Thread: Mark your guns?

Originally Posted by canross

I was thinking about this thread a bit more - an RFID chip in the stock would be a neat trick. They are the little chips in shop clothing, books, and your credit and eftpos cards that are powered by a radio signal to alert security systems or activate paywave at the cashier. They're dirt cheap, can be scanned from a distance, and never really stop working if protected (IE encased in resin etc).

It would take a little bit of determination on behalf of the owner to do (IE place the chips in the stock, buy a $20 scanner, document the chip ID against the firearm, keep a record) but it would be an invisible but easily checked method of cataloging firearms. Probably would be most effective because thieves probably wouldn't look for it, and if you knew to scan for it, is easily detected without having to disassemble the gun or use complicated or time consuming recovery techniques.

Our firm in Australia was considering this for hydraulic hoses on our U/G machinery as part of an industry guideline to manage them to prevent burst injuries.
The chips were very cheap-we didn't do it but think it was down to logistics and an industry downturn.
this would only really work if crims didn't know we were doing it or it was in such a place they couldn't se it remove it.
On a conspiracy theory note I also don't like it as then official govt departments could use it to sneak in firearms tracking/registration.
make it mandatory to have one on new firearms etc. I just don't trust them enough for that.

Originally Posted by csmiffy

Our firm in Australia was considering this for hydraulic hoses on our U/G machinery as part of an industry guideline to manage them to prevent burst injuries.
The chips were very cheap-we didn't do it but think it was down to logistics and an industry downturn.
this would only really work if crims didn't know we were doing it or it was in such a place they couldn't se it remove it.
On a conspiracy theory note I also don't like it as then official govt departments could use it to sneak in firearms tracking/registration.
make it mandatory to have one on new firearms etc. I just don't trust them enough for that.

I was going to suggest "The Tile"for the task until you made this comment, then I thought Hell no!!!
https://www.thetileapp.com/?utm_camp...SAAEgIcUfD_BwE

I am not sure I want anyone to have a shopping list of what people own, but I sure as hell dont want them to know specific locations...

The ones I was referring to were probably only a couple of bucks if that and would have to be scanned but if we start it some anti will come up with a clever idea and Make it a bit more involved and then look out. very much the start of the slippery slope.
I think it would have to be done as a personal thing so its all different all the time. crims wouldn't know how to sort it but could still be managed, and not big enough that agencies could start "helping" with it.

Originally Posted by Russian 22.

I thought things like serial numbers could be etched back from the ground off bit.

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@Russian 22

Dosvidanye. Yes, you have to grind the steel down about or more than 3x the original depth of the stamped letters/numbers to lose them completely to acid recovery techniques... and that starts getting down to where it might weaken the gun and you might get nervous about firing it after grinding. Some crims may of course just attempt to obliterate the numbers by overstamping, a harder nut to crack. I like the suggestion by @canross about RFID chips. They are cheap as, just go to the scrap yard and get some modern car keys and each has a chip embedded you can use.

Let's be real here, you really think police try to recover serial numbers where they've been filed off?

Like it really matters if your pinched shotgun or rifle has been hacksawed into a ghetto pistol, you're not getting it back.

Why even bother with rfid chips, a slightly modified magnatron out of a microwave can wipe rfids easier than grinding a serial number off.

Still amuses me someone I know kept putting his wallet on top of the microwave, 3rd times a charm for a new chipped visa

Originally Posted by Jexla

Let's be real here, you really think police try to recover serial numbers where they've been filed off?

Honestly not sure @Jexla, but it is a well established and simple procedure.

The thing is, a cop would just not know what serial number he'd discover, it may link to a serious aggravated burglary. It may lead to something else. Or not. I'm by nature a bit lazy, but also curious and I'd personally not be able to resist attempting it, if nothing else just because the crims tried to defeat me by filing it down.
@striker makes a point referring to our NZ criminals' evil genius mastery of things magnetronic. Yes, seems more worthwhile just lock up guns well, and consider locking up bolts etc. somewhere else, hidden, even if we don't have to for some guns.

Or properly reforming or confining people who steal guns. But Labour wants to give them a cuddle.

Originally Posted by Beavis

Or properly reforming or confining people who steal guns. But Labour wants to give them a cuddle.

I'd take it a step further and say we should have in place the necessary means to dispatch these thugs who think it's all right to break in to law-abiding homes.

Originally Posted by Sasquatch

I'd take it a step further and say we should have in place the necessary means to dispatch these thugs who think it's all right to break in to law-abiding homes.

Castle Doctrine

@Sasquatch, yes, castle doctrine works to some extent - less burglaries done while owners are at home in the US than in the UK.
@Beavis Reforming or confining, yes. But as far as deterring goes it does not work that well, apart from being a euphemism for society's vindictiveness. In this case the US shows up badly, 10+ yrs for one count of burglary and theft as an example of their penalties, and their prison system is awash, a massive concentration labour camp system, just filled with negroes instead of jews, the majority of which have been stripped of their right to vote, some for the rest of their lives even after release from prison.

Originally Posted by Cordite

@Sasquatch, yes, castle doctrine works to some extent - less burglaries done while owners are at home in the US than in the UK.
@Beavis Reforming or confining, yes. But as far as deterring goes it does not work that well, apart from being a euphemism for society's vindictiveness. In this case the US shows up badly, 10+ yrs for one count of burglary and theft as an example of their penalties, and their prison system is awash, a massive concentration labour camp system, just filled with negroes instead of jews, the majority of which have been stripped of their right to vote, some for the rest of their lives even after release from prison.

I think the very full prison system the USA has is also a result of the privatisation of the prisons and the amendment which allows slavery if you're a convicted criminal.

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Severity of sentence is not a deterrent, but as the Kiwi Gun Blog says, when you go to the zoo, the tigers can't hurt you when they are in a cage. A complete overhaul of society is needed to affect the real changes needed to reduce criminality, but that will take generations and offer no justice or protection to people in the now.

Originally Posted by csmiffy

Our firm in Australia was considering this for hydraulic hoses on our U/G machinery as part of an industry guideline to manage them to prevent burst injuries.
The chips were very cheap-we didn't do it but think it was down to logistics and an industry downturn.
this would only really work if crims didn't know we were doing it or it was in such a place they couldn't se it remove it.
On a conspiracy theory note I also don't like it as then official govt departments could use it to sneak in firearms tracking/registration.
make it mandatory to have one on new firearms etc. I just don't trust them enough for that.

Originally Posted by csmiffy

The ones I was referring to were probably only a couple of bucks if that and would have to be scanned but if we start it some anti will come up with a clever idea and Make it a bit more involved and then look out. very much the start of the slippery slope.
I think it would have to be done as a personal thing so its all different all the time. crims wouldn't know how to sort it but could still be managed, and not big enough that agencies could start "helping" with it.

This' really the crux of it - for my purposes I've been playing with the idea purely as a personal solution that would not be publicized or discussed.... which in effect only works to prove an item is yours, not to find it as others would need to scan the guns to tell if there was a chip there in the first place. Kindof like microdots... good in principle, but you have to know to look. I agree, terrible idea in terms of public policy.

Originally Posted by striker

Why even bother with rfid chips, a slightly modified magnatron out of a microwave can wipe rfids easier than grinding a serial number off.

Still amuses me someone I know kept putting his wallet on top of the microwave, 3rd times a charm for a new chipped visa

It's true - the idea only works if you don't think or know to look for it... which makes it harder to recover them using the RFID because no one would look. Probably why no one bothers to do it




In the past I've thought of some other ideas such as chamber locks - an aluminium or alloy expanding chamber insert that expands when a key is turned. The insert would have recessed carbide teeth so if the insert was pulled or pushed out of the chamber without being unlocked it would bite into the chamber walls and resist being worked free to such a degree the chamber would be toast before it came out. The three big barriers are designing an insert that is fairly universal to fit most actions of a given caliber, make it easy to use, and make it well designed enough that it won't decide to stay locked one day and destroy your gun. A similar idea would be a bore lock that locks the length of the chamber with a coated high carbon steel bar down the bore (coated to avoid damaging the crown, bore or chamber). It could be length adjustable and work similarly to "The Club" steering wheel lock but in reverse. By nature any part of the locking mechanism would be protected by the barrel or receiver. You would have to cut the barrel in half to cut the locking bar, or try to drill it out, which could be dissuaded by using a hardened button in each end. Again, it would require severe damage to the gun before failing. Wouldn't bother a gang banger that wanted an Obrez style bolt action pistol or sawed off shotgun, but would be more of a pain than a basic trigger lock.