of a Pistol Club.

If you don't meet the criteria, don't bother applying.


ARMS AMENDMENT ACT

Sorry folks - still waiting for this to go through the system.

Be prepared for the possibility that if you currently own an 'A Cat' MSSA style gun (eg AR15), once the Amendment becomes law then you will most likely have 3 options:

1. Dispose of your gun - Give/sell your gun to a person with an E endorsement or a Dealer, or surrender it to Police.
2. Apply for an E endorsement and list your gun as E. Bare in mind that you will have to install E Cat security, and most likely will have to pay for the endorsement application and prove good reasons as stated above.
3. Ensure that your gun does not fall into E Cat description.

Be aware that until clear policy is given by Police National Headquarters (which will occur once the Act is passed) we are not really sure who will be affected and how exactly. The above options are just an idea to give you the 'heads up' and warn you out.



So that's all of my news for the next few months. As usual, I have been out and about visiting as many gun clubs and people as I can, and it's always great to meet those folks who really enjoy their shooting in a safe way.

We are all extremely fortunate that there are so many different types of shooting available to us in this country - be it clay-target, hunting, target shooting, pistol & rifle clubs, western-action etc etc.

Get into a club, meet some fantastic people and learn from their experience. It's ok to learn from books, but real-time experience is like GOLD!!!

Kindest regards from us all here at Firearms office, and I look forward to meeting you sometime soon.


Richard Plas
District Arms Officer
Waikato

Phone: 07 8586247
email: richard.plas@police.govt.nz

Wuh? It's always been considered normal to apply for all your endorsements at once to save money. Maybe they're getting pissy cuz they're losing out on it.

Interesting.
He's telling everyone not to bother attempting to get an E unless you are a culler or belong to club but on the other hand if you buy an A cat AR now you can get a free E.

That might explain why so many ARs are selling at the moment. Great to have it confirmed from the horses mouth. Buy now or forever miss out!

Such a crock of shit, creating a solution to address a problem that doesn't exist.

Just quoting the following....

To get an E endorsement for an MSSA - you must provide good reason such as proof of being a professional 'culler', or of belonging to a club/organization that participates in regular shooting events with MSSA guns.


You know surely if you are a fit and proper person, why can't you have one ( AR15 ) pass the increased security checks etc
Why can't one enjoy the experience of a MSSA firearm ?

Although I don't own a AR15 and considering NOW you can get one no probs all good ( A cat ) the only thing that changes is the law
and next minute you can't have one.

It's sad but I think the boat has already sailed on this one.

Originally Posted by Digit

Interesting.
He's telling everyone not to bother attempting to get an E unless you are a culler or belong to club but on the other hand if you buy an A cat AR now you can get a free E.

No mate, no free lunch. He says "Bare in mind that you will have to install E Cat security, and most likely will have to pay for the endorsement application and prove good reasons as stated above"

Originally Posted by Digit

Interesting.
He's telling everyone not to bother attempting to get an E unless you are a culler or belong to club but on the other hand if you buy an A cat AR now you can get a free E.

That might explain why so many ARs are selling at the moment. Great to have it confirmed from the horses mouth. Buy now or forever miss out!

Umm Digit read it again that was not implied IMO

2. Apply for an E endorsement and list your gun as E. Bare in mind that you will have to install E Cat security, and most likely will have to pay for the endorsement application and prove good reasons as stated above.

Such as


To get an E endorsement for an MSSA - you must provide good reason such as proof of being a professional 'culler', or of belonging to a club/organization that participates in regular shooting events with MSSA guns.

Read it again that does not sound like ..

Interesting.
He's telling everyone not to bother attempting to get an E unless you are a culler or belong to club but on the other hand if you buy an A cat AR now you can get a free E.

That might explain why so many ARs are selling at the moment. Great to have it confirmed from the horses mouth. Buy now or forever miss out!

Where's the statement about free E ???

You're right, I didn't read it correctly. I was basing my interpretations on the previous thumb hole stock debacle.

Might be easier on a C licence, then you can get some really good gear?

Originally Posted by Digit

You're right, I didn't read it correctly. I was basing my interpretations on the previous thumb hole stock debacle.

Roger that and don't worry I had hoped you were right and I was wrong

Cheers Happy

Originally Posted by Maca49

Might be easier on a C licence, then you can get some really good gear?

But you can't use any of it...

THE FOLLOWING LETTER HAS BEEN SENT TO WAIKATO ARMS OFFICE


Dear Richard

We have recently had drawn to our attention a newsletter published by the Waikato Arms Office. It appears to follow a recent trend of police trying to "extend the provisions of the Arms Act" which is a matter that your superiors at PNHQ now formally deny (via crown law.)

You have said in that newsletter: "To get an E endorsement for an MSSA - you must provide good reason such as proof of being a professional 'culler', or of belonging to a club/organization that participates in regular shooting events with MSSA guns."

We should like to point out that to obtain an endorsement permitting possession of an MSSA the applicant for the endorsement needs to be considered "fit and proper." There are no criteria set down in the Act for the fit and proper test. There is no legislative authority for police to prescribe what amounts to a lawful, sufficient and proper reason and therefore, by proxy, a fit and proper criteria. In the Hansard from 1992, the Minister of Police citied that "bona fide hunters" (without any further qualification) were considered to be eligible to possess MSSAs. It is further noted that police do not have legislative authority to over-ride s50 of the Arms Act. A person who possesses a MSSA is entitled to do so for any lawful, sufficient and proper reason. Such a reason is a matter of law; not a matter of police opinion. It is not unlawful for any person to use an MSSA in any situation where he or she might otherwise use a non-endorsable firearm. It is also noted that police are not entitled to impose blanket policies circumscribing their discretion under s30B of the Arms Act (see PSI v COP 1992.)

We also find your complaining about multiple endorsements to be somewhat odd. It is clearly contemplated in the fees schedule of the Arms Regulations that a person may apply for multiple endorsements. We believe that the confusion arises due to the flawed police system of issuing 'alphabetic category endorsements' ; we take this opportunity to clarify:

There is no such thing as an alphabetic endorsement; an endorsement relates to a gun; not a letter of the alphabet.
There is no fee for an endorsement - the fee is for the application.
The application relates to one or more specific firearms (which attract an endorsement) on the basis of the firearms legal category: i.e pistol, RW, MSSA.
So for example a person who wants to possess three pistols and four MSSAs would apply for:
3 pistol endorsements @$200
4 MSSA endorsements @200
Total $400.00

Once you understand the scheme of the Arms Act (as opposed to the scheme of the police alphabet) your complaints about multiple endorsement applications ought to be soothed.

Would you be good enough to publish a correction to your newsletter; that will mean that NSA will not have to escalate the matter further.

Kind Regards
National Shooters Association

OK, before anybody says anything - please don't let this thread descend into a volley of name calling, accusations and general abuse.

Originally Posted by Ryan

OK, before anybody says anything - please don't let this thread descend into a volley of name calling, accusations and general abuse.

+ 1 BUT Reasonable response to the first post though I must say when I saw the must be a culler or club member I was surprised... Lets play nicely ...

Originally Posted by Maca49

Might be easier on a C licence, then you can get some really good gear?

Except you cant shoot it on a C? or take it out of your house without telling the police first and why? at least that's my understanding of a C.

regards