Thread: Time to re-introduce a paying for deer/goat tail scheme?

Personally, I thought it then and I still think one of the worst decisions made by central government was to disband the Pest Destruction Boards. The three areas I lived in when they were in existence were virtually devoid of anything pest related. Made it tough for a youngster starting out in their hunting career but they certainly had it well under control and were basically down to a maintenance role with minimal staffing levels. I know it’s a case of hindsight but it doesn’t take a genius to figure out the consequences, as we now see, of not keeping on top of a problem when there is no guarantee of complete eradication. It was always going to come back and bite us in the gluteus maximus.

There is no argument against the cost of maintaining small experienced crews around the country, giving them the ability to organise and cooperate with other interested groups when needed to assist maintaining control, as opposed to the monumental waste of taxpayers resources currently going on now. I’ve seen, time and time again, regional councils carrying out poison control of rabbits on private properties and then fail on follow up. Every year throwing it around willy nilly and then failing to monitor outcomes with absolutely no accountability on either themselves or landowners, if they have obligations as well for follow up.

The responsibility of pest control needs to be removed from the departments of ideology and incompetence and returned to a practical, boots on the ground entity, coupled with adequate funding for research, and we’ll be back to seeing some real inroads into the problem. It’s far easier to monitor effectiveness and outcomes vs expenditure with a single entity than the current structures with a multitude of fingers, arms, and boots in the pie. The results will speak for themselves and to hold them accountable you have only one door to knock on.


And yes, there are issues accompanying it, but there must also be some financial incentives involved for private individuals, at least in the interim till control is established. The issues aren’t new, they’re well documented so I’m sure a viable solution can be found.

Bounty system would work if rewards are high enough, take Rhino poaching for example.

Originally Posted by EmpireSafaris

Bounty system would work if rewards are high enough, take Rhino poaching for example.

so the bounty was on dried poachers ears ???? or noses or whole scalp

Ha, in China people used to say "If no buying, there will be no dying", it first refer to eat endangered species and behaviors like eating shark fin and near shore seafood, but then it really refer to buy things online because so many delivery boys and girls on e-bikes have died or badly injured. What I mean is maybe the best way is to let people know how good the wild goat is for eat and for health, especially for those Chinese in NI. I am Chinese, even I do `t eat lots of Chinese dishes and I am small eater, but I know my countryman
I took out several feral goats when I was in Akl, and I gutted them, and cook them in traditional Chinese cuisine, Even I got lack of ingredients but everybody enjoy it, some guy I knew asked me later that when you will go out again and cook it again? I said that is not my house nor my rifle so wait the group news. So basically, the Chinese in NI can eat those goat out. Once before Germany declared a war against China hairy crabs, I was in German company then I asked my associates how bad it is, then Germans said well...too many of them and they match on the street Germans do `t eat them, but if sent 3,000 Chinese down there for couple years, they may will never see hairy crabs again And I am back to China now for a while, now is in the 2nd important holiday in China, the hairy crab at market the price is $10.00 dollar each

Just remember that TB free Nz along side Landcare were quite happy to release TB infected possums in to a TB free area “for research purposes “.

When this kind of stupidity is allowed to be funded by the tax payer, I have no faith in pest free NZ their ideals or strategies!

I know a private pest controller , he was driven out of the industry by being under cut by larger corporations, paying lower wages and paperwork! He has since left the country and is now culling deer in Australia!

His parting words to me, were that pest control is going to the lowest bidder, paying the lowest wages! They will reap what you sow! He expects the pest problems to explode in NZ.

Originally Posted by stingray

Just remember that TB free Nz along side Landcare were quite happy to release TB infected possums in to a TB free area “for research purposes “.

When this kind of stupidity is allowed to be funded by the tax payer, I have no faith in pest free NZ their ideals or strategies!

I know a private pest controller , he was driven out of the industry by being under cut by larger corporations, paying lower wages and paperwork! He has since left the country and is now culling deer in Australia!

His parting words to me, were that pest control is going to the lowest bidder, paying the lowest wages! They will reap what you sow! He expects the pest problems to explode in NZ.

There is a report on the scientific trial here: https://www.landcareresearch.co.nz/a...he_Kino_27.pdf
I see that Sue Grey has been on this anti bandwagon. That speaks volumes.

Been following this thread with mild interest. Since April 2014 to present day I have been shooting mainly goats over an area of approx. 520 ha of DOC estate, all but a ha or so bush, and over this period have shot over 3000 goats, numerous pigs, a few dear and more than a few cats. I started doing this when said goats were making a nuisance of themselves at a DOC motorcamp. As time progressed, the area I cover slowly increased to present size.Originaly I could shoot up to 50 animals over maybe 4 hours. These days it's sometimes just an armed day walk, maybe 8-12 km loop, in the bush. As @Barry the hunter and others have noted, it's easy to get good numbers when there is a big population of animals, but when numbers get down thats when the serious work begins. And it is hard (impossible?) to get them all, especially when there is infiltration from border areas. So, even with a bounty, I'm sceptical there would be enough dedicated hunters out there to get the job done. But, as MD has said, 'a dead goat is a good goat'. Just my 2c.

Originally Posted by woods223

Been following this thread with mild interest. Since April 2014 to present day I have been shooting mainly goats over an area of approx. 520 ha of DOC estate, all but a ha or so bush, and over this period have shot over 3000 goats, numerous pigs, a few dear and more than a few cats. I started doing this when said goats were making a nuisance of themselves at a DOC motorcamp. As time progressed, the area I cover slowly increased to present size.Originaly I could shoot up to 50 animals over maybe 4 hours. These days it's sometimes just an armed day walk, maybe 8-12 km loop, in the bush. As @Barry the hunter and others have noted, it's easy to get good numbers when there is a big population of animals, but when numbers get down thats when the serious work begins. And it is hard (impossible?) to get them all, especially when there is infiltration from border areas. So, even with a bounty, I'm sceptical there would be enough dedicated hunters out there to get the job done. But, as MD has said, 'a dead goat is a good goat'. Just my 2c.

good on ya mate for sticking at it - bloody job well done - we shot a block south of Waikaremoana as part of an operation to keep goats out of Te Urewera - mainly sheep stations - we got it down to a goat every two to three days from a high first two weeks of about 20 a day - then it was left for about 3 years - bugger me back to 10-20 first week again - ya just cant sleep when you have a small buffer zone -biggest numbers were between the Ruakituri river and the Hangaroa river out 5 km from Te Urewera boundary - heli shot it over two days 1800 - then two of us did about 30 days for another 1200 - now this area was clean in a culling operation very early 1970,s but we would have needed to go another 5km out for a decent buffer zone just to try and stop goats coming in - I spent 5 years culling along that boundary and into Te Urewera and at times went weeks going over country for no goats - thankfully there were deer and pigs to shoot otherwise would have been bloody boring -- that SE Te Urewera operation went on for years to keep the boundary clean and is probably still checked periodically - bounty do anything in those situations no

@stingray unfortunately your mate is on the money, there isn’t many outfit that pay their hunters well and despite their social media videos they don’t do as much culling/hunting work as they would have you believe.

@Barry the hunter. Prime example of goat numbers building up was over COVID lockdown bullshit. Even DOC hunters weren’t allowed to get out and about.

HNZare a bit like goats .every vacant section locally has been adorned with multi storey dog kennels usually blue and white .mind you eggy meggy woods min housing is our local MP(hopefully not much longer).found out yesterday the unirt burnt out next to us willbe adorned with the above .underwhelmed yep!

Pay $10-$20 per pair of possum ears and watch the population come crashing down.

This conversation is why PF2050 will never be reality.
Doc will never commit the $$ to getting every last rat stoat and possum dead.

I see a bounty ax another tool in the tool box. Along with targeted culling operations. Waste of time with poison on goats isn't it..?

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Originally Posted by tiroahunta

I see a bounty ax another tool in the tool box. Along with targeted culling operations. Waste of time with poison on goats isn't it..?

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another tool yes but only for a specific area and specific pest it would need to be very carefully managed so that only the target animal from a specific area was paid for and it would need to be small area -then and only then does it have any merit - what might work is to give a group a koha for work in an area - that way the group can police their own - blanket bountys well go tip tax payers money in the ocean because it would achieve nothing - poison on goats I believe the FS did trials years ago and it was not very successful - deer specifically targeted with 1080 of course against DOC internal policy and lets hope it stays that way - if deer are to be controlled I believe it should be shooting only

Originally Posted by Barry the hunter

perhaps a little heads up here on how DOC gets its money may clarify things as to why a bounty is a no brainer and a no show - DOC starting around Jan Feb start to formulate the next years business plan - okay so as a Program Manager I would be aske to cost out next years operations this would include any new projects - these go to Conservancy where the first no yes takes place - these then go to head office - and again yes no - they will have some idea what Treasury has in store as to a possible budget next financial year - once a project is approved this is then negotiated with treasury and if all go added to business plan - now projects are a purchase of staff hours and operating dollars with treasury - they have time lines and have exactly what the DOC will deliver for that project - projects have to be time bound and have clearly measurable out comes - money once allocated to an approved project cannot be taken for other projects in another division of DOC - - a bounty would not even get past the very first stage -why because its outcome will be zilch - it would have no impact what so ever be it deer goats or possums - yes nice for a shooter but as for effective control nah nyet non - cant spell it out any clearer - to control any animal population one needs to control over 90% of the population or better - and then keep that up - not going to happen guys -volunteers in a small area maybe

With all that rigorous accountability how the hell does doc quickly come up with $11,000,000 to go burn down 50 huts?
Average chopper bill for each one was around $2000. Double that for labour etc and it come out at no more than $250000 to do the whole job.
I don’t have much faith in docs money handling skills