Lunch Thread

[noboots]

@noboots I agree with you to some extent. Nutrition that that is relatively high in fat and protein with a low GI index works great while sedentary, or when low to moderate intensity exercise is involved. You tend to feel full for longer and end up consuming less calories overall compared to a higher carbohydrate diet. You also refer to fasted training, which I’ve done quite a bit of in the past. Fasted training is a great way to reduce body fat and it also “trains” your body to more efficiently burn fat as an energy source when glycogen levels are running low. But not all of us have high body fat reserves. During a heavy block of training my body fat would be under 10%, and elite endurance athletes are obviously a lot lower than that in the middle of the season (4-6%, which isn’t healthy long-term). But when it comes to high intensity exercise, complex carbs are still king. If you’re burning 700-1000 calories/hr, a bit of cheese and salami very few hours wont cut it. You will crack and hit the wall hard as you become hypoglycemic. And I never said “people stop functioning if they haven’t eaten for 45mins”, that’s bullshit. But if you want your body to perform for extended periods of medium to high intensity exercise, you will need complex carbs and you will need them regularly, end of story.

Fair comment and well done on 10% body fat. I am still trying to get under 28%.

[7.62]

Fair comment and well done on 10% body fat. I am still trying to get under 28%.

Ha ha the sub 10% body fat was a couple years ago, it’s a bit higher now!

[Hiawatha]

This is a cracking thread. I have a high metabolism and would get hypoglycemic when younger quite easily when working hard. Many years the doctor told me to eat complex carbs regularly. Whole grains. I have never been big on or enjoyed processed food or lots of sweet stuff. I am a savoury guy. Given how much I eat that is just as well. My metabolism has slowed down with age but I still need to eat. I cant exercise on no food for long. For a quick hunt for a morning I love cashew nuts and also I have got in to the habit of grabbing the baby food sachets. Easy to squeeze one in to my mouth and carry on another couple hours. Lamb and kumera flavour etc. Not really flash cold, but gets you over the hill. A mate also put me on to wraps with a bier stick rolled up in a cheese slice. I make them in camp and cram four in a zip lock bag. Them plus nuts gets me through some really big days. They work a treat, last well and are light and easy to carry. Love em.

[The bomb]

Usually stock up on high fat biltong,nuts and wraps,does me for a day hunt .

[Moa Hunter]

The OP asked about lunches for hunting. There is a difference between day hunt lunches and lunches for multi-day hunts. I like the idea of the wraps and would never haver thought of them without this thread, so thanks to the guys that put that idea forward. For single day lunch it can be simple and doesn't matter if the nutrition is not ideal imo. For example a mate and I did a big walk up a gorge for fishing opening day. We took 1 loaf of Vogals fruit bread and a jar of peanut butter and a bag of supermarket trail mix. Simple and was plenty for two blokes for a 18km round trip. Not what I eat for lunch day to day. Peanut butter is not really a great food long term (peanuts are legumes not nuts) but for me is better than cheese on the hill which has me looking for water. A mate passed the comment recently that it seems silly to take dehy food on a trip where water has to be carried in to reconstitute the dehy.
What foods can we put into wraps that is easy to digest and provides high sustained energy and easily digested protein ?

[Dama dama]

Great thread. For day hunts or over-night trips (which is all I seem to get these days), I take some pre-made peanut butter (Bay Rd, best peanut butter in the world!) sandwiches, some nuts and dried fruit, maybe some blitong/yerky and a fresh apple. Gives me a nice mix of good fat, protein and complex carbs without too much sugar.

[wtd]

Try dehydrating your own bananas and kiwi fruit.

[Dama dama]

Dehydrated bananas are the best!

[noboots]

This is a great thread very useful ideas to get our teeth into. I am with 7.62 on this one though noboots. Using Carbs to provide energy during a period of high demand. The longest lived populations have diets comprising complex carbs, Low Fat, raw fruit, raw green vege and low protein so carbs can't be bad. The Glycemic index of 1000 foods has some revelations - most fruit is quite low on the index relative to Glucose because the predominant sugar is Fructose. It is those Sucrose loaded foods that send insulin levels up and down along with Pasta / wheat flour, white rice etc. But there are good carbs. Some foods are hard to digest like preserved meats and foods high in Lectins the preservatives and Lectins both acting as enzyme inhibitors.

I think that this is a complex multi dimensional problem so doesn't have a simple answer. I would add a couple of things into the mix. Long lived populations that don't eat carbs do exists. Two examples would be the Intuit and Australian Aboriginals. Intuit lived exclusively on fish and marine creatures. The closest they would get to a carb is moss which was likely more about vitamins and minerals rather than any significant carbohydrates. They lived a hard physical life in the hardest environment on earth and their health only went to crap when they started eating processed western food and then it went to crap very quickly.

Aboriginals were a little different as they lived in a place that could grow crops, they just didn't need to as they were perfectly in tune with their environment. With no significant agriculture they ate wild food gathered from their environment which lacked a significant source of carbs. Like the Intuit their health was good until we improved it with western food and it's now turned to crap.

Does all this mean that everyone should live on fat and avoid carbs like I do? The answer to that is no. Humans are adaptable omnivores and despite my two examples you would be able to find many examples of agricultural societies that live long and healthy lives. I guess my point is that there are two major energy pathways in humans (fat and carbs) and both are valid ways to fuel yourself. One thing of note that while there are healthy vegetarian populations around the world there are no healthy vegan societies. Humans are omnivores and are designed to eat at least some animal products. If your ethics don't agree with that then take it up with evolution.

Regarding sugar, fructose and the glycemic index. It's important to note what it does an doesn't measure. It does measure the rise in blood sugar caused by certain foods. It doesn't measure the rise in insulin or the amount of calories that you take in. A food that causes a rapid rise in insulin isn't going to cause a spike in blood sugar (because the insulin lowers it) but it is going to make you fat, sleepy and get type 2 diabetes.

Regarding types of sugar. Sucrose is a combination of fructose and glucose. Fructose is fruit sugar. Glucose is the type of suger that is in your blood and is the most available energy source for the body. The conventional wisdom is that Fructose is better because it has a lower GI. Hidden in this fact is a horrifying truth. Glucose is absorbed directly into the blood. Fructose is adsorbed by multiple organs including the liver. What this means is that fructose is like a homing missile for your liver. Most overweight people already have fatty liver syndrome so eating fructose is just jamming more sugar directly into an already overflowing liver.

For anybody concerned about your health I would recommend not taking my word for it and instead reading the three books by Dr Jason Fung (Guide to Fasting, The Obesity Code, The Diabetes Code). Fung (unlike most people who write diet books) is a Dr and all of his facts are backed up by links to published medical studies. I have the e books if anyone wants a copy. Otherwise buy the audio book and listen to it on the way to work.

[tanqueray]

If you hold an OSM and a piece of MDF side by side, you couldn’t tell the difference. Same goes for biting into either one.

Tuna and crackers is what I generally do. Easy as, protein and carbs. Wash it down with scroggin and jerky.


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[WillB]

Anyone else around here on the FODMAP diet? It’s for IBS sufferers. Really works but makes food planning a bit more onerous

[Moa Hunter]

I think that this is a complex multi dimensional problem so doesn't have a simple answer. I would add a couple of things into the mix. Long lived populations that don't eat carbs do exists. Two examples would be the Intuit and Australian Aboriginals. Intuit lived exclusively on fish and marine creatures. The closest they would get to a carb is moss which was likely more about vitamins and minerals rather than any significant carbohydrates. They lived a hard physical life in the hardest environment on earth and their health only went to crap when they started eating processed western food and then it went to crap very quickly.

Aboriginals were a little different as they lived in a place that could grow crops, they just didn't need to as they were perfectly in tune with their environment. With no significant agriculture they ate wild food gathered from their environment which lacked a significant source of carbs. Like the Intuit their health was good until we improved it with western food and it's now turned to crap.

Does all this mean that everyone should live on fat and avoid carbs like I do? The answer to that is no. Humans are adaptable omnivores and despite my two examples you would be able to find many examples of agricultural societies that live long and healthy lives. I guess my point is that there are two major energy pathways in humans (fat and carbs) and both are valid ways to fuel yourself. One thing of note that while there are healthy vegetarian populations around the world there are no healthy vegan societies. Humans are omnivores and are designed to eat at least some animal products. If your ethics don't agree with that then take it up with evolution.

Regarding sugar, fructose and the glycemic index. It's important to note what it does an doesn't measure. It does measure the rise in blood sugar caused by certain foods. It doesn't measure the rise in insulin or the amount of calories that you take in. A food that causes a rapid rise in insulin isn't going to cause a spike in blood sugar (because the insulin lowers it) but it is going to make you fat, sleepy and get type 2 diabetes.

Regarding types of sugar. Sucrose is a combination of fructose and glucose. Fructose is fruit sugar. Glucose is the type of suger that is in your blood and is the most available energy source for the body. The conventional wisdom is that Fructose is better because it has a lower GI. Hidden in this fact is a horrifying truth. Glucose is absorbed directly into the blood. Fructose is adsorbed by multiple organs including the liver. What this means is that fructose is like a homing missile for your liver. Most overweight people already have fatty liver syndrome so eating fructose is just jamming more sugar directly into an already overflowing liver.

For anybody concerned about your health I would recommend not taking my word for it and instead reading the three books by Dr Jason Fung (Guide to Fasting, The Obesity Code, The Diabetes Code). Fung (unlike most people who write diet books) is a Dr and all of his facts are backed up by links to published medical studies. I have the e books if anyone wants a copy. Otherwise buy the audio book and listen to it on the way to work.

From my own studies on dietary influence on longevity, I found that the Inuit had the shortest average lifespan and of the Aboriginal I cannot comment. The longest lived populations from memory are starting from longest life expectancy - The Hunza ( pre westernisation of diet ) the (old way of life) Okinawans, the bean and corn eaters of Costa Rico, Sicilian Shepards, and the SDA at Loma Linda California. Eating foods that are difficult to digest taxes the body and ages it using up digestive enzymes. Eating foods that are easy to digest, like fruit that will naturally brown when exposed to the air (oxidising), and green vegetable juices is far less aging than foods high in lectins, foods that contain enzyme inhibiting preservatives and also fats which are just sugars formed into a more complicated molecule.

[Lucky]

Great thread ,everyone has different metabolisms , I have mates that eat stuff all and go all day , I need to graze every couple hours to keep energy levels up , @WillB I’m Fodmap and Lactose intolerant which is a pain in the ass , but I get away with a few things if I’m doing the miles and burning calories that in a normal day would make me crook , I like canned fish , salami ,crackers , nuts, dates , and I add electrolytes to my water which seems to keep the cramp away for me , depending on hunt i will have a back country 1 serve , they have a few gluten free meals that I seem to get away with and of course the miracle energy drink a hot black cupcake tea !

[Lucky]

Forgot to say I’m impressed with the knowledge and some comments here , there are a lot of people that would feel a lot better if they understood what foods there body doesn’t do well on , its very individual. I am also Fructose Intolerant (lucky Me) for last 6 years so it’s been a big learning curve for me .

I know this is moving away from the thread topic of lunches but there is a 2 part documentary on Netflix I think it’s called the The Evolution of Us , its bloody good and explains lots of cool stuff including how your Heritage can have a big effect on why you metabolism might be what it is .

[WillB]

It’s all about listening to the body I assure you. If I’m on the diet all good - if I’m off it I get really painful stomach aches. Very simple really. But this definitely off topic!