Thread: Firearm upgrade options?

For your purpose definitaly 1 or 5!

KIS !!!!

One man one gun!

Get a Tikka 243. 17lbs recoil against 12 lbs.

I get the “I want a new gun” itch, but I’d suggest you get to the bottom of accuracy issue with your 270 first. You say “ but I've treated it like a bush pig and accuracy is starting to waiver“. What does “ treating it like a bush pig” mean ?
As well as a recrown I’d suggest you look at your cleaning technique and methods. carbon or copper fouling will accumulate over time and cause accuracy problems. If left unaddressed will get worse over time and more rounds. What’s your cleaning regime? Try some good carbon and Cu solvents and/or bore paste or autosol before doing anything. You may find this fixes your accuracy problem in the 270.

Some other thoughts (you might have done some of this already?)

Howa is capable of good accurate rifles, but the stocks they often come with are not great, especially the Hogue stocks. Fine in the bush, but too “floppy” for longer range accurate shooting. This may also be source of accuracy issues. An investment in a good stiff stock, eg B&C, and a bedding job would be worth considering, especially for longer range shooting.

Is the 270 suppressed ? If not that would be my first investment

Optics, check that your bases and rings are torqued up correctly and not loose. What scope are you running ? If you can solve the accuracy issues with your 270, which might require a new stock and recrown, then you’ve got a rifle capable of 500-600 yards on deer provided you use the appropriate long range pills and the conditions and shooter are up to it. But depending on what current scope you have, you might want to upgrade to better scope for longer range shooting. Eg a quality 3-15 or 3-18x scope. The 270 could then be your longer range set up.

Reloading - really is the best answer for LR rifles. Gives you the best options for pills and powder/load to tweak best accuracy from your rifle.

Then for bush pig look at 308 or 708 with 16 or 18in bbl.

My mate has only one rifle, it is a 270 Tikka and he shoots Thar routinely. 270 will do everything you need.

You have already achieved #5: "Sell .270, buy something else that acts as an all rounder."
Change to read: #5: KEEP .270, it IS an all rounder!

Fix whatever accuracy problems you have with your current 270.

Hornady Reloading manual list five projectile weights from 100 - 150grn, so you have projectile options for different hunting scenarios.

My suggestion is:
- Buy one box of bullets for short range bush hunting (I used to use 180grn Nosler Partition in my 30-06)
- Buy a second box for long range Thar shooting
- Buy a third box of 100grn for small game, goats, hare, at long range
- *Unless you can find one round to rule them all!?

Acknowledging that guys who are doing long range shooting required BIGGER optics, buy a second scope. Have one scope, say, 2.5 - 6x or 3 - 9 x40mm (or FIXED POWER WTF!!!) for bush hunting, then a second BIG scope (25 x 56mm WTF) for long range shooting on the tops. Mount a picatinny rail on your 270 and when you leave the hut, carry your second scope (and a spanner), in your day pack. When you get above the bush line, swap scopes.

That might sound crazy, but I'm currently experimenting with exactly that set-up. It allows me to leave the car with my daylight scope attached, then change to my thermal after dark. The point of impact does change slightly, but I'm finding sighting-in is a one or two shots process. NOTE: I only have to sight-in to "minute of rabbit", not, "minute of nat's cock! Three bullets touching at 1000 metres and all that crap!"

Another option is buy a second rifle in 270 calibre, of the same Brand/model. Have one set-up for bush and one for open tops. By doing that, the "feel" is the same and your reloading is simplified, if and when you get into that. I've done that with my Weihrauch HW60J in 22LR, 22 Hornet, 222 Rem, I can change from rifle to rifle seamlessly, and reloading components, projectile, powder, primers (not brass or dies obviously) are the same/interchangeable.

Don't get too hung up on bush hunting with a long barrel. I've bush hunted all my life with a long barrelled 30-06. Now I bush hunt with a long barrel (whatever) with a suppressor fitted and you just get used to carrying what you are carrying.

5
But still with the 270 or any of the 08 based cases and you will be fine. Chop to 20 inches and suppress.
Then just choose your make. Howa Tikka bergara would all be fine. These brands all have multiple options should you want something different. Then when you are bush hunting feed it white tail corelokt or federal blue box. For long range have some superformance or precision hunter.
You don't need a massive calibre. Yes they have their advantages but the moon Magnum cals still work fine out to 600 max
Cheaper to buy ammo for also if you aren't reloading

Life's short, buy many rifles and enjoy.

Originally Posted by timattalon

I would go with 1 definitely, then possibly look at shortening it / suppressing it. Rather than a whole LR rig while you are starting out, find a scope that has a spread suitable for med LR and a low power (4-16 or 3-16 ) Use your budget here first....Then do two things
- Leave it at the lowest magnification when hunting as default...if a longer shot presents itself you will usually have time to adjust it and get ready for the shot....
- Learn to dial your scope and get a decent range finder. 270 with 140gr interlock whitetail at 500 yards is still very close to the 7mm RM interlock 139gr so 'trading up' will not make a great difference unless you go BIG.....(you can load biggger pills into the 7mmRM but the gains still do not justify the cost of a new rifle)
- Spend you new rifle budget on more ammo and get some practise in.....the more practise especially at med to longer ranges , the better....Especially if learning to dial...

The 270 is a good alrounder calibre...it will shoot further than most shooters are capable of. As you wear the Howa out over its life- or as any rifle starts to lose accuracy as it wears, then start to focus it more as a bush pig....But in the meantime it will be more than capable to do both.

Spending the money on some time at the range isn’t a bad idea. The .270 is actually already suppressed (although probably due for a replacement/upgrade, looking a bit worse for wear and is just a cheapy that came with the rifle), and is equipped with a Burris Sig. HD 3-15x44, so is pretty much good to go as you say.

Originally Posted by ChrisW

Option 5 imo.
All you really need is a more long range capable caliber in a reasonably light weight setup. A 7mm mag or 300wm would be the go id think.

Id not suggest a heavy dedicated LR rig unless you actually wanted to do LR target shooting. Even then a hunting rifle in a suitable cal would do. An actual LR rig is a very specialized thing.

I think this would be my first choice but there’s some good arguments to be made to justify keeping the .270. I really like the idea of a suppressed 7mmRM chopped down to 21”, with something like a 3-18 scope. The thought of lugging around a heavy dedicated LR rig doesn’t sound fun so I think that options out the window.

Originally Posted by chainsaw

I get the “I want a new gun” itch, but I’d suggest you get to the bottom of accuracy issue with your 270 first. You say “ but I've treated it like a bush pig and accuracy is starting to waiver“. What does “ treating it like a bush pig” mean ?
As well as a recrown I’d suggest you look at your cleaning technique and methods. carbon or copper fouling will accumulate over time and cause accuracy problems. If left unaddressed will get worse over time and more rounds. What’s your cleaning regime? Try some good carbon and Cu solvents and/or bore paste or autosol before doing anything. You may find this fixes your accuracy problem in the 270.

Some other thoughts (you might have done some of this already?)

Howa is capable of good accurate rifles, but the stocks they often come with are not great, especially the Hogue stocks. Fine in the bush, but too “floppy” for longer range accurate shooting. This may also be source of accuracy issues. An investment in a good stiff stock, eg B&C, and a bedding job would be worth considering, especially for longer range shooting.

Is the 270 suppressed ? If not that would be my first investment

Optics, check that your bases and rings are torqued up correctly and not loose. What scope are you running ? If you can solve the accuracy issues with your 270, which might require a new stock and recrown, then you’ve got a rifle capable of 500-600 yards on deer provided you use the appropriate long range pills and the conditions and shooter are up to it. But depending on what current scope you have, you might want to upgrade to better scope for longer range shooting. Eg a quality 3-15 or 3-18x scope. The 270 could then be your longer range set up.

Reloading - really is the best answer for LR rifles. Gives you the best options for pills and powder/load to tweak best accuracy from your rifle.

Then for bush pig look at 308 or 708 with 16 or 18in bbl.

Well when I say I’ve treated it like a bush pig I mean stuff like when I’ve gone to load a round I can feel resistance in the chamber when closing the bolt, likely a piece of leaf or something, but still shot it anyway, shot it with stuff down the barrel from bush whacking and a barrel plug of dirt or two and also just send it rather than putting a bore buddy through it (these are all for close range shots for long range I would do a quick once over). I’d still give it the odd clean but honestly probably once every half dozen hunts, I’d put a bore buddy through it a bit though. When I did clean I’d just use the standard Hobbs kit according to instructions. I haven’t put a large number of rounds through it though it’s only been for hunting and sighting in at the range, I’d say around 200.

The stock is very flimsy you’re right, it probably doesn’t help especially considering I am hardly shooting in the same conditions out on the bush, sometimes using bipod sometimes off a bag etc. It is suppressed but probably due for replacement, still using the stealth suppressor that came with it.

Running Burris Signature HD 3-15x44, I find it plenty capable, wouldn’t mind a tad more at those longer ranges mainly to identify specific animals amongst a group but it does the job well.

I think I am leaning towards not getting a bush pig as it would just be too limiting in 95% of the places I hunt. For example my most successful hunt last year resulted in a 12 pointer shot at 10m and a 10 pointer shot at 350m (ruahines), and the spot they were shot from is only 40m away from each other. For this I am thinking an all rounder would be better suited.

Originally Posted by Hugh Shields

My mate has only one rifle, it is a 270 Tikka and he shoots Thar routinely. 270 will do everything you need.

You have already achieved #5: "Sell .270, buy something else that acts as an all rounder."
Change to read: #5: KEEP .270, it IS an all rounder!

Fix whatever accuracy problems you have with your current 270.

Hornady Reloading manual list five projectile weights from 100 - 150grn, so you have projectile options for different hunting scenarios.

My suggestion is:
- Buy one box of bullets for short range bush hunting (I used to use 180grn Nosler Partition in my 30-06)
- Buy a second box for long range Thar shooting
- Buy a third box of 100grn for small game, goats, hare, at long range
- *Unless you can find one round to rule them all!?

Acknowledging that guys who are doing long range shooting required BIGGER optics, buy a second scope. Have one scope, say, 2.5 - 6x or 3 - 9 x40mm (or FIXED POWER WTF!!!) for bush hunting, then a second BIG scope (25 x 56mm WTF) for long range shooting on the tops. Mount a picatinny rail on your 270 and when you leave the hut, carry your second scope (and a spanner), in your day pack. When you get above the bush line, swap scopes.

That might sound crazy, but I'm currently experimenting with exactly that set-up. It allows me to leave the car with my daylight scope attached, then change to my thermal after dark. The point of impact does change slightly, but I'm finding sighting-in is a one or two shots process. NOTE: I only have to sight-in to "minute of rabbit", not, "minute of nat's cock! Three bullets touching at 1000 metres and all that crap!"

Another option is buy a second rifle in 270 calibre, of the same Brand/model. Have one set-up for bush and one for open tops. By doing that, the "feel" is the same and your reloading is simplified, if and when you get into that. I've done that with my Weihrauch HW60J in 22LR, 22 Hornet, 222 Rem, I can change from rifle to rifle seamlessly, and reloading components, projectile, powder, primers (not brass or dies obviously) are the same/interchangeable.

Don't get too hung up on bush hunting with a long barrel. I've bush hunted all my life with a long barrelled 30-06. Now I bush hunt with a long barrel (whatever) with a suppressor fitted and you just get used to carrying what you are carrying.

The ballistics data on the premium rounds certainly backs it up as well the .270 is near the performance of 7mmRM, just not quite the same punching power at those longer ranges. You guys are convincing me to keep the .270 lol

I do wonder about the accuracy with the picatinny rail, knew someone with one and he said it was within 1.5MOA, probably good enough for most shooting but out to those big ranges might be enough to throw it off.

My mate has a short 18” bush pig and when we’re crawling through some supplejack it soon makes you wonder if the extra few inches on the barrel is worth it lol

Originally Posted by Remmodel7

5
But still with the 270 or any of the 08 based cases and you will be fine. Chop to 20 inches and suppress.
Then just choose your make. Howa Tikka bergara would all be fine. These brands all have multiple options should you want something different. Then when you are bush hunting feed it white tail corelokt or federal blue box. For long range have some superformance or precision hunter.
You don't need a massive calibre. Yes they have their advantages but the moon Magnum cals still work fine out to 600 max
Cheaper to buy ammo for also if you aren't reloading

I think if I was going to stick to the .270 calibre I’d rather keep the Howa since I’ve got history with it lol that is assuming I can get it accurate again. Have been running blue box from the beginning, definitely will get some precision hunter if I go that route

Ok, based on your further info the Burris Hd 3-15x44 is a good option for bush and out to that 5-600 yards.
The areas I’d be focussing on is a thorough clean of barrel with something like Boretech Eliminator and probably 2-3 cycles of that allowing for a 20-30min soak time. Then lots of patches and neutralise with Hoppes. Then I’d run JBs bore paste or Autosol thru bbl, then flush out with plenty of Hoppes then dry patches. If you’ve fired it with a dirt plug in muzzle you may have damaged not just the crown but also the last couple of inches. Worth getting a gunsmith to look at it.
Then I’d be replacing the stock either B&C or similar or a carbon fibre job, and bedding it. Pull the Hogue stock off completely and what crap is trapped in bbl channel and around action.

A 20 or 21 bbl 270 will cover all your bases, but get a decent suppressor. The 270 is pretty barkie let alone chopping it shorter. Perhaps a DPT with an extra ss baffle.

Originally Posted by chainsaw

Ok, based on your further info the Burris Hd 3-15x44 is a good option for bush and out to that 5-600 yards.
The areas I’d be focussing on is a thorough clean of barrel with something like Boretech Eliminator and probably 2-3 cycles of that allowing for a 20-30min soak time. Then lots of patches and neutralise with Hoppes. Then I’d run JBs bore paste or Autosol thru bbl, then flush out with plenty of Hoppes then dry patches. If you’ve fired it with a dirt plug in muzzle you may have damaged not just the crown but also the last couple of inches. Worth getting a gunsmith to look at it.
Then I’d be replacing the stock either B&C or similar or a carbon fibre job, and bedding it. Pull the Hogue stock off completely and what crap is trapped in bbl channel and around action.

A 20 or 21 bbl 270 will cover all your bases, but get a decent suppressor. The 270 is pretty barkie let alone chopping it shorter. Perhaps a DPT with an extra ss baffle.

Thanks for your help mate, I’ll get onto the cleaning as you suggested. I think I’ll go this route for now at least and see how everything turns out. Looking at stock options they seem to be pretty thin, in fact I can’t find anything other than the HS precision stock and the new Howa carbon. Surprising really considering how many are sold and how often the stock is commented on. The HS precision does look nice although no weigh savings compared to the hogue.

Originally Posted by samohtxotom

Thanks for your help mate, I’ll get onto the cleaning as you suggested. I think I’ll go this route for now at least and see how everything turns out. Looking at stock options they seem to be pretty thin, in fact I can’t find anything other than the HS precision stock and the new Howa carbon. Surprising really considering how many are sold and how often the stock is commented on. The HS precision does look nice although no weigh savings compared to the hogue.

Yeah, the H&S Precision and B&C stocks are not light weights, but very good stable platform. Put up a WTB add here on the forum, you may well find some one has something for you.

Originally Posted by chainsaw

Yeah, the H&S Precision and B&C stocks are not light weights, but very good stable platform. Put up a WTB add here on the forum, you may well find some one has something for you.

Great idea thanks

The sensible option is to tidy up the 270, stock and over barrel silencer, cut back to 20" and that should still work to 5-600 mtr with premium low drag bullets.
The fun options
I have in my head a cut off of range of 300 mtr for a bush rifle. Just so you can shoot that slip face across the gully or if shooting bush margins in the tops.
So get something in the 308 or 30/06 family in 308, 338 or 358 caliber load with pistol bullets for short range bush shots and keep some full power Boat tail bullets to hand load in if a long shot is needed, you will have the time.
You could be more adventurous and go 375 or up to 44/45 cal but most of these calibers would limit you to 200 mtrs.

Then for the long range/tops south island rig a medium 7mm 24" barrel etc 284 win, 7mm rem mag. Could go 300 winmag but you may have to carry it a long way so the 7mm could be lighter while still heavy enough to shoot accuratley.
Well thats my 2 cents.
Z

Originally Posted by ZQLewis

The sensible option is to tidy up the 270, stock and over barrel silencer, cut back to 20" and that should still work to 5-600 mtr with premium low drag bullets.
The fun options
I have in my head a cut off of range of 300 mtr for a bush rifle. Just so you can shoot that slip face across the gully or if shooting bush margins in the tops.
So get something in the 308 or 30/06 family in 308, 338 or 358 caliber load with pistol bullets for short range bush shots and keep some full power Boat tail bullets to hand load in if a long shot is needed, you will have the time.
You could be more adventurous and go 375 or up to 44/45 cal but most of these calibers would limit you to 200 mtrs.

Then for the long range/tops south island rig a medium 7mm 24" barrel etc 284 win, 7mm rem mag. Could go 300 winmag but you may have to carry it a long way so the 7mm could be lighter while still heavy enough to shoot accuratley.
Well thats my 2 cents.
Z

Boyds used to be a good supply for stocks for Howas but the Antis have made it near impossible to get them in now....I dont think there is anything left from the old shop that will fit, but I will have a rummage around....

Thanks to everybody for their help. I was going to get a stock for the Howa but spending $1000 on a stock that isn’t any lighter felt bad and getting a decent carbon one was $1400, 3/4 of the way to a new rifle. You can see where this is going…. Got a T3X Aspire 7mmRM, have kept the length as is for now as with the overbarrel supresssor on it it’s actually the same length as my old rifle, will likely still get it cut a some point. Even better was the scope I was eyeing up was on discount from $3000 to $2000 so that was a happy bonus.