Pointer and Setter Trials

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Originally Posted by GSP

You need to be careful Jason.

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GSP , I have no dog in this debate and my position from my past posts should be clear . Out of interest what are the differences in what your club offers to what the others that appear displeased with the current system want ? Rather than have unpleasant verbals going back and forward it would be good to know what is offered and not offered in the current system .
I am surprised others other than Kawhia havent actually piped up and mentioned these things given what an obvious perceived failure in the current system and leadership .Bad vibes never solves anything only reason that others can consider :thumbsup:

The dog section...back to how it should be. Fuckin luv it

funnily enough I have noticed only when controversy arises the viewing numbers rise and posts flow .Stir the pot for a action hahahah

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Originally Posted by el borracho

I agree with you there Kawhia just not the language used . Censorship creates a cloak and dagger situation which is just a corrupt way of doing things.
Take a position and defend it with reason !!it may be different than others but at least its understood and available for others to understand and consider .

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in the spirit of keeping it civil.
the cloak and dagger situation couldn't be more closer to the truth.
how far off the mark is the club run compared to others under the nzgta ?
I know of no other that operates under the control of one person ?

Section 1. The VHDTA was formed in 2003 by the Convener.
Note: No change to VHDTA Objects or Test Regulations may be made without prior approval of the Convener until such time she deems this
clause unnecessary for the preservation of the values of the VHDTA.

is this position even valid to be affiliated with the nzgta and the nzkc.
makes a mockery of the whole process that if the convenors position was to protect the integrity of the club and working versatiles as a whole and to stop membership fragmenting off to form similar clubs, she along with a past president were the only ones to actually do that, and thus the vddnz was born..... and full credit for the committee in that club for smelling a rat and acting on it, how many members of the vhdta knew they were providing testing support for another club for instance ?

I do not believe the country needs another testing ass, it needs to tidy up the one we have already.
if it was to operate correctly then spring and autum tests would have to run each year regardless of how many dogs show up.
the results and scores would be kept and recorded by the nzgta, and as such the nzkc would be able to add them to the pedigree.
this would incur a levy to both nzkc and to nzgta, the same way field trials operate.
the convenor role needs to be removed and the club needs to move forward, make it more open and transparent.
in my own opinion moving into HPR trials can only be done if the education and testing is done first to get the dogs up to a workable standard.... even the spaniel club are starting to use hunt tests days to get people into the sport.

It doesn't sound unfair Kawhia although one would have to hear the vision and reason for the current situation to have a full understanding of the situation .
If Margret agrees to share that with this area of the forum I am sure those that read this would be some what the wiser .
At the end of the day though she has done extensive leg work on the current situation and created with others a support structure for her vision not yours -like it or not and she doesn't deserve to be maligned so harshly because she doesn't choose to steer the club in the direction that some disagree with .
What you describe of the authoritarian dominance doesn't sound ideal in my mind and my own club doesn't act like that as far as I am aware .We have meetings as a group at the trials and vote for the good of the club as a democracy .

If I am not happy with what is said well I am not happy and I can always choose to fly the roost !! From many years of being around both the GSP and Pointer Setter clubs I do know there are people who with out them there would be no club as there are more moaners and arrive and leave people than there are those that take on the burden of work to make sure the clubs run at all -and I would rather be put out a little than not have a functioning club even if it didnt suit my exact needs as it wasn't personally set up around my personal wants .

If you have the support for such system that you want I again say be a doer and implement it and let those that agree with your vision support you and do the work required to create an ongoing system recognized by the nzgta and the nzkc --- the problem you may face is there is more moaners than doers ....... sadly

Sadly the VHDTA is Margret's baby and she will never let it go and put in place rules to ensure that. personally my belief is that that group is held to ransom, has so much to offer to the NZ Gundog world and is held back by her apparent agenda to maintain her flagship role. It's really sad.

I wish she could see the bigger picture. 30 years ago I founded the "Wellington Flyfishers Club". I did bugger all... I called and organised the first meeting, chaired the club for six months, turned up when I could, when i moved from the district I came back when i could as a guest speaker. 30 years later it is the biggest flyfishing club in New Zealand and I'm proud of that. I'm proud of my life membership. i didn't have to control every meeting, every twist and turn to have had an influence, that was left to people with time, inclination and purpose, which frankly, I really didn;t have. I really wish Margret would do that for the VHDTA let it go to the people with the passion for the dogs, the format and it's applicability. As it stands it's become a total joke and she's lost the opportunity to be the elder statesperson who started it all. really sad. The principles have a huge amount to offer. I'd love to see it fixed and moving forward, let's face it more people hunt with versatiles than anything else and in general all of those breeds are in a shocking state.

farrrrk you on calming meds ;) now I enjoyed reading your opinion - that is how an alternative view should be written without anger and full of your reasoning .cheers

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Originally Posted by el borracho

farrrrk you on calming meds ;) now I enjoyed reading your opinion - that is how an alternative view should be written without anger and full of your reasoning .cheers

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I was off the meds when I wrote that, just took some so get f****d :yaeh am not durnk:

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Originally Posted by EeeBees

Do you guys see the push to rejuvenate the All Breeds Lands and Water as being worthy...should we all, on the count of three (so to speak) enter our dogs and blitzem!! And one monumental question I want to ask anyone who will discuss it is, if we are bracing our pigeon trials in the North Island, and you need six challenges for the usual unbraced pigeon trial, why cannot the championship be less challenges to qualify in the braced trials due to the format? Is the demarcation unfair...? I know the winning dog is still the winning dog, but...??

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I love your concept, but it cannot work. Sadly the pigeon trial circuit now days is somewhat incestuous so the judges are "part of the crowd". Simply they will not let any thing new come along and upset the playpen they have created for themselves.

I know i don;t help or endear myself to them, but that horse has bolted. We would all have better dogs if they stopped being so petrified of new input.

Everyone must have gone to the Live Game P&S trials today. @Pointer will be wearing board shorts & t-shirt @el borracho will be over heating in his tweed suit & @teFerrarri and the ditch diggers will make an appearence. I put my $$$ on a red dog to win.

wish I was there...:oh noes::):TT TT: Sad day knowing my Falcs and I not being part of it...hope he's giving the birds up there gyppo!!!
UU, I see your $ and go two more its a PPPPPPPPP....oint....er...one of those!!!!

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Originally Posted by el borracho

how many entries would you think acceptable Ees ?6 seems a minimum to me to even want to drive somewhere

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El B, I was meaning challenge points for a title...not entries...

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Originally Posted by upnorth uplander

Everyone must have gone to the Live Game P&S trials today. @Pointer will be wearing board shorts & t-shirt @el borracho will be over heating in his tweed suit & @teFerrarri and the ditch diggers will make an appearance. I put my $$$ on a red dog to win.

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being naturally cool I had no heat issues, Pointer was as you said and Teferrari was baby sitting . Bummer today no winner! We had a few birds -one missed on a beat by Pointer and Inti , bird away with Failte and Archilles and Petros but couldn't be judged as as out of view and an upwind flush at the end.Another day tomorrow with a novice trial

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Originally Posted by EeeBees

El B, I was meaning challenge points for a title...not entries...

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i think its fair at 6

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Originally Posted by el borracho

being naturally cool I had no heat issues,

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Your tweed makes you naturally uncool! :cool: