Semi-automatic guns sold by Defence Force being used by gangs

Sounds like some of those old SLRs are turning up in the the hands of gang members.

I wonder if any were those sold by Dale Jenner or John Mabey?

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/a...ectid=12178046

Semi-automatic guns sold by the Defence Force to the public in the 1990s, are turning up in the hands of gangs and organised criminal groups.

More than 170 military-style, semi-automatic guns had been seized by police in the past five years.

More had been taken in each of the last three years than in any year in the past decade.

In a briefing to the Minister last year police said they were concerned that they had seized military-style guns from gangs and organised crime groups during searches.

They said gangs were starting to use a different type of firearm - the high-risk military-style guns used in massacres in the US.

The director of Otago University's National Centre for Peace and Conflict Studies, Kevin Clements, said these guns getting into criminals' hands was hugely concerning.

He said the guns had a huge lethal capacity in the hands of gangs and could cause mayhem.

"If the police are capturing larger and larger numbers of them then it means this [gangs and organised criminal groups] is where they're actually located."

Firearm owners said an amnesty or seizure of military-style guns would still leave them in the black market.

The Council of Licensed Firearms Owners said it was a problem that military-style, semi-automatic guns were in the hands of criminals but was adamant there were legitimate, safe uses for them when in the hands of licensed people.

Council vice-president Michael Dowling said buy-backs had a whole lot of issues and wouldn't even target the right people.

"So if we took access off those who haven't done anything wrong, removed the firearms from the system and say it's all fixed, we still have illegal importation and the existing stocks."

- Newstalk ZB

Buhhh... Defence force SLR's were select fire tho?

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Originally Posted by Sasquatch

Buhhh... Defence force SLR's were select fire tho?

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No, The SLR's were semi-auto but they had to be further modified to Police specs before they could be sold to the public. The gangs guns were either stolen or purchased before the MSSA laws came into force (1992). The only SLR sales by the Defence Force were in 1988.

And how many SLRs were registered anyway? I bought one, I’m sure it would have been traceable?
E cats are now registered? So is the system not working? They don’t seem to follow up?
Serial numbers? Even ground or filed off, the numbers still there!
Orchestrated beat up I think?

I will bare my buttocks and bend over for big bubba if the firearm in the article photograph was ever owned by the Defence Force. Fuck I hate sensationalist fear mongering media.

Another trash article

Yep, I am with you Rushy! That is a commercial AR15 rifle that was in A category configuration before the bigger mags were added (when found, or just before the photo was taken?), therefore no 'registration' records were originally required. It is possibly one of the gang related 'straw man' purchases of a year or so ago. A search of dealers arms books will reveal the purchaser, but which dealer?

@Rushy @gundoc
what is with you two bending over for bubba?

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Originally Posted by csmiffy

@Rushy @gundoc
what is with you two bending over for bubba?

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I felt it a better than safe bet that bubba was not getting anywhere near me.

It is precisely this sort of scaremongering by the media that precedes unfavourable changes in firearms legislation.
Note the focus on one particular type of rifle.

So did Defense Force SLR'S get converted to semi's @gundoc? Regardless that article was just scare mongering crap...

Gotta make sure they say "military-style" weapons a few times to really brainwash the masses.

The end of the article said it all though!
Interesting what @gundoc said about 88, and the article states 1990s.
Nice also that we get the last say.....himmm wonder when we get the first say?

What a crock of shit

No journo seems to have put their name to it besides "Newstalk ZB"

For shame, I imagine

But “the media” all parrot the same shite as it’s fact - Joe public hears its from 3 or 4 sources.....so it must be real and must be fact. I dispair at the biased shit incapable morons that parade as “journalists”, they either have their own private agendas or they are simply cashing in on the click bait $$. No scruples or morals.

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Originally Posted by Sasquatch

So did Defense Force SLR'S get converted to semi's @gundoc? Regardless that article was just scare mongering crap...

Gotta make sure they say "military-style" weapons a few times to really brainwash the masses.

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They were manufactured as semi-autos and that was the way the Army used them but it was a parts change to convert then to full auto. Before they could be sold to the public dealers had to modify them in a permanent manner as specified (and individually checked) by the Police. That involved grinding out the safety sear bent on the hammer, removing the safety sear and welding a spacer in the slot, and (initially) putting a stop pin on the safety selector. The Police system was not irreversible if you had a few clues, so I did a few mods (which they accepted) which gave a much more difficult system to convert. There were 2500 rifles put up for tender and I purchased 1000 of them. The next biggest purchase was for 400 and all the rest went out in smaller numbers. Being the biggest purchaser I got the best rifles and they arrived in my shop 31 March 1988. I had been at Trentham the day before to supervise loading the container and getting my permit signed. That was the biggest cheque I had ever written at that stage of my life!

Article written by cock face Cahill for a media release. What a giant load of decomposing horse shit. Pics of Chinese AR-15's on the Herald web pages? God this crap shits me!

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Originally Posted by omegaspeedy

Article written by cock face Cahill for a media release. What a giant load of decomposing horse shit. Pics of Chinese AR-15's on the Herald web pages? God this crap shits me!

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Why would the union president be making media releases on behalf of the police?

If you take a deep breath and read the article, it says it's taken from a briefing to the minister last year.

the only SLR which may have left the military into civvie hands was IIRC the one used by jan moolenaar in the napier shootout.one of his so called mates a TFarmy corporal "aalegedly'supplied the weapon and was later corutmartialled and given a dishonourable.

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Originally Posted by gundoc

They were manufactured as semi-autos and that was the way the Army used them but it was a parts change to convert then to full auto. Before they could be sold to the public dealers had to modify them in a permanent manner as specified (and individually checked) by the Police. That involved grinding out the safety sear bent on the hammer, removing the safety sear and welding a spacer in the slot, and (initially) putting a stop pin on the safety selector. The Police system was not irreversible if you had a few clues, so I did a few mods (which they accepted) which gave a much more difficult system to convert. There were 2500 rifles put up for tender and I purchased 1000 of them. The next biggest purchase was for 400 and all the rest went out in smaller numbers. Being the biggest purchaser I got the best rifles and they arrived in my shop 31 March 1988. I had been at Trentham the day before to supervise loading the container and getting my permit signed. That was the biggest cheque I had ever written at that stage of my life!

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Gundoc, I recall back about 30 years ago someone (I think Tony Loughnan?) telling me about an SLR malfunction on a range, it wouldn't fire or locked up or something, then slamfired unexpectedly, emptying a near full mag into the ground. Do you know anything about this story? I vaguely recall it was one of the first rifles on the civilian market, but can't remember details.

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Originally Posted by Maca49

And how many SLRs were registered anyway? I bought one, I’m sure it would have been traceable?
E cats are now registered? So is the system not working? They don’t seem to follow up? Serial numbers? Even ground or filed off, the numbers still there!
Orchestrated beat up I think?

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What do you think about that, @systolic? Is NZ Police negligent?

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Originally Posted by Ben Waimata

Gundoc, I recall back about 30 years ago someone (I think Tony Loughnan?) telling me about an SLR malfunction on a range, it wouldn't fire or locked up or something, then slamfired unexpectedly, emptying a near full mag into the ground. Do you know anything about this story? I vaguely recall it was one of the first rifles on the civilian market, but can't remember details.

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I had not heard about that event but it would be easily possible if someone had tried to alter the trigger pull to the wrong angle or engagement. That could trip the hammer from the impact of the bolt closing, giving uncontrolled fire.

The only reason any SLR's would be floating around the underscum is they didn't get declared when they bought in the whole E cat thing. There's probably a fair number of AK's kicking around as well.

i had a tokarev svt40 (7.62x54) go auto on me . scared the living hell out of me.
luckily i was at a range because the muzzle rise was huge.

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Originally Posted by csmiffy

@Rushy @gundoc
what is with you two bending over for bubba?

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Smell would be worse than shrimp!!:O_O:

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Originally Posted by gonetropo

i had a tokarev svt40 (7.62x54) go auto on me . scared the living hell out of me.
luckily i was at a range because the muzzle rise was huge.

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The rifle and the one in your pants?:D

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Originally Posted by Maca49

The rifle and the one in your pants?:D

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thats more of a howitzer :P

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Originally Posted by gonetropo

thats more of a howitzer :P

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Short sighted, small hands or both..?

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Originally Posted by gundoc

The Police system was not irreversible if you had a few clues, so I did a few mods (which they accepted) which gave a much more difficult system to convert. !

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@gundoc you meany!

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Originally Posted by systolic

Why would the union president be making media releases on behalf of the police?

If you take a deep breath and read the article, it says it's taken from a briefing to the minister last year.

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Because he is a master manipulator with hand in many pies who feeds ideas to many parties. It reeks of him! The reason the minister gets briefed this crap is because Cahill feeds the lies to the right people. Obviously I have no proof but it's a strong hunch.

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Originally Posted by Rushy

I felt it a better than safe bet that bubba was not getting anywhere near me.

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long as it wasn't wishful thinking. Not judging.
If you are locked away we cant have that Waikato you were shouting

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Originally Posted by csmiffy

long as it wasn't wishful thinking. Not judging.
If you are locked away we cant have that Waikato you were shouting

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There isn't a prison in creation that could keep me from a Waikato.

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Originally Posted by Rushy

There isn't a prison in creation that could keep me from a Waikato.

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That's because it is brewed in prison from the sewer pipe residue and then filtered thru the all the prison bitches undies[emoji12]

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by R93

That's because it is brewed in prison from the sewer pipe residue and then filtered thru the all the prison bitches undies[emoji12]

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

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I'll be down your way in a few weeks. You'll have to introduce me to your local swamp swill and try to convert me.

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Originally Posted by Rushy

I'll be down your way in a few weeks. You'll have to introduce me to your local swamp swill and try to convert me.

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I'll look forward to that. I won't try and convert you but will get a laugh at all the looks and suspicion you will get asking for waikato [emoji16]

How long you down for and where mostly. Do I have to have start a reloading session?



Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

waikato is like making love in a canoe
there are far worse beers though like db draught which is so sugary its like an rtd

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Originally Posted by csmiffy

@gundoc you meany!

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Yeah, I know! Seriously, full-auto rifles of that type are a complete waste of ammunition as the muzzle climb is enough to ensure that 80% + will go over the top of the target, it burns the barrels out quicker, and is generally hard on the action. The heavy barrel L2 automatic rifle which was designed for such work was not well-liked and was considered unsuccessful.

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Originally Posted by gundoc

Yeah, I know! Seriously, full-auto rifles of that type are a complete waste of ammunition as the muzzle climb is enough to ensure that 80% + will go over the top of the target, it burns the barrels out quicker, and is generally hard on the action. The heavy barrel L2 automatic rifle which was designed for such work was not well-liked and was considered unsuccessful.

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The only fully automatic rifle I want is one that fires a shot and then automatically does a cleaning cycle just like my automatic washing machine........Or my printer, :thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by timattalon

The only fully automatic rifle I want is one that fires a shot and then automatically does a cleaning cycle just like my automatic washing machine........Or my printer, :thumbsup:

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Nah! printer cartridges are too expensive.;)

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Originally Posted by gundoc

Nah! printer cartridges are too expensive.;)

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That what the work printer is for.....

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Originally Posted by gonetropo

thats more of a howitzer :P

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Pup-tent