Thread: Tahr cull doc betrayal

Originally Posted by Tahr

The target is a population of 10,000 Tahr

Assuming for the moment that level has been exceeded ( and you'd suspect its further mediated by density requirements in different areas??) you'd also expect that plan to prescribe the mechanisms required to initiate S&D work by DoC?

Perhaps I should read it ........

If the herd is 30,000 odd animals at present I've got no doubt that it it needs a thinning. Tahr can be destructive animals.

I've never hesitated to shoot a few extra nannies on my trips to thin the population a bit. Ive shot 15 in a day in high density areas and am quite comfortable about that. But there is no way that recreational hunters could cull the numbers that seem to be required at the moment.

If the herd is held at 10-15,000 I don't think it would be such a bad thing.

This is the report that still mainly informs current control thinking.

https://www.doc.govt.nz/Documents/co...-plan-1993.pdf

Originally Posted by timattalon

How will Doc react if Tahr become an endangered animal in their original habitats?

I doubt DOC will have any official reaction, their only concern is saving the rather dull indigenous wildlife which is native to these islands.

Tahr hunting is so far away from me that it might as well be big game hunting in the Serengeti. However, this thread makes me feel sad and angry that such a wonderful resource is being wasted.

I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again. Until tahr (and others) get game animal status, you are pissing in the wind. We might as well be talking about rats and mice as far as DOC goes.

Fair enough if the Tahr were doing that much damage to the mountains, who uses and goes into theses areas the odd tramper and climbers in some areas but mostly hunters, we eat there meat use there skins, take there trophy heads and enjoy the splendour of theses magnificent creatures in a true wild environment.
DOC are like the Taliban, dictate there will without consolation of other minority’s groups and enforce there rule to a animal genocide.

Come on DOC at least leave the bulls for us that will use them.

Originally Posted by Tahr

If the herd is 30,000 odd animals at present I've got no doubt that it it needs a thinning. Tahr can be destructive animals.

I've never hesitated to shoot a few extra nannies on my trips to thin the population a bit. Ive shot 15 in a day in high density areas and am quite comfortable about that. But there is no way that recreational hunters could cull the numbers that seem to be required at the moment.

If the herd is held at 10-15,000 I don't think it would be such a bad thing.

This is the report that still mainly informs current control thinking.

https://www.doc.govt.nz/Documents/co...-plan-1993.pdf

1993. Cripes; their thinking hasn't advanced much has it ! The history indicates an unchanged destructive policy over more than 15 years.

Originally Posted by Woody

1993. Cripes; their thinking hasn't advanced much has it ! The history indicates an unchanged destructive policy over more than 15 years.

There were a helluva lot less of us hunting a lot fewer that then too!

Doc are a criminal organisation .Much like Ospri.They both need to be Neutralized.

the other factor that isnt taken into account is the ability of foot hunters is way ahead of what it was...rangefinders and dialup using people CAN do the job much better than way back in deep dark ages IF they choose to do so....personally I dont target thar....prefer eating venison so hunt deer areas BUT if we happen to trip over one it goes home and into pot. the chopper is such an efficent tool for control the animal numbers wont ever get way out of whack again its too easy for search n destroy to lower them back down,,,,maybe we are seeing the first major tweak for a long time I mean there has been more than one article in last few years telling us we need to shoot a few more deer as numbers were creeping up..the increase in venison price has lowered numbers quite drastically in places...with any luck the big bulls that have learnt to live in the scrub have passed on the cunning and we will still see plenty of animals around once the thud of rotor blades has passed by again.
interesting /suspicious as hell that this is happening right now WHILE the WARO fight/review is going on...maybe they want to get in and hit the herd numbers hard just incase things dont go the way they hope and they have wings clipped as it were.

I shot a lot of Tahr in the Karangarua and Troyte in mid '60's and there were, some big mobs there at that time. I don't have a problem with the principle of herd management, but slaughter to waste when an up to date management plan aimed at sustaining a valuable and reasonably accessible resource designed with and approved by NZ hunters could and should be the defining criteria.

The thing is, one major weather event or earthquake can change the landscape of our back country in seconds. Certainly more than 50 years worth of animal browsing or movement.

Greens are book educated idiots that prey on other concrete dwelling idiot (who will never venture further than their local manicured park) emotions in order to gain awareness for their fictional issues.
Doc is full of these clowns. In fact I am positive it is how they hire people for certain roles.

Job requirements:

1. A degree or masters in anything but reality would be benificial.

Translation :

Must be a, brainwashed fucktard that can count to 30,000 on one hand.





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Originally Posted by R93

The thing is, one major weather event or earthquake can change the landscape of our back country in seconds. Certainly more than 50 years worth of animal browsing or movement.

Greens are book educated idiots that prey on other concrete dwelling idiot (who will never venture further than their local manicured park) emotions in order to gain awareness for their fictional issues.
Doc is full of these clowns. In fact I am positive it is how they hire people for certain roles.

Job requirements:

1. A degree or masters in anything but reality would be benificial.

Translation :

Must be a, brainwashed fucktard that can count to 30,000 on one hand.





Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

A bloody big plus one on that ^^^^

Originally Posted by R93

The thing is, one major weather event or earthquake can change the landscape of our back country in seconds. Certainly more than 50 years worth of animal browsing or movement.

Greens are book educated idiots that prey on other concrete dwelling idiot (who will never venture further than their local manicured park) emotions in order to gain awareness for their fictional issues.
Doc is full of these clowns. In fact I am positive it is how they hire people for certain roles.


Job requirements:

1. A degree or masters in anything but reality would be benificial.

Translation :

Must be a, brainwashed fucktard that can count to 30,000 on one hand.





Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

I have a term called educated idiots for just these sort of people. They are like an apprentice that finishes their time and thinks they know everything but are really just good enough to start learning.
Only thing wrong is they are far more in control and far more destructive.

Originally Posted by csmiffy

I have a term called educated idiots for just these sort of people. They are like an apprentice that finishes their time and thinks they know everything but are really just good enough to start learning.
Only thing wrong is they are far more in control and far more destructive.

Nicely put....I just call em "Cake eaters"! Because they sit on there ass all day and eat cake, and have very limited real world experience or bother to ask for any.

There's a lot of hatefulness and vitriol here, and perhaps a lack of understanding the situation. I am not and will not engage with the former, and am speaking strictly on the subject of tahr control as a hunter with, I'd like to think, a little knowledge of the issue

The Himalayan Thar Control Plan which is the guiding document that DOC works under to plan tahr control sets the population limit at 10,000 tahr across the feral range. This is not a policy of extermination, and allows for controlling the population at an estimated level where ecological values and recreational hunting are both preserved. It is effectively a pretty good basis for a progressive policy of managing a game animal sustainably with conservation and recreation values in mind - certainly better than we have for any other species in NZ in that regard.

It appears that based on monitoring, tahr numbers across their range are currently well in excess of this - see the original linked ODT article with a population estimate of 35,000. Recreational hunting simply has not prevented numbers increasing - we are not shooting enough tahr, even alongside ongoing DOC/AATH offset control and commercial recovery. The massive numbers of uncontrolled tahr on pastoral lease land - Safari operations etc - which move onto public land don't help the situation. Tahr control is nothing new, it has been happening forever and is public knowledge - both by DOC doing SAD and AATH (heli hunting) operators shooting nannies for offsets - and volunteer culls on the ground through the Tahr Interest Group e.g. in the Landsborough etc. There is a policy to not shoot identifiable bulls (over ~2 years) during control operations - mentioned a couple of times in this publicly available document for example
https://www.doc.govt.nz/Documents/co...nd-2015-16.pdf

While we may not be happy that tahr are being culled, it has been ongoing for a long time, is nothing new, and is simply meeting the conditions of a pretty reasonable piece of management policy as far as hunting and conservation going together in New Zealand. This culling will not ruin recreational tahr hunting, there are a LOT of tahr out there. If we don't want DOC culling tahr, and if we don't want AATH - we need to shoot more ourselves. If we shot more nannies, there would be less tahr and it would be less justifiable for AATH to occur (the 5:1 nanny:bull culling offset requirement is a lot of free tahr control that justifies the activity).

How did the population manage to get 3.5x greater than the management plan recommends if they are being "managed"?