Thread: Calibre for over a Deer Dog

the 2 pigs I shot a week ago would seem to be rather typicle of bush shooting ranges...dog was approx 10mtrs infront out slightly to my left say at 10:00...spotted bedded pigs head at say 1:30-2:00 at same range..had mere seconds to do positive ID thing and shoot before we were busted. shot first pig,got dog onto it ,stepped forward and spotted 2nd pig moving off at 3:00 so shot that aswell. dog was infront of me both shots but not in direct line of fire....its been the same on all the deer Ive shot with her in bush too,well since she came off long line. if I have time and space to get her sitting or behind me I will do so...but not always feasable.

[QUOTE=Tentman;699635]Gidday

A cobber is after a bolt action rifle to shoot suppressed over a pointing dog in the bush. He's got the usual 308, 270 and 223 but doesn't think they are as quiet as he'd like.

We have been discussing the likes of the 300 BLK and 7.62x39 and I wonder about a 44 Mag.

Can your friend find some one to reload for him locally, suppressed full power loads are not quiet and can damage a dogs hearing badly, subsonic loads cuts down the range to 100 metres
unless you practise regularly at distance shooting, A subsonic .44 Mag loaded with 250 grain + bullets packs a hefty punch at 1000 fps and is capable of downing a red at 100 + metres
If you can't find a local reloader try Mark Bridgman at Custom Cartridges Taupo 07 378 4593

I came close to converting a Tikka .223 into a suppressed 300 BLK to hunt over my dog in bush hunting situations. I think this is a good option if you're shooting a lot of deer or have a particularly sensitive dog. Being able to switch between subs and supers, and the short barrel options make the 300 BLK pretty cool. But if you're like me and can only get out 5-10 times a year and want to make the most of every opportunity (e.g., deer out past 200m) and your dog is pretty robust then makes less sense, given the limited range.

I have ended up getting a suppressed Remington Model 7 in .260. (Have been hunting over my dog with a suppressed .308 for several years, and she's always much more focused on the deer than the bang so I think we'll be fine.)

man I dont get it...... supressed .223 ISNT loud at all,hells beels Batman they were very popular back in the day BEFORE suppressors as the noise didnt carry far. you still only using 25ish grns of powder vs 40ish for .308 case size or 60-70ish for dirty06 sized case.surely all things being equal noise goes up with volume of powder burnt???
guys I hunt with all comment on how quiet my .223 is with gunworks spartan fitted.... she had a fair bark bare as barrel isnt long.

I have a rossi in 44 and shoot 300grn XTP at 1025 fps with a Maximus suppressor. It is very accurate will group 3 shots into 2" at 100mtrs no problem and as The Bomb says all you hear is a loud thwhack as the bullet hits. But the projectiles are too hard and don't mushroom like a 22 sub. I think a cast 325 - 350 HP would be getting seriously good. Doing the twist rate calculations they would stabilize in the Rossi. Does anyone know where I could get some ?.

Something to consider regarding subs when comparing different calibers, is that because the bullets are all starting at the same speed then drop will be the same with only a marginal difference for bullet design. Drop is a factor of force of gravity over time of flight. So a 44 at 1025 and a 30 cal at 1025fps will have the same time of flight to 100mtrs and the same drop. Because there is no hydrostatic shock with subs then a bigger diameter projectile is much better than small.

You are on the right track for sure. What platform can you use for a 500 SW .? The only down side is that as you get bigger in diameter there is a bigger hole for gas to escape out of the suppressor quickly so the 44 is not as quiet as a 22 and the 500 will be noisier again. That is why I have a comparatively large suppressor even though I am only burning 7 grms of powder.

Originally Posted by OWS

I came close to converting a Tikka .223 into a suppressed 300 BLK to hunt over my dog in bush hunting situations. I think this is a good option if you're shooting a lot of deer or have a particularly sensitive dog. Being able to switch between subs and supers, and the short barrel options make the 300 BLK pretty cool. But if you're like me and can only get out 5-10 times a year and want to make the most of every opportunity (e.g., deer out past 200m) and your dog is pretty robust then makes less sense, given the limited range.

I have ended up getting a suppressed Remington Model 7 in .260. (Have been hunting over my dog with a suppressed .308 for several years, and she's always much more focused on the deer than the bang so I think we'll be fine.)

That’s what I ended up doing rebarreled a Tikka T3 223rem into a 12” 300 blackout and spend between 80 and 100 days a year deer stalking with the hound, he lives for it more than me and so seriously focused on the stalk. With nearly 4000 rounds through the blackout I wouldn’t want to shoot a large caliber rifle over him he would be deaf like me, only 25% and 35% hearing in my ears now.
The shot placement and the projectile for the job is important than how many feet pre second with any given common caliber just look at the old cullers using 222. Years ago i was happy dropping deer with a 223 and a 7.62x39 but guys would say there pea shooters so I got a magnum, it didn’t make a difference except I could drop two deer with one bullet and have a bad shot and shoot them in the guts they still run away.
There’s two mates and myself that use a subsonic 300 blackout for deer hunting and home kill farm work deer, beef, sheep as well as pest control goats, bunnies, coons, wild cats. The 10/22 doesn’t get used much theses days of the high caliber guns.

Originally Posted by Moa Hunter

I have a rossi in 44 and shoot 300grn XTP at 1025 fps with a Maximus suppressor. It is very accurate will group 3 shots into 2" at 100mtrs no problem and as The Bomb says all you hear is a loud thwhack as the bullet hits. But the projectiles are too hard and don't mushroom like a 22 sub. I think a cast 325 - 350 HP would be getting seriously good. Doing the twist rate calculations they would stabilize in the Rossi. Does anyone know where I could get some ?.

Something to consider regarding subs when comparing different calibers, is that because the bullets are all starting at the same speed then drop will be the same with only a marginal difference for bullet design. Drop is a factor of force of gravity over time of flight. So a 44 at 1025 and a 30 cal at 1025fps will have the same time of flight to 100mtrs and the same drop. Because there is no hydrostatic shock with subs then a bigger diameter projectile is much better than small.Attachment 86709

shootersnz....where are you Robert?????

What caliber was the neighbours rifle ?. With the 44 I can use subs and have some High velocity loads for shots out to 200 metres which is a long shot in most situations anyway.
Personally if starting from scratch I would go for a 45/70 single shot hammer gun like an H&R or CVA Scout. The standard 45/70 barrel has a fast twist rate to stabilize a 450 grn HP Sub and you can still shoot a High velocity 300grainer for anything out of range of the Subs. The 450 HP sub will flatten a red stag or Sambar according to a friend who used them meat hunting.

I am going to sell a Douglas 44 mag barrel blank with a 1 in 16 twist. I was going to use it for subsonic project but I never started and it is accumulating dust.

There are some other threads going under '45/70 subsonic' with all the answers