Thread: Desirable features of an all round NZ hunting rifle

actually im kidding, theres a lot of 270s out come elk season. for an all around rifle either a featherweight 7x57 65.55 or my old standby a light weight 30-06 with 130 or 150gr.

Originally Posted by caberslash

Surely an unmolested .222 L461 Sako Vixen with period correct Leupold or Euro low power premium scope is the correct answer?

Your crosshairs and bullets will be guided by the force, of the old NZFS Deer cullers, both living and departed.

Yes caber im sure the said vixen has been used all round NZ with great success, by expert marksmen.

Likewise various SMLE have been used all round and successfully by average marksmen. I had shot alll the above mentioned species with my mk III*. The wallaby was i admit only from a range of 2 inches.

The drawback of both weapons, specially the .222 is the cartridge. A TRUE all rounder needs to be useable by truly mediocre stalkers and shooters, with good success. That’s why i suggested the 3006.

This wasnt the original question . That was “desirable features”. But, we must be systematic.

Reliability: feed specially. In dirt, mud, deer hair, someone elses ammo.
Toughness: in wet, dropping on rocks, used as walking stick or tent pole.
Stability: zero not to move in wet or dry or after a knock.
Durability: same function after 10 years of hard use. Scope not fogged, barrell not rusted out, stock and bedding still ok ( these can be maintained of course.
Accuracy only needs to be 2 moa if the zero is truly stable.
Power: kill and recover game even with marginal shots eg a bit far back in the ribs.
Optics adequate to identify game and non game, see deer clearly in dark bush and at 200m in evening. Accurate adjustments when sighting in. Not fog. Good reticle.
Shootability: stock trigger and scope placement.
3 shot mag at least.
Weight depends on hunters physique but for an average 80kg bloke 3.5 - 4 kg all up with bolt and ammo. Over 4kg us doecialised for semi target or long range.
Gizmos: needs sling. Suppressor optional. Bipod is specialised for a minority of hunting and capability to fit one is not essential. Dialup sights and parallax not essential.

This wasnt the original question . That was “desirable features”. But, we must be systematic.

Reliability: feed specially. In dirt, mud, deer hair, someone elses ammo.
Toughness: in wet, dropping on rocks, used as walking stick or tent pole.
Stability: zero not to move in wet or dry or after a knock.
Durability: same function after 10 years of hard use. Scope not fogged, barrell not rusted out, stock and bedding still ok ( these can be maintained of course.
Accuracy only needs to be 2 moa if the zero is truly stable.
Power: kill and recover game even with marginal shots eg a bit far back in the ribs.
Optics adequate to identify game and non game, see deer clearly in dark bush and at 200m in evening. Accurate adjustments when sighting in. Not fog. Good reticle.
Shootability: stock trigger and scope placement.
3 shot mag at least.
Weight depends on hunters physique but for an average 80kg bloke 3.5 - 4 kg all up with bolt and ammo. Over 4kg is specialised for semi target or long range.
Gizmos: needs sling. Suppressor optional. Bipod is specialised for a minority of hunting and capability to fit one is not essential. Dialup sights and parallax not essential.

kimber. with a. montana.

Originally Posted by Bagheera

The drawback of both weapons, specially the .222 is the cartridge. A TRUE all rounder needs to be useable by truly mediocre stalkers and shooters, with good success. That’s why i suggested the 3006.

Seen many grown men flinch with a .308 and 150 grain bullets, god help them if given a 30-06 running 180 grain pills.

Many will remember that the .222 held benchrest world records for a long time, at 200m and under I'd either have that or the 223 (my rifle).

The .243 that I am building (Howa Alpine) could be good at to 3-400m odd with some tweaking, once the barrel burns out I might get a slightly fatter contour with faster twist put on.

Originally Posted by Bagheera

This wasnt the original question . That was “desirable features”. But, we must be systematic.

Reliability: feed specially. In dirt, mud, deer hair, someone elses ammo.
Toughness: in wet, dropping on rocks, used as walking stick or tent pole.
Stability: zero not to move in wet or dry or after a knock.
Durability: same function after 10 years of hard use. Scope not fogged, barrell not rusted out, stock and bedding still ok ( these can be maintained of course.
Accuracy only needs to be 2 moa if the zero is truly stable.
Power: kill and recover game even with marginal shots eg a bit far back in the ribs.
Optics adequate to identify game and non game, see deer clearly in dark bush and at 200m in evening. Accurate adjustments when sighting in. Not fog. Good reticle.
Shootability: stock trigger and scope placement.
3 shot mag at least.
Weight depends on hunters physique but for an average 80kg bloke 3.5 - 4 kg all up with bolt and ammo. Over 4kg is specialised for semi target or long range.
Gizmos: needs sling. Suppressor optional. Bipod is specialised for a minority of hunting and capability to fit one is not essential. Dialup sights and parallax not essential.

You will always need to compromise somewhere, better to know your own limits and that of your equipment.

'All rounders' will never work as good as something specialised.

Anyone know if you can get a Browning Xbolt in 6.8 Western in N.Z yet? That would be it for me, suppressed with some euro glass

Originally Posted by Bagheera

This wasnt the original question . That was “desirable features”. But, we must be systematic.
..
Durability: same function after 10 years of hard use. .., barrell not rusted out, ...

No firearm will ever survive that with an owner who is ignorant/slack on bore maintenance

Originally Posted by nor-west

Anyone know if you can get a Browning Xbolt in 6.8 Western in N.Z yet? That would be it for me, suppressed with some euro glass

Really? lol

i can understand, just to be different and sort of kind of a little bit cooler than the rest..... but fuck thats a Glorified 270 Winchester if ive ever read about it.

in which its not a 270 WSM

sounds gooooooooooood, Sorta, only because the 270 WIN is AWESOME and the 270 WSM is pretty good not bad little bit more Thanks....

but i agree, 6.8 sounds better as

Originally Posted by Rees

Really? lol

i can understand, just to be different and sort of kind of a little bit cooler than the rest..... but fuck thats a Glorified 270 Winchester if ive ever read about it.

in which its not a 270 WSM

sounds gooooooooooood, Sorta, only because the 270 WIN is AWESOME and the 270 WSM is pretty good not bad little bit more Thanks....

but i agree, 6.8 sounds better as

They come with a 1/ 7.5 twist barrel more projectile options

Originally Posted by caberslash

Seen many grown men flinch with a .308 and 150 grain bullets, god help them if given a 30-06 running 180 grain pills.

Many will remember that the .222 held benchrest world records for a long time, at 200m and under I'd either have that or the 223 (my rifle).

The .243 that I am building (Howa Alpine) could be good at to 3-400m odd with some tweaking, once the barrel burns out I might get a slightly fatter contour with faster twist put on.

True on the flinching, but not a reason to back off, I think.
Recoil is the reason an extra light (<3.5kg) rifle isn't an all rounder.

My limited observation is that in merrie England (not so sure for Scotland) the focus is on Roe and Sika deer, while outer liers are foxes, muntjac and Red ? It seemed to me that the 243 would be an ideal all rounder there. What are your thoughts ?
With the hassle of getting extensions to your FAC for additional rifles, I'd think the British might be the world experts in choosing an all rounder.

Interesting about the barrel burning out. The 243 has a pretty big case for the calibre - like a small sized magnum. What sort of life do people get ?

Originally Posted by Rees

kimber. with a. montana.

nearly perfect for me too, I would really like the floor plate they have on the wood stocked models fitted to my carbon stocks but in practice the blind mag works "good enough"

Originally Posted by nor-west

Anyone know if you can get a Browning Xbolt in 6.8 Western in N.Z yet? That would be it for me, suppressed with some euro glass

Greetings Nor-west,
After the initial splurge the 6.8 Western had just about disappeared without trace and I had all but forgotten about it. Thanks for reminding me.
Regards Grandpamac.

Originally Posted by mimms2

Ehhh???!

If you're shit at shooting, you probably shouldn't do it at animals...

If your groups look like buckshot, then probably limit yourself to actually using buckshot.

Mediocre shooting will always produce mediocre results. Add more recoil and the results become dreadful. The only fix for mediocre shooting is practice on targets, not animals. One reason I mourn the demise of 4P shooting in NZ. Putting 5 shots in a tiny group prone of a bipod tells you nothing about how well you can shoot even from sitting let alone standing. Actually shooting the positions does. Far back in this thread I suggested that the ability of the hunter to learn to shoot the rifle well was an important attribute for any rifle. That appears to have been lost along the way.
Regards Grandpamac. Resident curmudgoen and H.O.F.