Thread: Ballots. Rigged or not

Pengy they flood the ballot with no consideration.
I'm not saying exclude them but limit them as they do overseas and charge more like fish and game has finally done for a non resident licence.
At the moment we as NZers are missing out on our own back yard because of the ballot flooding.
That is not right no matter how you look at it. They don't pay if they need rescue. They don't pay ACC.
Pay for a guide who has concessions and public liability.
That money helps the economy and employment better than just the free ride they get now.

I am not saying that I agree with the way things are R93, as I don't have experience on the ballots.
Maybe we we should be looking at how NZ is marketed to overseas visitors as a whole, not just hunters.
The powers that be tell the rest of the world how Wonderfull and freely available our great backyard is, so they come here expecting a free ride.
They get a big surprise to learn that it is going to cost them to use the great walks and huts I can tell you.
So maybe the marketing needs tweeking a bit.
I agree with making some insurance mandatory for visitors who are going to possibly need a chopper ride etc. But then this country doesn't even require road users to have insurance, so I don't think we will be seeing that one get off the ground any time soon.

Ban overseas people from the ballot blocks, they have plenty of other options to go hunt tahr, leave our wilderness areas for us, it's our back yard, we deserve to be able to use it


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Just limit them would be fine to say 20% blocks for overseas. Let's be honest tahr are dumb goats ballots only let you land a chopper in them. Just walk in amd go nuts when ever we like

All party members names to be listed amd show up. But it's not that policed you could turn up amd fly into any block almost after if no one got dropped in them.

Originally Posted by R93

I am wanting to address the current format with DOC but pretty sure if I do it alone my issues will be filed in the rubbish bin.
I have never petitioned or tried to change anything political and have no idea how to be taken seriously when I try.

Good thread topic, interesting read.

Petition what exactly?

The starting point is to establish what you want changed without any speculation, so asking for the protocols/ policy involved in the ballots is the initial move.

Then you need to ask specific questions such as the total numbers each year applying (10 years worth??) and the frequency that individuals are successful and perhaps the block allocations, and nationality. (privacy issues will be cited to deny actual lists/ names)

From there you may derive the information you require to come back to the hunting public seeking a cause for change (survey) An example statement and question might be- person A has won a block 5 out of 7 years while person B has not been successful in 12 years-

-Do you think this a fair distribution of the resource?
-Would you support a stand down period of 3 years after a successful ballot?

Another example might be- Of 62 block allocations 47 went to parties which contained people who did not contribute to the management of our public resource by way of tax.

-Are you happy international hunters remove opportunities from resident hunters?
-Would you support an international hunter ballot fee of 10 times that of a resident?

As far as ballot probity you might like to offer vulnerabilities in current policy and offer suggested changes to enhance the chance of equal distribution of opportunity. Once policy is obtained a group think tank like this is advantageous in identifying areas of exploitation.

Research. Give examples of fairer systems in place e.g. some US states do not allow non (state) resident hunters as they do not contribute to state taxes (let alone international hunters). How are block distributed elsewhere?

Collation of facts, public perception and suggestions may then be used to push for change (if that is the leaning). Remember there isn't a big base that would oppose a quest for the most integral fair system possible so resistance shouldn't be strong but government organisations often feel duty to oppose and draw out information gathering exercises or public led change. Be patient and smile.

***Note my example questions are based on information read on this thread and are not fact.

Good post Tim Allen.
Splittin hairs slightly here, but the question of nationality could be a tad tricky to police. I.E. I myself am a UK citizen with a uk passport, I could face exclusion on that basis, despite having resided in NZ for ten years as a house owner and taxpayer.
Semantics I know, but thought it worth a mention.

Originally Posted by Pengy

Good post Tim Allen.
Splittin hairs slightly here, but the question of nationality could be a tad tricky to police. I.E. I myself am a UK citizen with a uk passport, I could face exclusion on that basis, despite having resided in NZ for ten years as a house owner and taxpayer.
Semantics I know, but thought it worth a mention.

That would be a fair point of consideration for the think tank to structure into any new offering. Me personally I would make the rule 11 years of residency gives you residential consideration. Only a year to go Pengy

Ballot structure and transparency would be my start point- but I was just offering some constructive direction for those with the inclination to try and make improvements.

Don't worry Pengy I would happily take you Thar or Chamois hunting, even if you are an overstayer😆

Originally Posted by Pengy

Good post Tim Allen.
Splittin hairs slightly here, but the question of nationality could be a tad tricky to police. I.E. I myself am a UK citizen with a uk passport, I could face exclusion on that basis, despite having resided in NZ for ten years as a house owner and taxpayer.
Semantics I know, but thought it worth a mention.

Don't want to ruin your life mate .
But you have lived here for ten years ?
Sorry but you are a Kiwi.

A resident is a resident and is entitled if working and paying taxes or is the partner to a NZ citizen to hunt and enjoy our country.
A tourist should not be entitled to hunt or access our public land thru a ballot.
Let them pay for it thru a guide .

I think a few would disagree with that first paragraph mate
The point I guess I was making, is that the policing of such a policy would be tricky to say the least.


PS;I get reminded on a regular basis that it takes at least 50 years here before I even qualify as a Pomwi

I vote @R93 for Conservation Minister, why not start at the top.

Originally Posted by Pengy

I think a few would disagree with that first paragraph mate
The point I guess I was making, is that the policing of such a policy would be tricky to say the least.


PS;I get reminded on a regular basis that it takes at least 50 years here before I even qualify as a Pomwi

At least we can understand you, some I have met (poms) speak something but it sure isn't English

Originally Posted by Blaser

I vote @R93 for Conservation Minister, why not start at the top.

I would second it but think he may have a bias toward venison recovery, which is preferable to 1080 and search and destroy but....

Originally Posted by Pengy

I think a few would disagree with that first paragraph mate
The point I guess I was making, is that the policing of such a policy would be tricky to say the least.


PS;I get reminded on a regular basis that it takes at least 50 years here before I even qualify as a Pomwi

A valid, and New Zealand issued firearms licence would be simple proof of residency to some extent for the purposes of ballot applications.
Wouldn't help a bow hunters out much though.
You'd assume nearly every NZ hunting resident would hold a valid drivers licence too, no? In regard to vetting residency status.

Originally Posted by Blaser

I vote @R93 for Conservation Minister, why not start at the top.

Ha Ha......I wouldn't last a week!

After banning aerial 1080, helihunting during the Ballot period, closed off the Whakatipu whitetail area for a few years, reintroduced a possum bounty.
Then limiting Waro operators I would probably be shot😆