Thread: Half cock or safety

Originally Posted by Moa Hunter

The only safe gun has an empty chamber. Hunt with an empty chamber and learn how to load a round silently and quickly once game is close. Then stalk in to the shot with safety on or 'Half open Bolt' cupped between thumb and fore-finger.
As the old adage goes ' All the deer ever bred, dont make up for one man dead'

Oh boy oh boy have I got a senario for you...... I play this one out on regular basis witH new shooters
I will open rifle and demonstrate it is empty and lean it up against tree then turn back walk a few yards away and take a leak..while Im attending to this ,my brother in law reloads rifle and puts it back in same place...I zip up turn around,pick up rifle which I "KNOW" is empty and say loudly"this has an empty chamber I can point it where ever I like and pull trigger its safe,then point in safe direction and pull trigger..the more folks yell and argue its loaded,the more I push back..."I just fuckin unloaded it ,its safe"...BOOM

THEN say...."and that is why you ALWAYS treat every firearm as loaded at all times"
broken open/bolt removed is safe......anything else is treated as hot to trot untill physically rechecked.

If safety systems on rifles didn't work we would all know about it. USA is the home of litigation and if there was any chance a safety on a rifle didn't work as it was supposed to everyone would get their arse sued off.
I happily hunt using the safety on my T3 and am totally confident in it.
I also personally know of someone who pretty much shot their arm off when a "half cocked" bolt on a M77 MK2 closed in thick bush and the trigger was caught on something.

Originally Posted by Shearer

If safety systems on rifles didn't work we would all know about it. USA is the home of litigation and if there was any chance a safety on a rifle didn't work as it was supposed to everyone would get their arse sued off.
I happily hunt using the safety on my T3 and am totally confident in it.
I also personally know of someone who pretty much shot their arm off when a "half cocked" bolt on a M77 MK2 closed in thick bush and the trigger was caught on something.

yeah the same is true for airplanes, cars and nuclear power plants, they would have stopped producing those if occasionally one of their components failed right?

I might as well grind my safteys off just one more thing to catch cant say as if iv ever used one . Have lost a round to in a tikka rather loose the round than knock it closed . But tikkas dont have a factory half cock so to speak browning xbolts have a fantastic half cock my saum has a decent but not awsome halfcock so I tend to chamber my rounds when needed . As kids all our rifles were mauser action styles where we would chamber the round point at ground hold the trigger and test fire then it was just up down with the bolt and bang

Originally Posted by Kelton

I might as well grind my safteys off just one more thing to catch cant say as if iv ever used one . Have lost a round to in a tikka rather loose the round than knock it closed . But tikkas dont have a factory half cock so to speak browning xbolts have a fantastic half cock my saum has a decent but not awsome halfcock so I tend to chamber my rounds when needed . As kids all our rifles were mauser action styles where we would chamber the round point at ground hold the trigger and test fire then it was just up down with the bolt and bang

Yep. And the old three oh was cock on close, so forward to lock when ready.As an aside, one of the most useless safeties I ever came across was on an Anschultz .22 Magnum. A brand new one. Would fire with a firm squeeze. (I didn't find out the hard way. I like to check these things.)

New guns safety 100%,

If they fail now days (safety mechs) they are open to court cases that could bankrupt them (company) or, remove their brand from an entire market! (trust laws).

Safety mechanisms are guaranteed and subject to challenge in court under failed circumstances.

There is too much for them to lose in countries that have regulated laws like us (and many others)

Safety with all guns, except lever action where I leave hammer down while hunting.

Originally Posted by rockland

Safety with all guns, except lever action where I leave hammer down while hunting.

Not really true with a BLR as the hammer is not lowered onto the firing pin but held 5mm or so above. If you drag the hammer back and let it go before it’s fully cocked/engaged it will fall back to that 5mm above position.
If you have you pull the trigger at the same time it will strike the firing pin. Don’t know if this would fire the round as I’ve never had the nerve to test if.
But the above is just to say that not all firearms are made the same

Had an experience with a guy with a anschutz hornet, keyed up and ready for a shot, false alarm so slinged it over his shoulder and didn't realise it was on half cock, bolt closed, rifle went off about 4 ft from from my ear the the bloody thing was right behind his, hell of a fright. Don't if he has stereo listerning ability any more. For me it's use the safety.

Half cock is an outdated generational hand me down, just like yards.

Half cock for me and only close on firing. One thing I notice on many US hunting vids is how regular it is for hunters to cock their rifles, apply the safety, sling the rifle over their shoulders and go hunting for the day. Often in some pretty gnarly country, like mountainous mule deer country. It always makes me feel a bit squeamish!

As an aside.... When I was at primary school (pre 1976) we were shown an old black and white firearm safety film. One of the clips was someone firing a rifle at a 20 litre clear plastic bucket of water and watching it explode in slow motion. It really highlighted to me the dangers of a firearm. It still sticks in my brain; so it must've made a helluva impact on me as a youngster. Can't really imagine that happening in schools today...

Mickey sorry you're incorrect but I do admit we are arguing semantics around the definition of cocked. You are referring to a hammer gun being held in the half cock position by the sear.
A bolt out of a rifle has a cocked firing pin in it (unless you de-cock it of course). If inserted into the action and closed, without depressing the trigger, it will be held in the cocked position by the sear. The sear is not needed to be "cocked" it just functions to hold it in that position until you fire.

I think the 1/2 cock was a "thing" when every man and his dog used old milsurp 303's which cock I believe on closing.

Your primary safety is your trigger finger and muzzle direction awareness assuming you only load the chamber when you expect rifle to be immediately ready to go "bang" which is not when you are walking behind your mate for example.

The only reason why you may choose NOT to trust your modern rifle/modern safety is if you or someone else has tutu'ed with the trigger to make it "better"

hammer is held in full cock position by sear on a hammer gun...unless you have trigger pulled

..yes spring is indeed under tension when modern bolt is in that position but the striker is prevented from DROPPING by bolt body UNTILL handle is turned therefore hanging that brick/hammer/striker in the air ready to drop..the leg on angle sort of thing.....when I release my bolt springs for storage,I rotate the striker into the fired position I cannot do that without ROTATING the striker/end of bolt....

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

hammer is held in full cock position by sear on a hammer gun...unless you have trigger pulled

..yes spring is indeed under tension when modern bolt is in that position but the striker is prevented from DROPPING by bolt body UNTILL handle is turned therefore hanging that brick/hammer/striker in the air ready to drop..the leg on angle sort of thing.....when I release my bolt springs for storage,I rotate the striker into the fired position I cannot do that without ROTATING the striker/end of bolt....

Yes I agree, in all cases something must hold the firing pin in the cocked position. What that is or how it is achieved is irrelevant to its status as cocked.