Thread: Could it be so simple?

Originally Posted by R93

I will try any drink once I spose.

You're not even allowed to use butter so it no surprise you can't follow my logic.

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You do like a good sized sample.

No I'm just not allowed to use YOUR butter which is just as logical Iv put a good amount of time looking for core sampling tools for the next trip.

Originally Posted by sneeze

You do like a good sized sample.

No I'm just not allowed to use YOUR butter which is just as logical Iv put a good amount of time looking for core sampling tools for the next trip.

Why bother the hole you dig into it would put any super pit mine to shame😆

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Originally Posted by R93

Why bother the hole you dig into it would put any super pit mine to shame��

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I do it for a living, hard to switch off.

Originally Posted by HNTMAD

Disagree. Shouldn't matter what sort of deer it us. Hind, fawn. 6 or 16 You shouldn't shoot a human, maybe they could enforce that at the road ends

Just Identify your target

Hamish

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I think that you , along with the majority of NZ hunters, are afraid of change. Non of us want a nanny state telling us what we can and cant do, but if we keep on doing what we always done, then we are going to keep on getting what we always got.
If we as a collective don't act, then the powers that be WILL act .

Originally Posted by Pengy

I think that you , along with the majority of NZ hunters, are afraid of change. Non of us want a nanny state telling us what we can and cant do, but if we keep on doing what we always done, then we are going to keep on getting what we always got.
If we as a collective don't act, then the powers that be WILL act .

So change the arms code from Identify your target and have it say, Tell everyone where you are hunting so they dont shoot you??

Its not about change, Nothing wrong with whats there, simple thing is you need to identify your target. adding in all these other things is taking away from identifying your target.

Even doing target identification course with a pass or fail is not going to work, It is set up in a false environement and cant emulate being in the heat of the battle.

This is me speaking from seeing what i thought was a deer and it wasnt, it is also me leaving notes about where i am hunting (yes i do this in busy times) and still having a fark tard shoot past me and my son

It is human until proven (identify your target) otherwise, Not hard

You say the powers to be will change, So will they remove public holidays so there are not so many cars on the road, or enforce even days mean even street numbers drive?? How many Hunters in NZ v annual Deaths?? then look at drivers and deaths. Yes it matters to us the hunters and hits us harder than non hunters, They have stopped talking about it and we still are!! Has it made me more anxious to get out in the hills, hell yes. I have heard 4 more "close call or shear fark you attitudes in the last 2 weeks and thats in wellington alone. 2 of which were a father son combo so the father is not teaching the next generation good habbits, I hunt every weekend for 52 weeks of the year and it is only over this time i feel scared to go on my own. It shouldn't be this way

I say again, Identify your target beyond all doubt and life will be spared, even if the powers to be change things it will still happen, it is a fact of participating in a sport where we carry a device that kills things

Hamish

Not at all Gravelben, I'm merely saying that if you want a meat animal there is the rest of the year to shoot one, say for example in spring when they are easy work and eating the good stuff, as opposed to going out in a very busy time of year and crowding a finite resource. That's what I believe the original post was about, curbing the 'I have to come home with something mentality' not changing laws. Changing a culture of an entire group. No easy task.


Driving back through the Waioeka gorge from Gisborne this weekend, 25 wagons all at various entry points. Scary

Originally Posted by Steve123

The problem with any rule limiting what you can shoot is DOC. Their goal is to wipe out not manage. Maybe the only way is make a DOC permit conditional on doing a target ID course and test every 5 or so years. It could be done as a condition of obtaining a licence as well.

Not if Deer come under management of the Game Animal Council.
I am pro the use of a species / sex / season permit. It worked in US and Canada to aid species / sex management and reduce hunter fatalities. The problem in NZ is ingrained "if its brown, its down" thing.

And whats wrong with taking hinds now?? Hind culling is ideal for deer management, and frankly, they are IMHO perfect for taking now - not really pregnant, in good condition, and last years fawn has been booted out to look after itself.

Im with Hamish on this one.

Its quite simple you cannot shoot someone with out breaking 1 or more of the following rules, more rules wont change this in the slightest.

Now i do agree that something has to change. I remember when i went for my fal and there was only 10 of the 18 or so people who passed the test to begin with.
I hung around talking to a few people and looking at the different types of firearms end the end everyone walked away with a pass.

I think when thats your only safety net some people are doomed to fail and yes i might take 20 - 30 years for that failure to happen.
I would like to see something like the NZDA Hunts program for everyone looking to get into hunting,
A Shooting Range use program for those looking to get into target shooting

This will set a good foundation around the basics of active firearms handling in scenarios that's relevant and easy to apply in different situations.

@HNTMAD can you honestly not see how having to identify sex and quality of an animal would not make people identify the target more clearly??? It's all about that extra 2 seconds it takes for people to have a better look then just snap shooting at a moving bush.

And killing someone in a car crash is hardly the same as deliberately pulling the trigger with the intention to kill

Originally Posted by PerazziSC3

@HNTMAD can you honestly not see how having to identify sex and quality of an animal would not make people identify the target more clearly??? It's all about that extra 2 seconds it takes for people to have a better look then just snap shooting at a moving bush.

And killing someone in a car crash is hardly the same as deliberately pulling the trigger with the intention to kill

Shit mate. If your not doing this already you got rocks in your head and need to get out of the bush.

You get me wrong. I practice that now, it forms my decision before shooting weather a quick shot in bush or more leisurely at greater distance than 20-30m. At all times like others it is human until otherwise so back to the original rule of identifying your target beyond all doubt. Pretty simple really, no need to complicate things

Hamish

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The OP suggested posed a really poinient question, even if adopted as only a personal limitation it does have a lot of merit.
This should be a positive discussion where new ideas are encouraged.
The solution lies with individuals at its root level, constructive discussion will broaden everyone's awareness and enhance personal safe guards regarding this matter.
My question is.... will you share any simple personal checks and processes you apply in identifying your quarry?

Originally Posted by Moutere

The OP suggested posed a really poinient question, even if adopted as only a personal limitation it does have a lot of merit.
This should be a positive discussion where new ideas are encouraged.
The solution lies with individuals at its root level, constructive discussion will broaden everyone's awareness and enhance personal safe guards regarding this matter.
My question is.... will you share any simple personal checks and processes you apply in identifying your quarry?

Sex of quarry and a guess at age is what I do. Add to that a clear sight picture and I'm pretty confident I am safe.

Originally Posted by HNTMAD

Shit mate. If your not doing this already you got rocks in your head and need to get out of the bush.

You get me wrong. I practice that now, it forms my decision before shooting weather a quick shot in bush or more leisurely at greater distance than 20-30m. At all times like others it is human until otherwise so back to the original rule of identifying your target beyond all doubt. Pretty simple really, no need to complicate things

Hamish

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Well the facts are people aren't doing that! A bit of advertising around this wouldn't hurt surely? I give mates shit when they shoot a scrubber or hind in the roar.

Originally Posted by Moutere

The OP suggested posed a really poinient question, even if adopted as only a personal limitation it does have a lot of merit.
This should be a positive discussion where new ideas are encouraged.
The solution lies with individuals at its root level, constructive discussion will broaden everyone's awareness and enhance personal safe guards regarding this matter.
My question is.... will you share any simple personal checks and processes you apply in identifying your quarry?

As said above, I can't remember the last time I went out just to shoot something, I'm always targeting a particular animal.. Generally Spring I will be looking for a well conditioned younger animal, Feb/roar will be looking for a stag that I would be happy to carry the head out a fair way along with the meat. In winter if I need meat then I will smack most things but as above I'm still fully identifying a guessed age and sex cause I don't want to end up with an old skinny hind.

Originally Posted by 199p

Its quite simple you cannot shoot someone with out breaking 1 or more of the following rules, more rules wont change this in the slightest.

That's it in a nut shell, it is the application of the current cardinal rules here that is the issue.

Originally Posted by 199p

I would like to see something like the NZDA Hunts program for everyone looking to get into hunting,
A Shooting Range use program for those looking to get into target shooting

Respectfully, I am not in favour of such blanket requirements. The NZDA Hunts program is already there for those who choose to attend it.
Maybe at most, make such a thing a condition to access to public land for hunting. But as you said yourself more rules won't change things.
Statistically, on a range is not where shooting deaths occur either, why try and solve a problem that doesn't exist. I could easily see a licence costing upwards of $600 in our user pays system for no net gain overall.

To engage about this as a user group, either here online, hunting shows on TV, magazines, at retailers, at the range and socially among our peers.
To be proactive as a user group.
That is something NZDA could certainly spear head.