Thread: Seriously underrated 6.5x47 Lapua

Originally Posted by Gibo

F-Class .22 by any chance?

I don't understand what you mean? 6.5x284

Originally Posted by Tentman

Follow through is vital. A rifle moves about 1/16" before the projectile leaves the barrel. Can't avoid the laws of physics . . .

Not questioning the laws of physics, but are you saying you grip the rifle and hold it to prevent that 1/16" movement?

I'm not over selling those groups. Clearly everything went right and I did bugger all (Crzyman did the load development) beyond lie down behind the rifle. It was a still day and we walked the round onto the target and shot groups because it was miles to the targets. Any forum member who has been to one of my LR shoots will recognize the target stands. Clearly everything went right.

My question is, if it is a concrete principle and if the laws of physics say you must control the fore-end and follow through (still not sure what this means), then how is this possible? How can everything go right (frequently) even off makeshift rests, if a critical part of marksmanship is being ignored?

Originally Posted by Tussock

I don't understand what you mean? 6.5x284

I was taking the piss a few here would claim that group at 1100 with their .22

Originally Posted by Gibo

I was taking the piss a few here would claim that group at 1100 with their .22

Big Gav amused himself no end and probably did the barrel life no great favors by hunting blow flies with that rifle. I wanted 140s but he loaded 130s because they were freakish.

Originally Posted by Wingman

Oh man.. who left that closet door open again?

Did some one say WITCH

Originally Posted by Tussock

It may be a concrete principle, but I have seen vastly better shooting from people who don't bother. If people are shooting 5 shot round bug hole groups from field rests with no fore end control, what are you expecting to gain?

How is it vital if people are shooting extremely well without it?

These are two three shot groups at 1100m from my old Savage F-Class. This is about 6-12 months after I abandoned trying to control the fore-end. When I tried to control the fore-end, this is what my 100m groups look like.
Attachment 105916

I can only credit the people who taught me to shoot as before that I was hopeless, but those groups were shot leaning over the back deck of a flatdeck ute. Unless you can come up with a concrete reason, I will stick with being in awe of the concrete principles they taught me.

You miss understood me. I am not saying it is critical to follow thru or hold the fore end. I rarely do either.
Totally agree with you on most parts.
Some people can break most of the principles and shoot awesomely. Just the way it is.

What I meant by concrete is that it is a principle of marksmanship.
I will also bet dollars to donuts you follow thru to an extent without realising it.




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Originally Posted by R93

You miss understood me. I am not saying it is critical to follow thru or hold the fore end. I rarely do either.
Totally agree with you on most parts.
Some people can break most of the principles and shoot awesomely. Just the way it is.

What I meant by concrete is that it is a principle of marksmanship.
I will also bet dollars to donuts you follow thru to an extent without realising it.




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Like I said, I don't know what you mean so I can't say one way or another. I want the cross hairs to come back to where they started, is this what you mean? Unless it is a field shot and I'm all twisted up. Realistically you should be able to shoot left handed lying on your back twisted round a tree stump and if you get the important stuff right, still get what you want.

I definitely want the rifle to recoil and return to the same point of aim, or at least field of view.

Should add that with 6.5x47 burning no more powder than it needs, I could self spot with my heavy hunting rifle at 100m on quite high magnification. A Sako stock and a heavy over barrel suppressor help. Little recoil.

Lets see if my new straight stocked sporter weight 7mm Rem Mag with its pencil thin barrel changes my tune. Could only get 175g factory loads locally

Yup. That's pretty much what a follow thru is. Watching the foresight or crosshair after the shot.
If position and everything else is right, your sight picture should return to where it started.

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Tussock I do believe you have answered your own......query ??? in the last two lines..... for sure you can get away with a hell of a lot with a light recoiling heavy rifle.... try it with something that has a bit of boot and the results could be vastly different....YES there are alot of people out there who can shoot very well off a bipod without forend support BUT you can bet your bottom $$$$ thier rifles were sighted in this way and they have taken a bit of time to get that bipod in as stable a position as possible...not always an option in field conditions...I cant deny that in its place it works...but Im buggered if I can see how with a rushed shot in less than ideal conditions it can..to use your own exzample "left handed on your back twisted around a tree stump" now tell me how you are going to get a bipod rested on flat surface to allow the" return to battery" that we are talking about when saying follow through????

Wow this thread has gone off topic

Originally Posted by winaa

Wow this thread has gone off topic

Up to our necks in tussock

Originally Posted by Gibo

Up to our necks in tussock

Casual reminder this place started with a few specific gripes. One of which was the obsessive tendency to keep threads on topic. No one could ever explain to me what the point of this was. Someone will pop in and put it back on topic, or it will drift into the apocalyptic heap of abandoned threads in the background. Someone will start another 6.5x47L thread.

The idea of forums is discussion. The "KEEP THE THREAD ON TOPIC" people can be seen to kill/damp down discussion as a matter of routine. You want threads to go off topic and get as many pages total as possible.

Forums are killed by: policing content as if you are creating some important database of critical information
Forums a double killed by: people doing what @gimp is doing. Fatigued senior/long term member telling the new members not to bother doing what they did for the last decade.

You are up to you necks in Tussock. If you want a strict set of rules ask admin for them, but they seem to have stuck with our initial plans, with great success.

I was again taking the piss, not like I have never derailed a topic Hell its my specialty

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

Tussock I do believe you have answered your own......query ??? in the last two lines..... for sure you can get away with a hell of a lot with a light recoiling heavy rifle.... try it with something that has a bit of boot and the results could be vastly different....YES there are alot of people out there who can shoot very well off a bipod without forend support BUT you can bet your bottom $$$$ thier rifles were sighted in this way and they have taken a bit of time to get that bipod in as stable a position as possible...not always an option in field conditions...I cant deny that in its place it works...but Im buggered if I can see how with a rushed shot in less than ideal conditions it can..to use your own exzample "left handed on your back twisted around a tree stump" now tell me how you are going to get a bipod rested on flat surface to allow the" return to battery" that we are talking about when saying follow through????

I'm not a beginner. I have owned and shit a few things, many of them hard booting. I don't mind, but I don't like the stock characteristics of this 7mm Rem Mag, I would usually avoid them. I'm going to leave it un-suppressed so I can maintain my ability to shoot uncomfortable things, not create it. Like I said, we will see how I go.

You seem to have missed the part where I said I DONT OWN A BIPOD!

While I actually have a box of them, I don't use them anymore. Getting the tension in the legs even on anything less than a perfect surface is a huge pain in the arse.

I also said that in the "left handed on your back twisted around a tree stump" I would expect the "return to battery". I said I would expect to make the shot, if I did all the other bits right.

What I am talking about is natural point of aim. I want the cross hairs to rest naturally on the target, while my body is completely relaxed and the only muscles with any tension at all are working the trigger.

As I understand it, you are trying to physically control the movement of the rifle under recoil. I would have liked to know if @Tentman intended to stop the 1/16" muzzle flip before the projectile left the barrel. If so, the laws of physics say he can't stop it completely. So can he reduce it. My question is, can he reduce it by exactly the same amount every time?

Guiding the rifle back to its starting point is one thing. Physically controlling the rifle to prevent it from moving to some degree is another.

How do you do this with no tension to be found anywhere in your body?

Originally Posted by Gibo

Up to our necks in tussock

I don't take anything personally. Just more shit talked