A sad day

13grs of powder in a 303 seems like a little bit, do you use a filler or is that powder big and fill the case?

:wtfsmilie:

Well I hd to go look that one up....

Ed Harris articles for reduced loads in Reloading and Ammunition Forum

"The Load" has shown complete success in the .30-40 Krag, .303 British......"

Hmmm...

Alliant Powder - Reloader's Guide

a pistol powder.....

YMMV as they say.

Braver man than I.

regards

Hi Eion

Might I ask, did the broken bolt piece jump out of the action and hit you in the face or did the recoil push it back into your face? You mentioned getting stuff in your forearm and shooting hand. Were those fragments from the break area? Did those come through the magazine well (assuming the mag was out)?

Any chance of more photo's?

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The bolt is hardened, I dont know that they would bend...

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Apparently the bolt can bend is is supposed to be 'the way' Lee Enfield bolts fail - they bend up in the middle 'like a cobra' as someone described it to me. I've never seen a photo of this.



303Guy

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Originally Posted by 303Guy

Hi Eion

Might I ask, did the broken bolt piece jump out of the action and hit you in the face or did the recoil push it back into your face? You mentioned getting stuff in your forearm and shooting hand. Were those fragments from the break area? Did those come through the magazine well (assuming the mag was out)?

Any chance of more photo's?

Apparently the bolt can bend is is supposed to be 'the way' Lee Enfield bolts fail - they bend up in the middle 'like a cobra' as someone described it to me. I've never seen a photo of this.



303Guy

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What photos would you like to see? I was shooting off a bag and was holding it like you would a machine gun. Two hands on the stock left hand overhand grip with cheak resting on it. It was either the bolt or the bits of wood it chipped off that hit my trigger hand but I'm not sure about the other arm. Doesn't make much sense to me. I'm still not sure if it was the unretained part of the bolt sliding back and then returning under pressure of the firing spring or a chunk of bolt. From how hard it hit I'm thinking the bolt slid back.

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What photos would you like to see?

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I'm not sure. Anything there is to see I guess. Photo's of all the parts of the bolt and the action maybe.

This is a most curious event, possibly very rare. Being a Lee Enfield enthusiast and shooter I would really like to know what happened there and naturally whether it could happen again - like to me! I've asked around on another boards and have heard several reports of cocking pieces jumping back quite violently due to a pieced primer and two instances of a 1903 Springfield where the cocking piece shot out the rear of the bolt hitting the shooter on the cheek (like a smack from Mike Tyson) and in the other the firing pin shot through the shooters sleeve and into the brush. In another instance the cocking piece of a No4 pushed back beyond cocking, cutting the shooters thumb. Yours is different in that you say the case was OK and that the bolt shattered. What could have happened? Have you thought of sending the rifle to some facility where it could be intelligently examined and assessed? I know of one group I would not send it too - these people have stated categorically that it could not happen and therefore it did not happen and in my words, "we will bury our heads in the sand and make this go away!" These guys claim to be the ex-spurts!

Thanks for the very interesting thread.

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Originally Posted by ishoot10s

Ok, I'll put my serious hat on. ;)

Imagine standing a length of wooden dowel upright on a hard surface like a concrete floor. It's supported only by its contact with the floor. Now hit the top of the dowel with a hammer. The dowel will likely vibrate, bend, split or fracture depending how hard you hit it. That's what a rear locking LE bolt has to tolerate on every firing because the bolt head is not locked to the breech.

Now imagine the bit of dowel still standing upright, with its base on the floor, but with its top end also held in a vice. Hit that with a hammer and there's not much going to happen except a bit of mushrooming around the top. That's a front locking bolt.

In the LE 303, if its heavily tapered case is given room to move through excessive headspace, it's like a several ton hammer smacking the unsupported top of a slim steel dowel standing on the floor.

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Great "Analogy"!:thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by ishoot10s

Ok, I'll put my serious hat on. ;)

Imagine standing a length of wooden dowel upright on a hard surface like a concrete floor. It's supported only by its contact with the floor. Now hit the top of the dowel with a hammer. The dowel will likely vibrate, bend, split or fracture depending how hard you hit it. That's what a rear locking LE bolt has to tolerate on every firing because the bolt head is not locked to the breech.

Now imagine the bit of dowel still standing upright, with its base on the floor, but with its top end also held in a vice. Hit that with a hammer and there's not much going to happen except a bit of mushrooming around the top. That's a front locking bolt.

In the LE 303, if its heavily tapered case is given room to move through excessive headspace, it's like a several ton hammer smacking the unsupported top of a slim steel dowel standing on the floor.

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Well said ishoot10s. Great explanation.