Thread: What am I doing wrong???

Originally Posted by Ned

Wind. And once you're on good fresh sign. Slow down to nearly nothing.

Watched a good youtube from the woodsman i think it was. Sika stag roaring so he knew it was there. 6 hour stalk from the spur he was on to the spur the stag was on. Like a few hundred metres as far as the crow flies.

The older and slower I get the more deer I seem to get.

Sent from my LM-G710 using Tapatalk

Yeah I need to work on that...

Originally Posted by Nathan F

If your finding rubbish like that your not walking far enough. Get well away from roadends i.e 5-6 hours . Then if you cant find a deer take up something else. Especially at the moment . Use Binoculars and hunt first and last light. By last light i mean have the wind in your face and hunt until you can no longer see without a torch.

You're South Island based, so possibly you do have to go that far to get onto donks. Here in the CNI if you walked 5-6 hours you would have walked past 50 deer on the way. There's an awful lot of deer within 3km of SH1, where it goes past/through Public land. If its private land, there's an awful awful lot of deer. Need to tip over everything you see, or the green rains a comin'.

See just how small Kaimanawa yearlings are, due to feed pressure. This was one I tipped over last weekend:

Originally Posted by DCN808T

The more I get out, the more confident i get with heading further off the beaten track, and the fitter I become. I think Ive been smelling and hearing animals more often, but i do have the handicap of having my dog with me, and big game indicator, she certainly is NOT.

My first and only successful trip out was with an older fella named Pete who bounced up knife edges and climbed vertical cliffs while I clung to scrub wishing my mommy was with me. So, no deer aside, I think I have improved somewhat!

It's possible to hunt areas that get heavy pressure and still be successful, the 2 key things that you need to learn:
1- Weather conditions prior to and during your hunt and how it dictates deer behavior
2- What they will eat at any given time in the season and where to find it
3- Timing.

Most people without someone to coach them learn by osmosis over a long period of time, shortcut the learning by getting the right books and study like you are at school with an exam coming. Clue: Saxon and Lentle ( or Lentle and Saxon?) write books........

Example that might give you an idea what I'm on about: a few weeks ago it rained and blew nasty for a couple of days prior to the weekend suppressing deer activity, forecast had specific wind direction, deer hate wind, but needed to be eating , the entire catchment area I wanted to hunt was exposed to the wind and rain, had been for two days - but due to clear the rain around dawn but keep being gusty, within that area were a couple of wee gullies that held good feed and were protected from the wind direction that morning, got my arse there to be on the spot as the light got useable, instead of searching and trying to hunt 20 square kilometers, my whole aim was to hunt about 1 square km. Was home in time for lunch because I knew where to be before I left the house.

A few others might weigh in here, no harm in sharing your intellectual property and how you think...... we all have our own bits of the whole picture.

Its the looking that counts.

Deer seldom look up hill, so use that as an advantage. I'm always trying to get an elevation advantage on deer and hunt down or across. I stop often and do a lot of looking through my binos. Look for little things, not big things - the flick of an ear, a patch of brown, a flick of a tail, a moving branch. Then show some patient and clearly identify it as an animal. If you see something little or obscure that could be an animal mark it in your mind and go back to it from time to time as you glass other areas or aspects. See if its moved or changed shape.

Even during the most unlikely times of the day deer will get up for a stretch or a nibble and you need to be on hand and aware for those moments. Deer will move about to another aspect when a change of weather is coming too. Be alert to these sorts of things.

Originally Posted by DCN808T

Yeah I need to work on that...

Getting older? Don't worry, that comes naturally. It certainly took me a long while to reinforce just how slow you should go when the sign gets fresh hot. Bush hunting you should be mentally exhausted at the end of a hunt rather than physically.

Sent from my LM-G710 using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by DCN808T

The farther in you go, the less rubbish there is, no question about it. But id prefer if there was no rubbish at all. Especially seeing as that area is visited almost exclusively by hunters.

Agreed , But its a fact of life, Its not only four legged animals that inhabit the back country.

Originally Posted by 257weatherby

It's possible to hunt areas that get heavy pressure and still be successful, the 2 key things that you need to learn:
1- Weather conditions prior to and during your hunt and how it dictates deer behavior
2- What they will eat at any given time in the season and where to find it
3- Timing.

Most people without someone to coach them learn by osmosis over a long period of time, shortcut the learning by getting the right books and study like you are at school with an exam coming. Clue: Saxon and Lentle ( or Lentle and Saxon?) write books........

Example that might give you an idea what I'm on about: a few weeks ago it rained and blew nasty for a couple of days prior to the weekend suppressing deer activity, forecast had specific wind direction, deer hate wind, but needed to be eating , the entire catchment area I wanted to hunt was exposed to the wind and rain, had been for two days - but due to clear the rain around dawn but keep being gusty, within that area were a couple of wee gullies that held good feed and were protected from the wind direction that morning, got my arse there to be on the spot as the light got useable, instead of searching and trying to hunt 20 square kilometers, my whole aim was to hunt about 1 square km. Was home in time for lunch because I knew where to be before I left the house.

A few others might weigh in here, no harm in sharing your intellectual property and how you think...... we all have our own bits of the whole picture.

The books 257weatherby mention are GOLD.
Percentage hunting like 257W outlines is another great tip. I always remember following the tips of an old sage I used to hunt with. The weather was shite and we were doing a 'pincer' approach on a little valley with a couple of little guts in it. 400m across, we approached each other from both sides, with the wind howling up the valley. Lovely grassy flats but not a sausage. Got to within 80m of each other and I started shrugging my shoulders intimating" there's no bloody deer here" to him. He pointed to the last gut. We moved closer. 50m. Then all hell broke lose. 6 Deer leapt into action. Manged to drop 3 of them.

@DCN808T When I first started hunting my results were much like yours, i was more or less stumbling around in the bush of the Kawekas and the Ruahines, trying to do the things i'd read, keeping the wind in ya face (easier said than done when terrain dictates your direction of travel at times). I was trying to slow it down, as i had also read that. I had the odd success, just happened to be going slow enough with the wind in my face at the right time on the rare occasion.

After picking up some tips from a couple of other pretty successful hunters that always seemed to have no problem finding and shooting deer, i changed the way i was hunting. They both got to vantage points that looked into areas that had clearings or faces or slips where deer often came out to feed, these feed areas obviously change depending on the seasons and what the weather is doing, but you get to learn this after a while.

I started adopting this approach, and guess what, suddenly i started seeing a huge amount more animals. Once you start to know where deer often turn up at various times of year in the different locations you hunt, then you can start targeting them at those times of the year. Keep a diary and record the details of all of your trips and what you see etc.

When you know where deer are likely to turn up, then you can find places/make places within range that you can shoot from. This type of hunting does generally require that you have the ability to be able to accurately shoot to ranges of 300-400 yards, but you may be able to find spots to shoot from that are closer to the animals than that.

Once you have found the clearings, faces, slips etc that are obviously being visited by deer regulary (at that time of year) then it just requires some patience, sitting at your vantage point and glassing the area. If you can find vantage points with lots of good area to glass then all the better. Or a series of vantage points all close by that you can do a circuit around to look into several different areas of clearings, faces etc.

Most of the places i hunt now are all the absolute front country, just on the edge of the public land/private land boundary. Some of which only take 30 mins to walk into and onto my vantage point. 1-hour drive from home, easy enough to sneak up after work this time of year for a quick evening hunt. Some of these places it's unusual not to see animals.

It works for me.

Originally Posted by DCN808T

My first and only successful trip out was with an older fella named Pete who bounced up knife edges and climbed vertical cliffs while I clung to scrub wishing my mommy was with me.

I can relate to that so much. I am extremely slow going up and down steep terrain because I am terrified of slipping. Also terrified of grabbing onto rotting wood and the wood falling away. When i was doing the hunts course and heading out with others, I had trouble keeping up with my wobbly legs, especially downhill on slippery muddy areas.

Oh yeah, not sure if you have gone to the blue mountains for fallow or not, but in my experience you don't necessarily have to go very far to find deer. Ive spooked fallow deer 50m into the bush! Closest ive spooked red deer was about 300m in from the road. However I have no doubt that their density might be much higher in areas less traveled.

PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 6:28 pm Post subject: How to bush stalk KIWI style. Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
After having a great week stalking recently it occurred to me that the method I used/use may be of interest to others and if I can convey it correctly a learning aid for new hunters...a big ask but here goes anyway.

first up you cant drink whiskey from bottle of wine
if there is no deer in an area you are wasting your time and energy doing a full on stalk of barren ground,find an area where you have fresh sign eg poohs on the ground,foot prints/spoor,tree rubbing or evidence of grazing and THEN get into mouse mode

WIND is vital or fatal depending on your ability to read it,a red deer has been said to smell you from over a mile away,so hunting with a breeze blowing up ya jacksee is not going to be very productive (besides which those baked bean farts will linger longer) there are different ways to find/check the wind,wet your finger and hold it up to find which side gets cold,shave hair from behind your ears to feel breeze,powder puff pottle,piece of cotton tied to your barrel (Suz??? was this why your lot added feather to bow???) a quick flick of the trusty Bic flick..cigarette lighter to you non down unders, drop handfull of leaves or dust.
which ever method you use hunting into the wind is best as it keeps your scent away from quarry,you CAN hunt across the wind eg sidle around contour of land with a breeze blowing uphill(thermal breeze on sunny day will do this) but you will be scenting up area above you so eyes need to cover area infront and above you well,main area to find game will be below you,which leads nicely onto how to see game

I put up a poll on another forum recently to see how other people got a 100% positive ID of an animal (due to recent hunting accidents)
biggest % of guys use 3 or more things to do this.
personally I normally spot colour Im looking for/movement/horizontal solid line or something just "out of place"
which then gets double checked..and triple checked if ticking boxes at that stage
seeing head and neck of live animal doing LIVE animal things is MY PERSONAL final box to tick off.
with modern electronic callers getting better and good old cow horn magic in right hands sound is OUT as an ID factor...other than to start process of checking something out,that includes roaring/croaking/bugling and general moving around noises like brushes rustling ,foot falls or antler rattling
they are great to get your attention and focus it but not enough to tell what it is you are hearing...it could be a human..infact it is a human untill you can 100% tell otherwise..right thats enough on that one FOR NOW.

ok so we are walking along with wind right and some fresh deer sign on ground...but HOW are you walking????a heavy booted plod just wont do old chap...wont do at all
take a break from keyboard,go outside in bare feet and walk across ashfelt/tarseal/stoney road, you will find that you cant walk heel toe heel toe any more as it hurts Sad
so you will by default start to place your foot flat..well sort of flat,outside of foot touches first then rolls down till big toe hits,your foot is down then your weight goes to that foot and then and only then will back foot move and repeat sequence. same goe for crossing a river,each foot goes down and solidly grounded BEFORE other one moves
when Im in hot sign its 3 steps then stop and look..another 3 and look again etc etc etc if you in really hot sign and think you going too slow well Mates SLOW DOWN SOME MORE and then you are still going too fast.
deer live there all the time,if you sitting in lazy boy chair in your lounge reading a book or eating a han n cheese sammie and some one walzed into your house you would know it straight away wouldnt you????? same goes for a deer except they know if they not really alert they will get one way trip on back of ute.

k so we have
wind
walk slow
find area of sign

feeding area,sleeping/bedding area or moving between the two are main places to find your quarry
food is where you find it
bedding will be warm with light breeze to carry scent to bedded deer and be close to heavy cover...usually

down here downunder we have warm faces on North side of ridges being best bets as warmer = more plant growth and better bedding areas.


that will do for now...have a read and feel free to ask questions
and Ill have a think on what Ive missed
clothing and footwear come to mind.

_________________
You shot it You pluck it !
Them who eats the most duck eats the most feathers!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Elvis
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Jul 27, 2008
Posts: 8744
Location: south island New Zealand
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:20 pm Post subject: Re: How to bush stalk KIWI style. Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
clothing,well if you have the $$$$$$ Swazi is really good stuff,made by a hunting man for hunters,tested and it works and lasts but as said it costs
me Im a cheap bugga and have a real mix n match wardrobe of polar fleece garments from all over the place,normally bought cheap by SWMBO on trade me auction site.
in warm weather its polyprop short tights (think above the knee long Johns) with rugby shorts over top..to protect/preserve modesty.
and usually a polyprop top or fleece Tshirt.
in colder weater we "layer up" eg keep adding layers till we warm enough and top it with a shell layer
if in the bush quietness is paramount so fleece is king.
back in the day it was the good old Swanni or Lambi woolen coat but now fleece wins out as its so much lighter and dries quicker.
a hat of some sort ,fleece gloves and a fleece neck warmer top off my list of cloths
boots are a personal thing,lace up rubber gumboots win hands down for me.
after years of sore red feet from hunting in leather boots my Brother got me onto Bullers and I havent looked back since,Ive got a reasonable pair of leather hunting boots and they do the odd day trip in hot weather but gummies are the shite in the bush,really easy to step quietly and they grip well so you dont spend half the day falling on ya bum and other half picking ya self up again.

on last trip I would find area with sign and follow any spoor present if wind was right or just wander along SLOWLY in direction of travel taking path of least resistance picking deer trail where possible.

rifles are again personal choice but for my money big n slow beats light and fast projectile wise (that said Ive hunted successfully with .223)
a good old .308 is still hard to beat.
but scopes are a different matter
your 4x16 ziess or 8x24 might be the ducks nuts out in open country where long shots from rest are the norm but in the scrub the lower the magnification the better wiht 4x being MOST you want and lower still is better.mine wear vari powers with 3x as lowest and other rifle a fixed 4x
tried mates smit n bender and it was plurry hopeless, even on lowest power the field of view was like peering down a drain pipe!!!!

_________________

posted this up a year or two ago...excuse the in between bits from copy n paste....hopefully this will help.

Originally Posted by Allgood

Leave the camera at home......It increases your chance by about 55% of getting a deer if you cant take a pic of your first one........
( Personal experience)

Never a truer statement

I don’t take a camera either, however I take my phone for the GPS function…much like taking the esky fishing, keep the refreshments cold

Are you seeing deer or deer sign? trails , deer shit etc ?

To the thread author.
If you have no luck and are still keen i can take you to the west coast for a weekend in march and pretty much guarantee you a couple of deer.this is a mates first deer 2 weeks ago

Originally Posted by paremata

Are you seeing deer or deer sign? trails , deer shit etc ?

Not so much on this outing no. But i have seen fresh sign in that area before. Saw two deer further upstream last year this time. The dog had trotted past them and they bolted before i could shoulder my rifle. Ive found a few bits of deer left by people.