What's the deal with Winchester AA Shotgun Ammmo these days ?

I was unsure if this topic falls here, or the reloading forum, so apologies if it's in the wrong place.

Situation is my eldest son and two of his mates wanted to learn to reload shot shells.

Simple, I just dug out my old Hornady Pacific shotshell presses (DL-366 Auto and a DL-105 Single Stage) I haven't used in almost 20 years. Next went to GC and purchased one slab and a few loose packets of Winchester AA 7 1/2-28 Trap. Wow, this now has a retail of $29.99 a box, thankfully they gave me a much better deal, but even then it still want cheap when you consider I only pay $115 for a slab of premium Falcon Trap ammo.

Winchester AA was always generally accepted as the industry standard hull for reloaders, so I didn't think too much about the price, safe in the knowledge the young guys would get about 10 reloads from each hull.

Ok move on several weeks, and the young guys have shot off all the ammo, so it's time to start reloading.

It was at the first stage of resizing I came across the first problem. Some shells easily sized, others clunked and ground like there was sand in the resizing die. After stripping and cleaning the sizing die, we proceeded again with the resizing, only to find the same issue occurring.

After a detailed inspection, it was clear the hulls were the original one piece form hull, so no issues there, however some hulls were clearly malleable, others seemed to have a more brittle and rigid plastic. This however shouldn't cause an issue with sizing. It was at that point I decided to run a magnet over the bases, and was surprised to find some were Brass bases, other were steel bases. From prior knowledge, Winchester AA was always Brass based.

Next I checked the ammo boxes. The boxes were identical, with the only difference being batch numbers. All other markings on the hulls were also identical. It appears the few lose packets were a different batch to the slab.

Sent an email off to Winchester agents, but haven't had a reply yet (in fairness to the agents, it's only been 3 days).

Can anybody cast any light on what's going on with Winchester AA ammo these days?

Personally, I'm very reluctant to attempt reloading the steel based hulls, or even if they can be reloaded?

Bottom line, I'm pretty unimpressed with Winchester

I was talking to the president of my local pistol club recently.

He said that in his opinion the overall quality of Winchester ammo has gone down significantly, compared to what it used to be .

falcon is in cheddite cases,easy to reload them... pretty sure gunworks are still selling them new and primed for not a huge price. MOST of the clay loads you will find are in cheddite hulls now. as for winchester....not sure why..be interested to hear what reply you get,if I was a betting man the reply will be supply pressures led to changes and as very few people reload anymore it hasnt been an issue before .....will watch with interest.

I'm guess your probably correct, and I'll post when she get a reply from the Winchester Agents.

I usually just buy Falcon trap ammo at Gunworks, as reloading shotshell is not really worth it with prices being so low. Though the costs of steel shot are pretty high, so reloading may prove cost effective if you're out bagging birds all season.

Main reason was my son and his mates wanted to learn reloading shotshell, and I guess they are the future of shooting sports in NZ, so for me it's a case of helping the next generation to learn and keep the sport alive.

Xpat, my reloading gear mostly makes black powder cartridges now. The falcon trap load cases appear fine and last 2or 3 reloads, Ive even sucessfully loaded with wads that are pickups as well just for interest. As to economics its not worth it unless its for a sub gague or you are making 12 bore slugs or buckshot.

Ive loaded a few steel loads up for shits n giggles....a 1oz load zipping along at 1600ish fps kills very nicely and isnt hard on shoulder....VERY hard on ears if you forget earmuffs.

love the aa,s in 20 gauge 9,s for quail
seldom buy from guncity as he,s so pricey.

My last batch of AA's I reloaded from once fired were not great. I threw out roughly 30%. I had issues with the recrimp cracking out and I do use an old MEC 6750 Grabber to reload.

Thinking the press was out of spec, I grabbed some older 1x fired AA hulls, and they reloaded flawlessly.

Once I work through this bunch, I am not sure what to do with hull supply.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Xpat

I was unsure if this topic falls here, or the reloading forum, so apologies if it's in the wrong place.

Situation is my eldest son and two of his mates wanted to learn to reload shot shells.

Simple, I just dug out my old Hornady Pacific shotshell presses (DL-366 Auto and a DL-105 Single Stage) I haven't used in almost 20 years. Next went to GC and purchased one slab and a few loose packets of Winchester AA 7 1/2-28 Trap. Wow, this now has a retail of $29.99 a box, thankfully they gave me a much better deal, but even then it still want cheap when you consider I only pay $115 for a slab of premium Falcon Trap ammo.

Winchester AA was always generally accepted as the industry standard hull for reloaders, so I didn't think too much about the price, safe in the knowledge the young guys would get about 10 reloads from each hull.

Ok move on several weeks, and the young guys have shot off all the ammo, so it's time to start reloading.

It was at the first stage of resizing I came across the first problem. Some shells easily sized, others clunked and ground like there was sand in the resizing die. After stripping and cleaning the sizing die, we proceeded again with the resizing, only to find the same issue occurring.

After a detailed inspection, it was clear the hulls were the original one piece form hull, so no issues there, however some hulls were clearly malleable, others seemed to have a more brittle and rigid plastic. This however shouldn't cause an issue with sizing. It was at that point I decided to run a magnet over the bases, and was surprised to find some were Brass bases, other were steel bases. From prior knowledge, Winchester AA was always Brass based.

Next I checked the ammo boxes. The boxes were identical, with the only difference being batch numbers. All other markings on the hulls were also identical. It appears the few lose packets were a different batch to the slab.

Sent an email off to Winchester agents, but haven't had a reply yet (in fairness to the agents, it's only been 3 days).

Can anybody cast any light on what's going on with Winchester AA ammo these days?

Personally, I'm very reluctant to attempt reloading the steel based hulls, or even if they can be reloaded?

Bottom line, I'm pretty unimpressed with Winchester

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go talk to barry foster at the stihl shop in blenhiem Rd and get hold of some of his "HULL' DTL trap ammo-trust me you wont be disappointed!

I wonder if the steel hulls are from same batch as the duck load steel batches.....99.999% of that will never get reloaded so it makes sence to use a cheaper hull