Thread: Farmer lying about paper road?

Originally Posted by DavidGunn

I might get caught out then as one particular corner is where the local dope smokers park and spark up, nice spot as they have a clear view for a couple of km's down the road, I call the spot "Tissue Point" but that's another story.

Anywhere near "condom corner"

Originally Posted by hdc

This is going to be an unpopular opinion, but here it goes. I reckon the farmer is well within his moral (although perhaps not legal) rights. We have a paper road running straight up the guts of our family farm straight past the woolshed and yards and once you let one person through, you let them all through. We have had poachers up there dumb enough to posts photos of themselves on our placeon facebook, 4wd'ers ripping through stock and leaving gates open letting stock loose. It is a real pain in the arse. It may be legal access on paper, but it is not always practical access.

I agree that poachers are scum and ruin a lot for everyone. I'm not sure if 4WD access is a legal requirement on paper roads? But, the "legal" paper road is there. Anyone purchasing a farm should have this pointed out by their lawyer.

Originally Posted by hdc

I realize this will wind some people right up, but I am coming at this from the perspective of the farmer, rather than the person wanting to go up the public road. All they are trying to do is make a living off the land, and there is nothing worse than having to try and shed off ewes and lambs in the paddock because some idiot has gone for a wander up the paper road and left the gates open, boxing up the mobs. When people head up the paper road in their little Skoda hatchbacks because the GPS said they could go that way, and you have to tow them out of a bog you wouldn't even drive the hilux through, it starts to annoy. I realize that legally you may have the right to go up there, but that doesn't mean you always should. You know the saying, once bitten twice shy. That is how most farmers feel about public access, after a few fuckwits ruin it for everyone else.

If I owned a farm with a UPR I would have signs up, clearly mark the route and try to work with people to avoid crap. Yes you are trying to make a living....BUT you have a "legal" paper road running through your farm. If I was to use it, I would contact you first. Give you my details and probably a box of beer to say thanks. Shame more people don't take this approach.

Originally Posted by erniec

Taupo Deer Stalkers battled for years over Poronui now it doesn't seem to be an issue to make it work.

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Thats because it was tested in court. NZDA won!

Originally Posted by BRADS

Again Tahr best post in this thread.
And most people that posted seem to wonder why farmers won't let them through but read the responses.
We have a fairly heavily used paper road through our farm that a few forum people use regularly, yes the gates locked thats because if you slide of the track in your car and die its on us, but your welcome to walk it anytime,
No the council has never maintained it thats all the farmer.
The other fact that no one's caught onto is often the "paper" road on a topo map is actually miles from the actual paper road something some of you should keep in mind, some paper roads have also been swapped with Doc for access around boundaries after bulldozing and maintenance all at the cost to the farmers.
The hate on farmers here recently is hard to take and yet you wonder why you can't get onto farms.....

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Yet you purchased a farm with a legal paper road on it. Best thing ANY farmer can do with a paper road through their farm is clearly mark where you want people to walk. If you have gated/fenced for public safety...put a sign up. 95% of people will treat you right.

Originally Posted by Taupohunter

Yet you purchased a farm with a legal paper road on it. Best thing ANY farmer can do with a paper road through their farm is clearly mark where you want people to walk. If you have gated/fenced for public safety...put a sign up. 95% of people will treat you right.

Year but that 5% can make days of extra work for you though out the year by been dicks how hard is it to shut a blood gate one area I go has lots of cyclists go through & has a big sign That say keep gate closed but it's amazing how often you come along and it's wide open the 1st one leves it open for his mates to shut but his mates come along and see the gate open must be meant to be open so they leave it open & that's the gate between the private & doc land so we always shut it

Been there had that problem a few times 2 mobs of ewes boxed up ours and the station next door over a days yard work to separate again paper road with big sign to always shut gate and I dont know how many times if found it wide open

I have mate that had an access track to the ruahines and when doc were been queer he shut it down and doc threatened an cajoled ect.
He was legally entitled to close access and after the stories I have heard I can't blame him for shutting it down.
All I can say there are some very entitled cock heads that fuck it up for the the good bastards.

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Originally Posted by 7mmwsm

Don't forget to mention that parts of the poled route are not on the actual "paper" road, which the owners allowed due the terrain being quite difficult for walking.
And that a number of hunters and fishers tried legal action to get the legal road opened up to vehicle access back in the nineties. Which would have had a detrimental affect on the area.
So land owners aren't always pricks, and hunters don't always do what's best.

They did get that old Fordson tractor in and I imagine is still 'in'

Originally Posted by BRADS

There is never a more accurate statement some road end farmers are the biggest fuckstains I've ever meet and a embarrassment to the rest of us.
But there in the minority and I feel the farmer hate here is more than a minority.

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Hahaha i can think of at least one who fits the cunt bill just perfect

I have one as well 199p,i see Federation Mountain Clubs are relaunching there same as SH1 campaign which is the way it should be.

Stocky how are you getting on with your paper road access issues? Persevering with it or given up on it and put it into the to hard basket?
One would think/hope where practical these paper road issues could be resolved hopefully mainly at the point of sale of the affected property so that perhaps there could be a win win situation for every bodies sake? But human nature is what it is?

For the farmers who read this...Many years ago i met a farmer, land worker around inland Northern Hawkes Bay who said to me with a big smile on his face "I been here for twenty years and i've never seen a deer yet" I told one of the local farmers about it and he told me if his father found out about it he wouldn't be very happy. I have always wondered / expected if that farm worker would end up being a politician?

Not to hijack this thread but any one had issues / experiences with private roads? Reasons....I have looked at a sign posted private rural road and it doesn't make any sense a road that long road is private? It must require on going bridge / wash out maintenance with very few people living there to being economically viable....a unnecessary cost to those involved? Would council rates be any cheaper if the road was non private? Still, one could suppose they get less deer poachers up that private road being private than a public road

Good luck to anybody who is in the market to buy a property with private / paper road issues and other on going land problems as mentioned in this thread?

Originally Posted by Taupohunter

I agree that poachers are scum and ruin a lot for everyone. I'm not sure if 4WD access is a legal requirement on paper roads? But, the "legal" paper road is there. Anyone purchasing a farm should have this pointed out by their lawyer.

It doesn't need to be pointed out by a lawyer.
If somebody is to purchase land that has a paper road then it works like this, essentially the purchaser is purchasing not 1 but 2 parcels of land!
The purchaser is buying lot "A"
The Crown or Local Council (public) own lot "B"
The purchaser is buying lot "C"

The purchaser doe's not own lot "B" that segregate's lot "A & C" but may be able to farm it if given permission which they usually are as the LG/C then does not have to maintain.
Under law, they can not refuse public access to/through that land!

Anyone that says otherwise either doesn't understand the law of the land or are lying for their own benefit!

My thoughts only, but have been down this road several times.

Same as SH1' campaign re-launched for unformed legal roads

https://www.stuff.co.nz/timaru-heral...k9Uzku5Vqbs-RA

@Stocky (and anyone else), if you're on Facebook, join "Recreational Access and Paper Road Information for Hunters" (https://www.facebook.com/groups/815522488518099/)

Lots of good discussions, links and examples. I'm the admin.

As mentioned earlier in this thread, it appears the burden of proof in any trespass case will be on the farmer.

The difficulty (for both parties) in determining where the boundary of any ULR is is there are inaccuracies in any survey, and these inaccuracies compound with every step of the survey process. Take a look here.
https://www.linz.govt.nz/data/geodet...eight-accuracy

So, while doing your best to follow the centerline of the ULR as shown on WAMS, you may off the ULR, but it would be up to the farmer to prove it, and that would require the boundary to be accurately surveyed, instead of just relying on a (possibly 150 year old) digitised map.

I'm not a WAMS rep or anything, but if anyone wants to talk about specific cases, I'm happy to assist, as I have access to a few useful mapping tools. Haven't been for a hunt in over a year, and essentially stuck in Auckland, so not interested in your spot.

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