Thread: Big Sevens... Which one for the 195 Berger.....?

Originally Posted by Kiwi Greg

I have plenty of brass & Bergers here, might even have some dies

Have emailed you

I burn a barrel or 3 a year.
Let me guess ur gunsmith says ur throats stuffed on ur .920
Replace barrel
Ask him to cut 2 inch off the burnt out barrel and get it reamed .
See what he says .
Get ur barrel made 2 in longer and double its life.

Originally Posted by 6MMBR

I burn a barrel or 3 a year.
Let me guess ur gunsmith says ur throats stuffed on ur .920
Replace barrel
Ask him to cut 2 inch off the burnt out barrel and get it reamed .
See what he says .
Get ur barrel made 2 in longer and double its life.

Yeah kinda doesnt work on a Carbon barrel.....

That is because you need two inches of longer steel on the action side of your barrel ;-)
That would be the ruin of The barrel maker!

Dropped off the barrel / action and brake to the smith.

Brass is on it's way with some 175 ELD-X, Still trying to get a box of 195 Bergers off @Kiwi Greg

Going with a R700 Detachable Mag action / stock. The mag has 3.6" of usable length and feeds my 338 Lap factory rounds so heaps of room. Should be a 2+1 setup which is more than enough oomph!

When barrel number two goes on I might go to a HS Stock and AICS setup like the 338 Lap.





From the left 7mm Blaser Mag, 300 Norma Improved, 300RUM.

Next update should be a dummy round and ladder test, Rifle ETA Jan 17.

Nice
What flavour barrel is it?
Have you thought of going 7mm 300 Blaser Magnum?
Not so over bored but still has huge capacity

Originally Posted by Kiwi Greg

No having accuracy issues at the moment.

Not the sort of calibre you want to have accuracy problems to sort out...I feel your pain
Hopefully you sort it before the barrel is burnt out😉

Originally Posted by Echo

Nice
What flavour barrel is it?
Have you thought of going 7mm 300 Blaser Magnum?
Not so over bored but still has huge capacity

Yeah looked at it but wanted to stick with the original idea. If it is not what I'm after can stick to vanilla 300 Norma.

Bartlein barrel. Fyi I don't expect it to last more than 300 rounds, it's second hand already and for load development

Hi 300BLK,
We have been using a 300NM necked to 7mm and improved for some years now, that we call our 7mm Fatmax. It is our favourite 7mm lightweight long range hunting cartridge these days, and we have built a bunch of them for customers over the last 5 years. (Initially was the 338 NM parent case) The go-to load for many years now has been the 180gn Berger Hybrid at around 3200 to 3250fps out of a 26" barrel. We used to use US869 but now mainly Reloder33.
Barrel life wise as a hunting rifle you should get a comfortable 500 rounds, especially out of a cut rifled Bartlein. We use 8" twist Bartleins for all our 7mm Fatmax builds now. We build them mainly as super lightweight rifles like the one you see us using on the TV Show, and that one has had over 500 rounds and still shoots.
You will not get 3200 to 3300fps with the 195gn Berger out of the 7mm/300NM imp for two reasons.
One, pressure, sticking to 65,000psi you'll get about 3100fps out of a 26" and 3150fps-ish out of a 28", and that's with US869 which produces the most velocity for the least pressure. Re33 with be a tad less.
Two, the 195s don't seem to shoot at anything over about 3175fps from our experience. Keep them to 3150fps and they're tack drivers. We tried them in our biggest 7mm, the 7mm FX (used to be the 7mm SF that Stu was talking about, all our FXs are based on the 338 Lapua imp case), and drove them to approaching 3300fps, but they would not shoot until we backed them off to 3150fps. A 28" 7mm Fatmax achieves this with better barrel life so no point in the 7mmFX if you wanna shoot the 195s.
The 7mmFX with the 180gn Hybrids will do 3400fps though, and there ain't much flatter than that, but the higher BC of the 195s is better in the wind.

If you run the numbers out of 28" barrels on the 195s at 3150 out of the 7mm Fatmax, verses the 230gn Hybrid at 3200fps out of our 300FX, verses the 300gn Hybrid at 2950fps out of our 338FX, you see they're all pretty much neck and neck in the wind all the way to 1500 yards, except the 7mm Fatmax/195gn combo does it with a shit load less recoil and powder. The 338FX doesn't start to edge ahead in the wind until 2000 yards. Obviously the terminal performance of the fatter heavier bullets is theoretically commensurately better, but we haven't found the 195s lacking in our limited terminal testing so far.

How have you found them KG? Have you managed to stick one into anything at range yet, or is it still too early in your testing for that?
Mates in the US have tested their terminal performance more extensively, and not found them lacking.

We think there's a huge potential for the 195s in the 7mm Fatmax - not because it will outdo the bigger FXs, but because it will equal them ballistically in a much lighter rifle - which certainly appeals for our wilderness hunting expeditions!

Sounds like you've already decided to go this way anyway 300BLK, but hopefully our results will give you some reassurance you've made the right choice!

Great info thanks GregD

What weight is your 7mm Fatmax?
Assuming you are using a radial brake what is recoil like?

Our personal 7mm Fatmax weighs about 6.6 lbs including the 3.5-18 Swaro scope. Its a pussy to shoot with just a radial type brake, but we fit some with our 7000 series alloy angled port directional brakes for those who feel they want more. We personally only have these on the bigger FX series with the heavier projectiles. Not needed on the Fatmax really though, and the radial is better for when you're taking the brake on and off for spook and shoot mode when we're walking without hearing protection, and then winding back on when we want to take a long shot with plugs in. All brakes will creep on the shoulder over time with many on and offs, and it doesn't matter with a radial but is annoying as it starts to index wrong with a directional.

I can understand the gongs at very long distance would be fun but in my opinion and my opinion only hunting at that range would be un ethical hunting
one slight miss calculation or a gust at the Wrong time and the animal has a round through its back legs its most likely going to get somewhere you cant see it to get a follow up and how long is it going to take someone on foot to cover that distance find the poor thing and finish it off

I would limit hunting distance to a distance where you could hit a 6"x6" gong every shot in any conditions cold bore without fail

Originally Posted by rambo-6mmrem

I can understand the gongs at very long distance would be fun but in my opinion and my opinion only hunting at that range would be un ethical hunting
one slight miss calculation or a gust at the Wrong time and the animal has a round through its back legs its most likely going to get somewhere you cant see it to get a follow up and how long is it going to take someone on foot to cover that distance find the poor thing and finish it off

I would limit hunting distance to a distance where you could hit a 6"x6" gong every shot in any conditions cold bore without fail

Yes and this is my opinion There is no difference in risk at any distance if you consider experience and sound systems. I know guys who could consistently 'kill' to that distance, I also know a lot of people cannot ethically kill at 50 metres. Whether they are using inaccurate rifles, don't know where the kill zones are or are simply taking dumb shots. The point is good practise, good tools and good knowledge amount to ethical kills, not distance

This thread is about big Sevens and 195 Bergers...not about you're ability as a shooter

Some great info has been given on the subject by some knowledgeable guys that are freely sharing this info

Lets try keep it on track

Amen @Gibo. I have seen many a fuckup under 100m on animals. Get out there and practice with the all the gear you're using in the field until you are good to go. Know you're limits!

Cheers for the info @GregD.