When I move from Auckland and become mortgage free Im going to spend a little time down there --let my dogs run huge ..............
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When I move from Auckland and become mortgage free Im going to spend a little time down there --let my dogs run huge ..............
Stunning places to be seen and explored, El B...best coffee is at Winton!!!
Went down last season for the spaniel trials and took a wire,just in case.
The place is no different to the north island in the fact you have to find the birds, however there are a lot of good pockets of them, lots of ground game and I saw a shit load of pheasants in places, even had a bit of a run on a preserve.
I think live game trials can easily be held, however the rabbits make if far better suited to versatiles.
The duck shooting is like going back in time to when the north held decent numbers.... And yep back again this year.
Where in the general vicinity did you locate your self there Kawhia ?
Hahaha, how hypocritcal! I recall you running down the Versatile Testing systems without even having seen them, let alone run in them! Oh what a short memory some people have.Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
I think there is only one Preserve that the Spaniel folk Trial on in the SI, the rest of the trials are primarily on rabbits.Quote:
Originally Posted by EeeBees
please post those comments as I have always backed the testing systems -please do !!!!you know you have been wrong before .....Hypocrital you say hahahah GQ hypocracy would be you slagging tweed when being the most elegantly tweed dresser in New Zealand hahahah :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by gqhoon
I do remember you running down the versatile system aswell, something along the lines of the dogs not being tested against other dogs
Here you go then....despite your alleged 'support' of Testing and having never seen or participated in it, you suggest that it is inferior. In actual fact, it is simply different in terms of how people make use of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
Me wearing tweed has never been in dispute. My offense (and that of others) is from when you say others look like 'ditch diggers' simply because of what they choose wear.Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
As I said , I never said the test were not worth it just without a comp I thought they mean less in my opinion ! I should clarify that though! To test and not run against the other dogs to compare what youve tested in a competitive feild seems less impressive to me !Not to say that the dog wont perform perfectly well against other but we will never know will we
Ditch diggers look like ditch diggers for what they wear ... where yours gripe with that ? does it bump your ego -harden up.The way you write things is like media spin bent and twisted
Petros ,what is it you like about what GQ said exactly ??
The objective of Testing is completely different to Trialing. Just because you don't understand the difference or the objective of Testing, doesnt make it (Testing) or the results from it of lesser value.Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
your past comments are coming back to bite you brian...... you never got the idea on versatile testing then so I would avoid revisiting it.
lets be clear about this !!! I have always been pro testing -always !!!I do understand it and have always agreed with it just dont think it goes far enough to pit the tested dogs against each other in a competitive feild that shows strengths and weaknesses on the day .Yes Kawhia they are useless points not worth revisiting agreed !!! GQ dont bring them up again please as they serve no purpose other than to cause contention .HAHAH Mind you I do enjoy a little debate now and then lol
:P
if you did understand it you wouldn't then put your own opinion in the same paragraph as you still included the wining element.
Fucking hell man, keep me out of this....Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
FFS... I'll unlike...
I disagree with you on this Kawhia but thats just my opinion .To do a test to see if the dogs does understand is great ! to put him and handler under pressure against others is another story in itself .In saying that only one can ever win but you soon start to get a clear idea how things are coming along -good -bad or ugly . I am a competitor and believe in competition as a positive , is there a reason I dont understand you see compition as not needed ?Even when I ran a GSP years ago we competed trailing -retrieving -pointing live birds .At that stage the testing programes were being talked about and we eventually had the Late Claus ... from Germany come over to cast his opinion .Hats of to the tests I just think you could go further
It doesn't matter how many times you claim to understand the purpose of Testing, or how much you claim to support it, your own comments / opinion on the subject show for all that you clearly do not understand it. I really can't say it any clearer than that.
I say this smiling GQ --Yes its very hard to understand -possibly a university degree :wtfsmilie:
One other point I would use to promote the competition is for breeding .The dogs that are mostly likely to be imported and also bred to are the ones that have a consistent family history of winning .I think that is a fair and reasonable reason to breed providing the dog has no physical faults .
Under a trialling system the only way to tell which is a better dog is for the two dogs to compete against each other. Under a testing system you can tell which is better without the dogs ever meeting.
WOW . You guys should come and school up the pointer and setter crowdQuote:
Originally Posted by stug
No, you should come to a NZVHDTA test and see what the difference is.Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
What I hope to see is more versatile s running in competitions which I know in time they can compete in if entered ! I would definitely go to a test to watch -when is one on the north island in the Auckland region ?
Probably not till late in the year, November.
Post and let me know as I will certainly make an effort to go and watch -always a good day out doing dog stuff .In saying that my opinion stands about competing especially with live game or braced trials , but thats just my opinion !! The most important thing I think we can agree on is doing either will help to improve breed and skillset of our dogs !!!
is that the guy they bought out and had him go judge a dog show ? it's talked about even today.Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
they do go a lot further after testing...... that silly thing called hunting.
Its along time ago Kawhia -Possibly 15 years ago and I cannot remember exactly what we did at that stage but Im sure it was when Gail was wanting to get the German testing system into NZ . Yes of course they hunt but even 3 legged mutts can do that . I dont really understand the resistance to your tested dogs going further and competing braced against each other or with the Pointer Setter comps ??
there is no resistance in regards to moving into a trials format, but lets make it interesting and forget about pigeon traps and follow the spaniel model and shoot live rounds and live targets both furred and feathered.
will such a trial impact the current pointing games the same way live game spaniel did to the range find and flush... yes it will.
versatile pups out number the uk specialists pups 500 to 1 in this country.
the numbers are more like a 1000-1 in hindsite
Yes I think it would be brilliant to go to shooting live game -if only we had the areas and game to for fill this dream it would again put a greater tests onto all dogs !! Numbers of fashionable breeds means little to me , next year it could be the pug ...............
For you guys doing the tests to then run braced live game trials would surely increase your fold and show which dogs consistently perform in a competitive situation .It is as you know Jason alot of fun .. well hard work if your not an athlete haha
first you need the right game........trap hunting is not it.
and second you need enough of it....Quote:
Originally Posted by kawhia
And more to the point , you just have to do with what you have if you dont have the perfect situation ! And if that means using trapped birds it is better than no bird at all ! and if you cant shoot them for real well pretend . The alternative is to do noting at all
maybe you need a pug to compliment the tweed.....Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
Actually, no!! There are things that we can do...1953 was when the sensibilities of those watching were aggrieved to the point that birds could not be shot at trials...why not bring about a change...if the spaniel guys can shoot vermin rabbits then why can we not shoot vermin pigeons...Quote:
Originally Posted by el borracho
The tests run by the Versatile Hunting Dog group, I believe should be recognised by the NZKC and other such places...if you can get a 'decoration' for having your dog jumping into water or for dancing to fecking music by the NZKC for pity's sake, why not a versatile test placement...but I believe for us to truly test our dogs both trial and test would be fantastic...they do it in France...
yep why not Ees!id be for it . But until that day we will use what we have
you could put a cord on my neck and I could be the pug if I eat any more sweetys :oQuote:
Originally Posted by teFerrarri
I must say what I do like about the the testing system is that it does aim at reproducing better breed dogs that have proved in a test their natural ability under the stipulated criteria .To pass those tests cannot be easy especially given the range of skills tested .
Any test that aims high for a goal of producing high levels of health and natural game hunting ability and not forgetting temperament will always leave a positive effect on a breed.
I do look forward to a few days observing a few dogs going through them later in the year
to have those scores and results recognised by nzgta and the nzkc would require questions answered about the judges who would then need to be passed by nzgta for approval, not a big issues as some of those within the club are P/S judges.Quote:
Originally Posted by EeeBees
the main issue which has hampered the clubs growth is it's creator/secretary/convenor/grand pooba who threatens to pull the plug when her position is threatened, despite it having it's own committee and president.
if the club was to be more answerable to the nzgta which it would be if the push to have the results put on the pedigree then a more democratic system would need to adopted.... I am sure there would be an influx of interested ex members and regular tests weekends.
the risk of being voted out of her own club could be the main reason why she has not pursued the issue perhaps.
Is it a major to forget that club and start your own?and move forward with like minded people? I do realize the hardships of the club scene -often more talkers than doers and is often why we shouldn't criticize those that have been the doers!!
no it wouldn't be a major, in fact the past president left to start his own club, despite that being the reason why the club had a convenor..... he tried to run his new club the same way as the nzvhdta and got booted out by his own membership along with a few others that jumped before being pushed... now that's how clubs should be run I reckon.
the nzvhdta can be bigger than what it is now, and I still endorse it with my kennel, the lack of doers in recent years has seen little happening until recently in the north island but hopefully things will change now that gail is doing a lot of the work.
having a target to aim for in regards to having the scores and prizes put on the pedigree would move it into the main stream.