Thread: 338 suppressors

Originally Posted by Spanners

I have had a couple on order for months and months... to only have the stuck up wanker of an agent decide now he cant be fucked bringing them in anymore, and wont pass the suppliers details over.
ASE wont respond directly, have spoken to the Oz agents a couple of times also.. Beretta was the agents before this latest fool and they were useless also.

So basically; they are the unobtanium...

Are you still trying to get some for forum members ?

I'm after an ASE Ultra S series SL7 in 338 cal with a 14x1 thread please.............

Still trying..

I just started reading this thread last night. There is a lot of good info here and since I am about to start in on bolt action suppressors and would like some feedback.

First off I was surprised at the dislike for over barrel cans but the aspect about the multitude of different barrel profiles is dead on. Having a QD definitely makes the fitting easier since you don't have to mess around with a dozen barrel profiles and can still achieve a reasonable two point system with a decent QD brake. I never considered this since the semis I have been making them for were relatively standardized. Over barrel suppressors can be too far over the barrel in my opinion like some of the Reflex since the gasses are hard to drive too far back the opposite way, especially on a semi auto. I still like a minimum of over barrel in the range of 50 -65mm since this depth can be efficiently utilized and even up to 120 for bolt guns.

The surefire over barrel QD can is so small at 38mm that after the barrel and QD fitting going all the way back, there is barely any room for the gas anyway. Many makers are limited by tubing sizes for the can diameter and cost of going off axis for the can shape to reduce the profile. What would be the optimum height above the bore axis if you had a choice? Would a off axis design be of any interest?

I am still limited by length for a few more weeks but could do a can around the size of the SL7 right now. For pure long range accuracy I like the concept mentioned by Chris with the shoulder 100 - 125mm aft of the threads so that the barrel is tensioned with a direct thread on mount. I will be building one of these for my Rem 700 in the next three weeks for a test with about 80mm aft of muzzle and 100 forward since I want a small handy can that will remain 24" after the can is on. In the near future this could be made into a longer version.

So how would you rank the following:

Height above bore
Overall can diameter
In line can versus off axis
Length past barrel
QD
Weight
Sound
Cost

Keep in mind that often making one parameter better will make another parameter worse.

As to our latest developments, an AR10 can is under test and is working well (with an adjustable gas block) even as it is glowing from mag dumps. The internals of all cans are getting a new heat treat which provides a harder surface inside the can as well as out while increasing the ductility. The QD is progressing but not finished. We are in contact with an overseas testing company to get our cans independently tested.

Thanks.

You have our interest now ODL.

Originally Posted by ODL

I just started reading this thread last night. There is a lot of good info here and since I am about to start in on bolt action suppressors and would like some feedback.

First off I was surprised at the dislike for over barrel cans but the aspect about the multitude of different barrel profiles is dead on. Having a QD definitely makes the fitting easier since you don't have to mess around with a dozen barrel profiles and can still achieve a reasonable two point system with a decent QD brake. I never considered this since the semis I have been making them for were relatively standardized. Over barrel suppressors can be too far over the barrel in my opinion like some of the Reflex since the gasses are hard to drive too far back the opposite way, especially on a semi auto. I still like a minimum of over barrel in the range of 50 -65mm since this depth can be efficiently utilized and even up to 120 for bolt guns.

The surefire over barrel QD can is so small at 38mm that after the barrel and QD fitting going all the way back, there is barely any room for the gas anyway. Many makers are limited by tubing sizes for the can diameter and cost of going off axis for the can shape to reduce the profile. What would be the optimum height above the bore axis if you had a choice? Would a off axis design be of any interest?

I am still limited by length for a few more weeks but could do a can around the size of the SL7 right now. For pure long range accuracy I like the concept mentioned by Chris with the shoulder 100 - 125mm aft of the threads so that the barrel is tensioned with a direct thread on mount. I will be building one of these for my Rem 700 in the next three weeks for a test with about 80mm aft of muzzle and 100 forward since I want a small handy can that will remain 24" after the can is on. In the near future this could be made into a longer version.

So how would you rank the following:

Height above bore
Overall can diameter
In line can versus off axis
Length past barrel
QD
Weight
Sound
Cost

Keep in mind that often making one parameter better will make another parameter worse.

As to our latest developments, an AR10 can is under test and is working well (with an adjustable gas block) even as it is glowing from mag dumps. The internals of all cans are getting a new heat treat which provides a harder surface inside the can as well as out while increasing the ductility. The QD is progressing but not finished. We are in contact with an overseas testing company to get our cans independently tested.

Thanks.

I would like to see a relatively compact (less than 150mm length) relatively light (~400gms? or less preferably) , muzzle-forward or absolutely minimally overbarrel .223 suppressor with locking QD that attaches to a decent brake and won't fall apart in 500 rounds, and in a reasonable diameter (45mm or less)

ie similar to the Surefire Mini, Gemtech G5, Ase Utra SL5BL, etc.

I would definitely buy that.

Also it's a niche in the market you could fill since there are currently ZERO suppressors like that available in NZ, or at least, zero that are advertised anywhere.

Originally Posted by gimp

overbarrels have very little volume in the rear section unless you go quite wide, weight/volume ratio is less efficient, can't be swapped between multiple guns (as made by most NZers anyway), also trap heat in the barrel etc

Also I don't like overbarrel on an AR because I like to have a handguard as close to the muzzle as possible (ie 13" hg on 14.5" barrel) for control + sight radius reasons and I like slim handguards because fat ones are terrible. I also don't like the "suppressor inside handguard" thing.

Originally Posted by ODL

I just started reading this thread last night. There is a lot of good info here and since I am about to start in on bolt action suppressors and would like some feedback.

First off I was surprised at the dislike for over barrel cans but the aspect about the multitude of different barrel profiles is dead on. Having a QD definitely makes the fitting easier since you don't have to mess around with a dozen barrel profiles and can still achieve a reasonable two point system with a decent QD brake. I never considered this since the semis I have been making them for were relatively standardized. Over barrel suppressors can be too far over the barrel in my opinion like some of the Reflex since the gasses are hard to drive too far back the opposite way, especially on a semi auto. I still like a minimum of over barrel in the range of 50 -65mm since this depth can be efficiently utilized and even up to 120 for bolt guns.

The surefire over barrel QD can is so small at 38mm that after the barrel and QD fitting going all the way back, there is barely any room for the gas anyway. Many makers are limited by tubing sizes for the can diameter and cost of going off axis for the can shape to reduce the profile. What would be the optimum height above the bore axis if you had a choice? Would a off axis design be of any interest?

I am still limited by length for a few more weeks but could do a can around the size of the SL7 right now. For pure long range accuracy I like the concept mentioned by Chris with the shoulder 100 - 125mm aft of the threads so that the barrel is tensioned with a direct thread on mount. I will be building one of these for my Rem 700 in the next three weeks for a test with about 80mm aft of muzzle and 100 forward since I want a small handy can that will remain 24" after the can is on. In the near future this could be made into a longer version.

So how would you rank the following:

Height above bore
Overall can diameter
In line can versus off axis
Length past barrel
QD
Weight
Sound
Cost

Keep in mind that often making one parameter better will make another parameter worse.

As to our latest developments, an AR10 can is under test and is working well (with an adjustable gas block) even as it is glowing from mag dumps. The internals of all cans are getting a new heat treat which provides a harder surface inside the can as well as out while increasing the ductility. The QD is progressing but not finished. We are in contact with an overseas testing company to get our cans independently tested.

Thanks.

How are you getting on with your suppressors ??

Thanks for the feed back Gimp. I was working on the QD all weekend and I still don't like it yet. It is nearly there but not quite.

The suppressors are still cranking along 7mmsaum but no cans made specifically for bolt guns yet. The AR10 is in use on a LAR8 and will also be tested on my remy shortly and will be a nice short handy can. It survived several mag dumps of 308 (70 rounds til it was nearly glowing). Longer quieter cans are still a few weeks off.

I am still listening for any feedback that people have. I can't promise they will all get built into a can, but I will do my best.

What kind of QD? Hopefully locking? Ratchet type or similar? Good to hear there's progress

Originally Posted by ODL

Thanks for the feed back Gimp. I was working on the QD all weekend and I still don't like it yet. It is nearly there but not quite.

The suppressors are still cranking along 7mmsaum but no cans made specifically for bolt guns yet. The AR10 is in use on a LAR8 and will also be tested on my remy shortly and will be a nice short handy can. It survived several mag dumps of 308 (70 rounds til it was nearly glowing). Longer quieter cans are still a few weeks off.

I am still listening for any feedback that people have. I can't promise they will all get built into a can, but I will do my best.

Great news

I am actually working on a new type of QD. I will probably use the ratchet mount for end mount cans though since there is a lot of interest and it is dead simple to make. I apologize if it seems slow but there are a lot of new products I am working on and will have two two subsonic cans out next week (9mm and BLK). Of course the BLK will work with supersonic and non magnum 30 cal as well.

The bolt gun design is really gelling in my mind and will be committed to solid model next week. Sound tests from an independent source is about two weeks away for the 556-45 can.

Great to hear! 300blk uppers landed and cleared customs yesterday and arriving here tommorow. Cant wait to test.

I hope the guys doing your sound testing , do it to MIL STD 1474C , if they donot , the results are meaning less , as these are the Standard required .
And if they are not , you just paid some one to do Nothing !!!
But then , you maybe knew that already .

Still waiting for your bolt gun cans .

Later Chris

Mil STD? I was just going to give it to some bloke with an app on his phone.

You're dead right there Chris, testing needs to be done correctly if it is to have any value as an objective standard. It also means training in the process to ensure you are getting consistent results with other professionals. This bloke has trained under Alan Paulson, Phil Dater and John Titsworth and uses a B & K 2209.

I could get a meter and read the mil spec, but unless someone who was previously trained pointed out how to do it correctly, my results would be questionable unless another professional could duplicate them. Also, the fact that there is a conflict of interest in doing my own testing unless it is for internal evaluation which means that I wouldn't feel right in publishing results of my tests.

Based on some input by you, Gimp and others I am narrowing down on a brake that recesses about 40 to 50 mm from the muzzle and provides a true two point, tensioned fit. Since most guns will need threading anyway, we might as well make the fitting optimal for accuracy and strength with a minimum of barrel turning.

The brake can either be very good as a brake, a pretty good brake with minimal dust signature (in other words directing the none of the gas down or straight out the sides), or optimum for the suppressor first stage. All three can be made easily and people can choose what they want to optimize with can on or can off. If I make the brakes for the can to mount on, none of them will be as good as a brake made to do one job only.

Diameter is in the 43 - 46 range although I would like to go a bit larger for 338. Any further comments are appreciated.