Thread: What would you pay for a pup?

100 bucks more than the SPCA and trademe dog rescues charge. I don't believe that 2 pedigrees and 2 x fifty cents equals a dollar so I don't really see the point in spending thousands on one.

Originally Posted by mopheadrob

Hi all.

We’re considering breeding Sacha, our 2 year old lab / vizsla cross. We haven’t done this before but are under no illusions about the time, cost & risk involved, so we’re trying to decide if it’s worth it.

She’s a gorgeous dog with a strong hunting drive and has been a dream to train. As she’s not purebred we will probably look to put a vizsla or vizslador sire over her so the vizsla traits don’t get watered down too much.

As Sacha is a first cross (F1) from two different breeds she will exhibit hybrid vigor ( heterosis ). If she is crossed back to one of the parent breeds or a cross made from the parent breeds in whole or part, the offspring will loose the hybrid vigor. Crossing to a third and unrelated breed will maintain and increase the HV.
As pure dog breeds have a high inbreeding co-efficient, outcrossing to other breeds is a good idea and will in most cases produce a hardier, longer lived, more vigorous and all round better utility type dog than the pure parent breeds

Originally Posted by Moa Hunter

As Sacha is a first cross (F1) from two different breeds she will exhibit hybrid vigor ( heterosis ). If she is crossed back to one of the parent breeds or a cross made from the parent breeds in whole or part, the offspring will loose the hybrid vigor. Crossing to a third and unrelated breed will maintain and increase the HV.
As pure dog breeds have a high inbreeding co-efficient, outcrossing to other breeds is a good idea and will in most cases produce a hardier, longer lived, more vigorous and all round better utility type dog than the pure parent breeds

Good theory but its not true in every case, as you say..

If you want a healthy long lived dog the best idea is health checks on the parents.. Backyard breeders rarely [if ever] do this, responsible breeders do.

Originally Posted by sore head stoat

Good theory but its not true in every case, as you say..

If you want a healthy long lived dog the best idea is health checks on the parents.. Backyard breeders rarely [if ever] do this, responsible breeders do.

we got burnt with our cocker...my fault entirely,rushed into it,bought from folks who looked OK,parents looked OK...but dog was more or less blind within 6 years had more loose skin on head than average undocked cock..... he was brilliant dog but VERY hard on a gundog when they can no longer see a bird go down 20 yards infront of them....
Ive always had crossbred mongrels and no real health issues...touch wood.
$200-600

Originally Posted by sore head stoat

Good theory but its not true in every case, as you say..

If you want a healthy long lived dog the best idea is health checks on the parents.. Backyard breeders rarely [if ever] do this, responsible breeders do.

It is an in-arguable fact that heterosis masks genetic faults in a first cross. The cross of two very good fault free purebred lines will give very good results. But where are the fault free lines ? Greyhounds and Border Collies ?
None of this is 'Good theory' it is proven fact. Remember Gregor Mendel and his crosses of sweet peas from high school lessons. It has been know for a long time

Originally Posted by Moa Hunter

It is an in-arguable fact that heterosis masks genetic faults in a first cross. The cross of two very good fault free purebred lines will give very good results. But where are the fault free lines ? Greyhounds and Border Collies ?
None of this is 'Good theory' it is proven fact. Remember Gregor Mendel and his crosses of sweet peas from high school lessons. It has been know for a long time

It does not mask genetic faults completely , it gives the 50/50 offspring a reduced chance of genetic faults.. second paragraph ?

https://www.dogbreedinfo.com/article...osiseffect.htm


However again I would say that getting health checks done by a vet and only breeding from dogs that are known to be free from any problems greatly reduces your chance of what happened to me with my first dog .

Originally Posted by sore head stoat

It does not mask genetic faults completely , it gives the 50/50 offspring a reduced chance of genetic faults.. second paragraph ?

https://www.dogbreedinfo.com/article...osiseffect.htm


However again I would say that getting health checks done by a vet and only breeding from dogs that are known to be free from any problems greatly reduces your chance of what happened to me with my first dog .

The real work on breed crossing is done with plants and livestock esp pigs and chickens. The author of the article would perhaps benefit from reading some of this research.
Again I ask, which dog breeds are free of genetic faults ? Not many, so crossing to produce a more healthy longer lived utility animal is often a better path than breeding pure lines unless those lines are very very good and of a foundation stock standard. In livestock and plant breeding, very productive pure lines are maintained and used to cross and produce the plants and animals we consume as food.

That's why I thought my Huntaway should have been pretty healthy but he ended up with diabetes which was a right pain in the whatsit

Originally Posted by Moa Hunter

As Sacha is a first cross (F1) from two different breeds she will exhibit hybrid vigor ( heterosis ). If she is crossed back to one of the parent breeds or a cross made from the parent breeds in whole or part, the offspring will loose the hybrid vigor. Crossing to a third and unrelated breed will maintain and increase the HV.
As pure dog breeds have a high inbreeding co-efficient, outcrossing to other breeds is a good idea and will in most cases produce a hardier, longer lived, more vigorous and all round better utility type dog than the pure parent breeds

having been kicking around with a couple of pighunters lately,the discussion has come up.
one runs dogs only..so he is screwed and has to buy in any new pups or find someone who likes look/ability of his dog and wants litter from thier bitch. now the fella who runs mostly bitches has much easier time...he finds a dog he likes look of and abilities of with something extra he doesnt already have with his bitch and takes her along when in season and lets nature do the rest.... when litter arrives,picks 2 pups for himself and on sells the rest...proven pig dog bitches litters arent all that hard to move on to new homes but prices wont do much more than cover cost....
he then keeps his 2 pups and spends the time with them and hopefully one turns out a cracker and the other half decent...he has continued his "line" of dogs and the older bitch gets a few years hunting with her pups before retirement and the pups take over.
we intend to one day breed from Poppy..when Meg goes to the big duck pond in the sky....and will consider options of sire very very carefully so we get something better than we have..be it smaller,less hairy,quieter,less barky,more bitey,more ducky (good luck finding anything more feather driven) or more deer inclined .....wont be for some time yet.
cant rush these things as you will have pup for 10-12 years if you make a dud,your stuck with it.

In short, stay away from 'designer dogs'. I really hope the crosses are healthy.

As MOA is conveying....

The theory is a statistical outcome. You would be more likely to have interbred problems by staying within a breed, than by crossing out of it. That assumes of course that you are making an informed cross about optimising outcomes with the selection of the introduced variety.

The above statement is just wrong by implication if informed choice is sound. A broader gene pool is more desirable in general that a narrower one is.

That of course doesn't mean that people aren't stupid, greedy, or incompetent about such things...

If you’re doing it only for the money 100% don’t do it. If you’re doing it because your absolutely need a pup from your bitch well there’s your answer. I’ve had multiple litters and it’s a lot of work and a big expense to do it properly and when dealing with animals the only way. Good quality food for both mum and pups , parvo , worming it all adds up and that’s without any complications. It only takes one person to muck you around And you can get stuck with a pup for longer than expected which equals more time and money.
Not trying to sound blunt just trying to put it into perspective.

Depends on the dog. From what I’ve seen, there appears to be little relationship between how expensive the dog is and how useful it is on the hill.

I paid $800 for my gsp x lab. I’ve got more than my $800 out of him in value. That’s about as far as I’d go if I was to get another.

I got a 9 month old gsp/lab cross bitch off a guy who had a change in circumstance , for $100 and a bottle of wine for his girlfriend.

The dog is a work in progress but Im happy at that - although our last three purebred labs have been rehouse deals as well .

Originally Posted by winchesterM69A

and a bottle of wine for his girlfriend.
.

You got his girlfriend for a bottle of wine she can’t of been that good looking for that price

Originally Posted by mattstr

You got his girlfriend for a bottle of wine she can’t of been that good looking for that price

Might have been really flash wine.