Thread: 17 hmr replacement

Was happy to see this thread. Recently sold my 17hmr after 3 years use as it seemed somehow lacking ? the last year and did not want a every-man-and-his- dog-has-one .223 ( and since there are no civilian rifles yet chambered in HK 4.6 x 30) I have been looking at countless forums on the 22 Hornet. Specifically a CZ 527

From what ive read so far it seems Lil gun and the 22 hornet are made for each other.

Nice rifle, I have two CZ's, a .204 CZ varmint and American in .17 hornet, my .17 hrm CZ will be for sale as soon as I get the .17 hornet back to NZ, have begun reloading for the .17 hornet, the hornardy brass is the shits, and I had to buy a primer pocket reamer to cut the seats to the correct depth as they were all over the show, getting things Sussed now,
20gr with H110 powder at about 3500 fps and 25gr with H322 at about 3200, still working on seating depths, and fine tuning but about 3/4" at 100m, as soon as I get a spare mag I am going to shave the spacer block a bit so I get seat the 25 gr out a bit further.
.17 hornet is such a fun small game round,
The CZ small Mauser are great little rifles. But getting a spare mag up here in Canada in summer gopher season is tough.

I think a CZ in 17 Hornet would be an awesome little rifle. But I can't see that it'll be all that cheaper to feed than a 223 you may only use half the amount of powder, but it would seem brass is a lot more stable in 223 and bulk bullets would be more readily available in .224?

Can anyone prove me wrong?
I think it'l be cool to have the cartridge, and you would probably have a lighter rifle, that's a tad quieter and less recoil (lol).
But would it really be any cheaper? And anymore that 10cents a shot cheaper?

Not got exact figures , but its quite a bit cheaper than 223 ,

1 ) brass last long if you take care , as if you use Lilgun , pressure is very low
2 ) Primers are cheaper , why ? , as you are best to use CCI or fed small pistol primers , as it usually shrinks your group to 1/2 over using rifle primers, rifle primers are more expensive than pistol primers.
3 ) bullets are smaller/lighter and as such are cheaper than 55-80gr bullets
4 ) using lilgun powder, at 13gr gives you over 500+rds per pound of powder

So some one with more time can crunch the numbers as to the exact % that the hornet is over the 223 , but would think it would be 60% approx of 223 .

but reguardless of all that , I brought this as a good compromise , ie donot want to scare the cows on the farm .


Later Chris

I reload for both the .17 hornet and .223,
First off, I concider them to be very different, and not really in the same class,
The .17 hornet is cheeper to load for, buy about 30%, uses 1/3 the powder and a box of 500 v-max is quite a bit less than 500 equlivant .22 cal v-max. Also it's currently easy to find .17 cal bullets up here in Canada, .22 not so much. Slim picking and nothing I was after the last two times, I was looking.
The biggest advantage the very small centerfire's, ie .17 & .22 hornet along with the fireball and 218 bee have over the .223 is they are quieter and you can spot your own shots. Ie you can see the impact in the scope even on a light weight sportier rifle.
I had no luck with little gun powder in the .17 hornet. Even the Miminum load blew one primer and one tight bolt.
Proceed with caution with this powder, I use H110 for 20 gr and Imr 322 for the .25 gr.
Go the hornet.

A heads up for CZ lovers there is a limited run of .17 Remington and .221 fire ball coming for 2015.
I think I might order a fire ball,

Good news , bad news ,

Good in that my 40gr vmax ammo chambers & extracts ,
Bad news its too long to fit in the magazine

Originally Posted by southernman

I reload for both the .17 hornet and .223,
First off, I concider them to be very different, and not really in the same class,
The .17 hornet is cheeper to load for, buy about 30%, uses 1/3 the powder and a box of 500 v-max is quite a bit less than 500 equlivant .22 cal v-max. Also it's currently easy to find .17 cal bullets up here in Canada, .22 not so much. Slim picking and nothing I was after the last two times, I was looking.
The biggest advantage the very small centerfire's, ie .17 & .22 hornet along with the fireball and 218 bee have over the .223 is they are quieter and you can spot your own shots. Ie you can see the impact in the scope even on a light weight sportier rifle.
I had no luck with little gun powder in the .17 hornet. Even the Miminum load blew one primer and one tight bolt.
Proceed with caution with this powder, I use H110 for 20 gr and Imr 322 for the .25 gr.
Go the hornet.

A heads up for CZ lovers there is a limited run of .17 Remington and .221 fire ball coming for 2015.
I think I might order a fire ball,

Is it really that much quieter? Would it sit in the middle of 17hmr and 223?
I find that if you are worried about noise, even 17hmr is going to be too loud.

It's a bit different for Americans and Canadians, as a lot of folk here will have suppressed their rifle if they are worried about noise.
And I am willing to be corrected, but I haven't seen bulk 17 projectiles in NZ before.

That being said, I'm still thinking a 17HH in a CZ would be a sweet little gun.
Is it cheaper for you to reload 17HH or buy 17hmr ammo in Canada?

just ran some numbers , cost for 1000 rds of hornet reloads , $477 , for 223 is $709 , so is a little cheaper

you can load 223 with hornday projectiles for 0.52 without buying in bulk

edit: excluding brass

Yeap ,

you can also run cheaper bullets in the hornet , , than what I used above , I used similar bullets in the 223 to make more apple/apples in comparision ,

The only reason to have a .22 hornet is simply because you want one which is the best reason anyway but from a practical sense they are in a void. If you are going to step up from a .17 rimfire and have to flounder around picking up empty cases( especially at night) and then go to the trouble of reloading the .222 and .223 are far more logical.
The CCI .17gr hmr is 40 cents a round for my rifle and that's a genuine cost as it includes brass and dosn't need any outlay in the way of dies etc.

[QUOTE=Beetroot;250661
It's a bit different for Americans and Canadians, as a lot of folk here will have suppressed their rifle if they are worried about noise.
And I am willing to be corrected, but I haven't seen bulk 17 projectiles in NZ before.
That being said, I'm still thinking a 17HH in a CZ would be a sweet little gun.
Is it cheaper for you to reload 17HH or buy 17hmr ammo in Canada?[/QUOTE]





No problem to find .17 projectiles in NZ. Might take a couple of phone calls.
Ita about $17-$20 a packet of 17hrm ammo here and about $23-25. For a box of 25 factory .17 hornet.
If you already Have reloading gear, I would think the price for .17 hornet would be close to same. For considerable increase in performance.
I will have to crunch numbers, to really know and much depends on brass life and losses in the field. As yet unknown, so far up to five loads on brass, Also I already had powders on hand for shotgun.
Big difference in noise between hornet and .223.
But then again my new .264 win noise is incredible, compaired to my .223. Big difference in powder volume.

Cost with brass , .51 cents a rd , .45 cents for the 17 hmr ( 17gr Hornady 500rd lots ) , Im getting 3000fps , with 40gr vmax with 20 inche barrel ( chopped from 22 ) with a MAE 22mag SS can , and LOVING it .

P.S. So maybe my 22 hornet has more power at similar cost to a 17 hmr ? , providing you reload

No its 40 cents a round , CCI HMR 17gr is $200 a brick. And to get to 51 cents including brass you need to get what 7 firings and loose none at all?
Thats my point , theses calcs of "cost per round" rarely take real world brass costs into account and always ignore the setup costs. Maybe if your just target shooting during the day you might not loose many, I loose quite a few when Im small game hunting and night shooting is worse. not to mention the time wasted seaching for cases.Yes you get more power but in useable terms its not that much for the all the hassle, and for very little exta over the hornet you can reload a .222 and get some real improvements. I spent enough time with my .22 hornet before I realised life was easier with the rimfire,
Enjoy the hornet, it has a little cool factor going for it but that's about it IMHO. The .17 HH is neat little round though

The price I had was current from Reloaders in AKL , and its the hornady ammo , the cci from them was dearer , dosnt matter , what I am getting at is the cost of either 17 hmr & 22 hornet are similar , BUT the power is not .
I have 223 & others , this is about getting a rifle that does not SPOOK the cows on the farm I shoot on .
Also it needs to drop the odd goat at short range , as such I want a heavier bullet than 17-20grs .

As nice as the 17 hornet sounds , the 17 I would really like is the 17 Fireball , as it seems the most balanced .
We agree to disagree .

Later Chris