Dog training problems and answers

Yeah run them both at the same time Wirehunt.
Tia is the 1 that does it more, Pippa I think just follows her sister.

Ruff - I'm not trying to let them chase anything, that's the point. How do I not give them exposure to anything without taking them for a run? I don't understand that.
I can't help it if they flush a hare, and I can't control other dogs/people at the park.

They only do it when free running and ahead of me by a short distance.
They don't even show signs of wanting to do it when on a lead.

When at the local polo grounds/dog park I make them sit/down and wait if/when another dog person comes close. And only when the others have gone do I let them get up again. If the other dogs come up to them I am normally holding their collars so they cant' get away. If they get up they get a sit command and a squeeze on the rump if they don't sit.

It's the stop command I am trying to teach them.
If I don't use a long lead, how do I do it then?
Cheers for your assistance ;)

Any serious training should be one on one. You'll find the dogs much more responsive to this. Even if it means halving their time so be it. But two at once especially at that age is very hard to win, or more to the point, do any kind of serious training.

Yeah I was starting to think I needed to run them 1 at a time.
Will try that then and see if that helps.

Still after some advise on the best way to make them listen to a stop command too please.
Do I try to get them good at the stop command at a closer range and then gradually let that distance go out further?

For me the stop command starts when they are at heal. If they can't stop then there isn't much chance at other times.

one should point out as i already have many methods works for different requirements as many dogs have gone onto to perform well in the feild or on the trial paddock with inadequate trainers -dogs are intelligent enough to grasp a bit also -in saying that if there is a better way to do it as Ruff has alluded to -as they say at Nike -Just Do It !!

Gidday All,

First post here on the forum.

I have been reading these dog threads with interest and thought I would chime in with a few questions to poke it along.

A little about myself. I have two GSP’s, one male, one bitch. I am starting to do more and more wing shooting. I have access to quail, rabbits and ducks currently. I have only ever hunted over my male. Male is two years and head strong as all get out. The bitch is 10 months, quite soft but still subtly stubborn. I have gone through the full circle of food rewards, games etc. to get the result I want. However as a few of you may have already guessed, behaviour/ obedience problems still exist.

I now realize, the best type of discipline for a dog, is self-discipline. I love & respect my dogs and am prepared to put in the time and effort to get them to where they need to be (as biddable members of my pack). No doubt the problem lies with my ability and knowledge as a trainer.

So here are a few questions that the answers to which will help immeasurably.

1. What is a reasonable consequence/ punishment for deliberate disobedience to a command. I have been chaining them up (isolation) away from the pack for a little while.

2. My bitch loves to jump up on people. To me this is disrespectful and needs to stop. How would you convey to her that what she is doing is wrong, and what consequence would you put in place for continued no compliance.

3. How do you teach a dog to have a solid walk at heel. My male knows where he needs to be, however is very inconsistent to the point you have to call off the walk before you explode.

I’m sure I have more questions but these will do for now.

Cheers,

James
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Originally Posted by Stoney

Gidday All,

First post here on the forum.

I have been reading these dog threads with interest and thought I would chime in with a few questions to poke it along.

A little about myself. I have two GSP’s, one male, one bitch. I am starting to do more and more wing shooting. I have access to quail, rabbits and ducks currently. I have only ever hunted over my male. Male is two years and head strong as all get out. The bitch is 10 months, quite soft but still subtly stubborn. I have gone through the full circle of food rewards, games etc. to get the result I want. However as a few of you may have already guessed, behaviour/ obedience problems still exist.

I now realize, the best type of discipline for a dog, is self-discipline. I love & respect my dogs and am prepared to put in the time and effort to get them to where they need to be (as biddable members of my pack). No doubt the problem lies with my ability and knowledge as a trainer.

So here are a few questions that the answers to which will help immeasurably.

1. What is a reasonable consequence/ punishment for deliberate disobedience to a command. I have been chaining them up (isolation) away from the pack for a little while. depending how far you are from the dog will be how effective your punishment will be .If the dog is close a verbal chastisement should let the dog know you are not happy -its what dogs do to each other also with a growl or body language .If the dog is at distance I personally would use an E collar -in fact I am putting one on my dog tomorrow after todays session in the parkas he went a few times with not answering his whistle on the first peep - disobey instant stimulation -stimulation is such a nice word for instant electric shock .An e collar dummy will need to be worn also so the dog thinks you can always touch him at distance or up close also with or without the real collar being worn

2. My bitch loves to jump up on people. To me this is disrespectful and needs to stop. How would you convey to her that what she is doing is wrong, and what consequence would you put in place for continued no compliance.Paw squeeze , E collar , verbal chastisement - see what works and run with it

3. How do you teach a dog to have a solid walk at heel. My male knows where he needs to be, however is very inconsistent to the point you have to call off the walk before you explode. E collar -always effective "if" used correctly !! While on a Lead use a a crop to swat his nose if he progresses in front of you or change direction and knee him in the ribs -kindly so as not to hurt him but keep him guessing which direction your going so he doesn't get the knee in the ribs

I’m sure I have more questions but these will do for now.

Cheers,

James
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I hope this helps to some degree -Ideas some may work for you some may not

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Originally Posted by Stoney

1. What is a reasonable consequence/ punishment for deliberate disobedience to a command. I have been chaining them up (isolation) away from the pack for a little while.
This is a wide open question and really does depend on the crime.

2. My bitch loves to jump up on people. To me this is disrespectful and needs to stop. How would you convey to her that what she is doing is wrong, and what consequence would you put in place for continued no compliance.
Kick her legs out from under her when she does it, and you don't need to be gentle when you do it and the reverse too. It will only take a few times...

3. How do you teach a dog to have a solid walk at heel. My male knows where he needs to be, however is very inconsistent to the point you have to call off the walk before you explode.
I assume that a solid walk at heel is right behind you, or right in front? A stick, when they move from that spot a tap. You don't have to belt them hard, just a tap to remind them to wake up and get back to the spot. If he still plays dumb then onto a lead.
I’m sure I have more questions but these will do for now.

Cheers,

James
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E collars, they work BUT you've got to know how to use them and they need to be used so sparingly or else you end up having to put a dummy one on them all the time. Every dog has a different level of tolerance to them and the only time I ever use full power is stock proofing....
Yes I have got them, but if they get used once every two weeks then they have had a workout and this is running 12 dogs.

Im have to say Wire hair -full power to me would be tantamount to torture -but I agree with you about using them sparingly .If you use it to incorrectly youll get a dog that wont leave your feet . We have all made E collar mistakes in the early days of using them and I have had one for 12 years now .

I have put an E collar on my neck once on a high level and instead of pushing vibrate I pushed you know who -IT WAS NOT NICE LOL . I use at most 1/4 power and could never see an animal needing more than that -its not just uncomfortable it bloody hurts.

I dont like the Ecollar for that reason but if you start real low you will find a power that the dogs recognizes very quickly and you need never go higher .

why cant I edit my above post -the spelling fairies have got into it and fully retarded me

You typed it El borracho !

You got any video footage of that E Collar around your neck ?

youd go to hospital with split sides if you had seen it !! Seriously one should check collar strength on ones self before using in on the mutt -I personally think these devices should be Licensed !!!

Thanks for the input guys.

I have a Dogtra E-collar but dont think i have the use of it down. My male knows when he's got the collar on, so that kind of fucks the whole idea of it for me.

Simple solution Stoney -leave the collar on him but turn it on only when working or training -do not6 let him get the upper hand otherwise you might be wearing that electrical device before long :thumbsup:

Ha ha ha, yeah, they may have me worked out.

We can't leave collars on our male as our little bitch chews the buggers of him when they play fight. I need a couple of dog runs i think :)

Yep, or a couple of chains which is my preference when I can. Just letting them off the chain can be a good learning experience, making them wait till your good and ready or else they don't get off ;)

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Originally Posted by Stoney

Ha ha ha, yeah, they may have me worked out.

We can't leave collars on our male as our little bitch chews the buggers of him when they play fight. I need a couple of dog runs i think :)

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Yep, you should have got runs instead of the collar... :( E-Collars can be used but my opiniuon is trhat by the time you know enough to use one properly you know enough to train without it. I am on limited internet at the moment but I will try and give some of my thoughts on this in the next few days.

Ruff,

Looking forward to it. I have gone right back to basics (again) with both of my pointers. Sit means sit until you're released etc. long road ahead i think.

Cheers

James

Just remember JAmes, they are still pups.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stoney

Ha ha ha, yeah, they may have me worked out.

We can't leave collars on our male as our little bitch chews the buggers of him when they play fight. I need a couple of dog runs i think :)

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Yes, to stop the play fighting if nothing else.
:D

"Both methods fall apart because when the chips are down the wheels fall off. The "perfect agility" dog taken to the beach with kids, beach balls, other dogs, seagulls etc when let off the lead forgets every lesson it ever learned in its life"

Geez do I know how this feels!
I withdrew from "obedience type" training with my springer as he was gone if I didn't have a bag of treats or a short tight lead. There was even talk of rubbing dog roll on your pants to assist with heel work hmmm? No thanks. Back to basics for me!
There is some really good info here!

Brian, can I ask where you bought your cap gun that you mentioned in your first post??
I am thinking of getting one.

probably best get one from Lion country supply

Blank Firing Pistols / Starter Pistols and Blank Ammo

Any issues with customs or firearm import? Did you need any police involvement since it is pretty much a gun?

I have no idea and I dont know if it is considered a gun as such -you will need to send them an email to ask for advice me thinks .You can possibly purchase one here from Young's airguns plus the primer caps -Id do that first!!

Cheers Brian, I'll check it out

Ask at your local sports shop for a starter pistol. I got ours thru stratasports.co.nz

Dropping and sitting was mentionsed earlier on in this thread.
I am training a HWV at the moment and I have just changed my method of teaching the drop. It is done in the context of feeding time. I set the food down in front of the pup and say "Hup" pushing him to the floor with a slightly backwards and down motion. I'm eighteen stone and he's 10 kgs so it's no contest and is actually easily achieved without too much effort or force required. When I have him down I make him wait fifteen seconds before release to eat. I'm now in my second week with him and last night for the first time he dropped without being touched though he did try to come up to the sit but it took only a finger tip to put him down again. I'm going about it this way and eventually I'll make him wait a full minute with the result that the release will change form a release to a command to move.

I did have another method that worked for me but recently at the trials in England I had a friend's pup on the lead. Another handler told one of his dogs to sit and Uno more or less collapsed on the floor. Not only did he drop like a stone but he was relaxed about the whole thing, sitting there looking round him and not showing the slightest inclination to move. It seems to be working for me as well so I persever with this new, for me, way.

always good to here others methods !