Thread: Do you really need a long barrel? Chop it or not?

Brand new Rem700 in 308, 24in barrel
2 days later was in at DPT getting cut to 16in and a can put on.

Great gun

With the exception of two shot with a 303 at over 100y probably my first 50 deer could have been shot with a pistol.
I grew up in the no deer on tops or river flats era, if you wanted to find a deer you had to go bush..and do plenty of miles.

These days mostly I hunt open country after being a bit slow to discover they were back out there

I went from a stuffed 303 to a stuffed 308 because the 308 had a scope and was cool it was shortened 4" already with a hacksaw very crooked as the end of the barrel was bulged from a blockage, cost me $80....shot 3-5 inch groups at 100 paced yards.claimed many deer pigs and countless goats.
Upgrading to a Sako 308 saw a whole new world open around me! suddenly I could shoot things at incredible distances and things just fell over dead! 150y 200y 300y it was amazing!

I got cocky and had a couple of cock ups after that due to range estimation fails and a range finder was next on the list.

If you are starting out hunting I would suggest keep factory length unless you are never going to hunt open country, and if you are before you even leave the shop you should have a range finder and a understanding of how your caliber and ammo perform.

Yeah done that stuffing up the range of deer a few times before rangefinders. Have taken guys out hunting and ask what range is that deer 350 meters? no it's only 200m 5" of drop not 28" .
It's easy to over estimate or underestimate.

Originally Posted by 223nut

Chopped my 10/22 to 12 inches and hasn't actually changed much. Guess it depends on the quality of the rifle you start wih though

The biggest factor is the caliber. A 22 doesn't have much powder to burn so you could go with a 6" barrel and be OK. Even magnum calibers only lose velocity with shorter barrels so unless that matters to you chop away.

My wife says barrel length is very important, I thought a 10 inch barrel was short ..........................she seems happy

Originally Posted by MassiveAttack

The biggest factor is the caliber. A 22 doesn't have much powder to burn so you could go with a 6" barrel and be OK. Even magnum calibers only lose velocity with shorter barrels so unless that matters to you chop away.

Depending on the caliber and powder.

My main hunting rifle shows almost 200fps gain with the powder it likes in a 25inch barrel, I doubt the gain would even be noticeable in say a 16''

What does velocity matter? well lots and nothing. If a projectile is impacting in the velocity range(at the ranges and muzzle velocities shot at) it works well in then great everything works well but just having a projectile that will work at the expected distances and hence impact velocities while a good start is not all there is to think about.

Don't get me wrong I am all for a compact rifle in the bush but what a lot miss when doing the calcs on velocity and energy at range from their "bush pig" is windage.

Trying to send a relatively slow 30cal bullet with a piss poor bc over longish distances is like throwing an inflated balloon with a pebble in it at your sister on the other end of the section with a 90 mph cross wind .

You may have the theoretical bc and impact velocity for the projectile to work and the theoretical ft pounds (if you believe in that) at range with a short bush pig but windage is your enemy and by hell does a big slow blunt bullet drift.

Fine if you are well practised/know your drifts/and can accurately estimate wind speeds/direction and correction.
Plenty of guys on here can and do do the above but I cannot, i simply do not shoot enough and neither do most hunters, I can use an app and dial my drop accurately,shoot enough to shoot accurately enough for medium ranges but start lobbing balloons in the wind and its all over.

And that is where a few hundreds of feet per second make all the difference....especially for non expert shooters when the range gets out there and it doesn't even have to be very far.

I have several rifles and I was quite slow jumping on the suppressor bandwagon.

I first started running a suppressor on my 7Saum with the hot amax load for long shots as I was finding the recoil a bit stiff.

But this makes it quite long and I don't like caring it at that length, so keep the can in the pack until I reach a lookout or I'm ready for a long shot. A bit of a pain in the arse.

I've recently built a 17" barreled 284 win, with a magnum Dpt suppressor back to the forend of the stock. It still pushes the 162 Amax at 2800 fps. (Not that far behind the 3,000 the 22" 7Saum does)

The 17" 284win still holds 1,000 ft lbs to 900 yards. I generally don't shoot deer beyond 600 yards anyway and i'd be more than happy to shoot a deer at that range with this. Really the only rifle I would need to do it all from bush to tops, 6-600 yards.

Also got a 15" suppressed 708 model 7, it's a little honey too.

I found that one out a couple of weeks back trying to shoot hares at about a mere 150m with the 223 in severe gale force winds at 90 degrees to the flight path. Really even struggled to hold the rifle firmly enough with gusts grabbing at the suppressor. Thought I was Beckham the way the wind was bending the shot.

I don't really agree in principle. Accuracy is overrated when it comes to hunting deer in my opinion. I could have probably shot the same amount of deer I have done already with a rifle that wouldnt shoot better than a three inch group at 100 metres. But bullet performance is important to me. Probably why I handload - if a 180 grain bullet in a .30/06 should be going 2700 - 2800 fps than by golly I will have 2800 fps. Its what the bullet does when it gets there that is important to me.

I wouldnt keep a .30/06 than only gets 2500 fps with a 180 grain bullet, which means I would never buy a .30/06 with a 20 inch barrel or less.

I have a 270 that gets an honest 3100 fps with 130 grain bullets with a 24 inch barrel and I wouldnt touch it. That's what .270s are supposed to do. I have owned 17 and 18 inch barreled .270's and I will not again. Yes they would kill animals. I can kill animals with a truck. The point is that I am buying .270 performance.
A .308 I can see shortening to 20 inches depending on the rifle, but if it was a .30/06 I wouldn't. An '06 is supposed to perform to a certain level, that is the whole point of the bigger cartridge.
I wouldnt cut a .25/06 under 24 inches, or a 7mm RM either.

I just think that a standard 22 inch barrel is no big deal to carry, and I couldn't give up the velocity just to have a rifle thats easier to wave around. I have heard all the arguments about how the velocity loss is less than you think, and so on and so forth, and you only lose this much per inch and excetera, but I have chronographed a lot of rifles and loads.

I have enough to carry around already without a suppressor as well.

Here's an interesting article for you to consider when thinking of shortening barrel lenghts.

Daniel Zimmerman - the truth about barrel length muzzle velocity and accuracy

Originally Posted by Cyclops

Here's an interesting article for you to consider when thinking of shortening barrel lenghts.

Daniel Zimmerman - the truth about barrel length muzzle velocity and accuracy

Pretty much what everyone has been saying. Just a trade off of the things you want.

Theres no reason to cut a 308 cartidge family (or smaller) under 20" or a long action catridge under 22/23" if you are not going to suppress.

You will just deafen yourself faster...

In fact the only reason to cut factory length barrels is to suppress. Why else would you?

I've been back and forth thinking about getting my 7mm08 cut down.
If it's on my back its always that last inch that gets caught up in the steplejack.
I also thought it might make it easier for my 14yr son to shoulder.

It seems to me that most people, maybe everyone that cut their barrels do so because they fitting a can on the end of it. If you dont cut it its going to be extra long and a little more weight with the can so it makes sence. Normal hunting distances doesnt matter at all if you cut your barrel short or not, so each to their own.
At the same time its extra cost for the cut and re fit for a suppressor and i personally dont mine at all the standard barrel length and use my rifles how they come. My 308 is 24 inch, its no prob at all in the bush for hunting to carry and my 243 is 22 and thats fine also. I dont have them suppressed, and thats fine with me. Im getting the max performance out of both cals rather than if i cut either and when it comes to hearing this is how i see it.
Sighting in and mucking around you can and do wear hearing protection so no need for a can. If you long range hunting you have plenty of time to throw in some ear plugs etc and still no need for a can and the extra cost that comes with it.
Short range hunting, if goat shooting and thinking firing mutli shots again you have time to use ear protection and no need for a can.
Most other times one shot will drop that deer and i can live with that without a can and your hearing isnt going to go overnight, Using a dog a can makes sense, and prob should use one but otherwise its just a trade off with the extra cost of a suppressor v not using one. Firing shots all day week in and out without using ear protection or a can will stuff or hearing. if you shooting a couple or 4 deer a month without ear protection you hearing prob will survive ok.
Plus i dont agree you get more animals using a can. Firstly, i only want one animal so after i shoot one thats it. Secondly, ive shot many deer then walked around the corner and seen others and they would have certainly heard the shot hand havnt ran. Plus ive missed animals and the deer still have no idea where the shot came from and run at me for me to still knock it over. Certainly havnt lost deer because of no can and my hearing is still fine after years shooting rifles but do use protection when i can otherwise its a shot here and there and thats fine with me

deer243 pretty much sums it up for me too, I leave my Hi power rifles as they come, I don't need the added expense of a suppressor. I do use a suppressor on my 22 which comes from years of night shooting for the Pest Board. They had there place when shooting close to deer farms or flighty animals like horses. Back in those days we would shoot anything between 200- 400 rounds a night so it must have helped with the hearing a bit.