Thread: Insight / Discussion RE magnum calibres for mountain rifle

Maybe a 308 with the Sierra 165gn gamechangers.

Cheek weld and correct LOP, field of view, eye relief, low magnification, crisp trigger and time behind the trigger make for successful off hand shots IMHO.

Originally Posted by HandH

Cheek weld and correct LOP, field of view, eye relief, low magnification, crisp trigger and time behind the trigger make for successful off hand shots IMHO.

Agreed yes. I'm more of a spot n stalk style hunter, not much of a bush hunter. Not ideal having a muzzke brake when doing the odd standing shot.

Point was more that the rifle setup isn't that enjoyable to use with that style of hunting

Originally Posted by outdoorlad

Maybe a 308 with the Sierra 165gn gamechangers.

SP Gameking any day over that. If you are only shooting to 400 the HPBT gameking could be better again and shooting further why not the TMK.

Originally Posted by Scout

Awesome photo @hotsoup, I hunt by myself most of the time & find it hard to get a good pic with a Thar, haha be a lot harder now lol !

Learnt a few tricks with trophy photos while I've been guiding but still a challenge to get a decent shot when youre solo!

Practise standing shots? I think you can most likely get away with what you have with some more time behind the wheel

Originally Posted by matto1234

Practise standing shots? I think you can most likely get away with what you have with some more time behind the wheel

It isnt often that I need to do an offhand shot, that is only one issue.

- big bulky scope
- want to bring weight down
- requires a suppressor or muzzle brake to be manageable (for me)
- I don't want to keep the gun long term if theres a obviously better alternative that is better suited to my needs.
- established the fact I don't really need a magnum for my style of hunting

Obviously I can make do if I wanted to, but I don't

Offhand shooting can be more challenging with a super lightweight rifle than a middleweight rifle. There is definitely a middle ground when it comes to overall rifle weight and how that weight is distributed.

If you haven’t already, you would be well advised to learn how to use the sling to stabilise your forend and sight picture. Done properly with the right kind of sling it makes a massive difference. But practice has got a great deal to do with it and you don’t even need to be live firing to practice.

An empty case in the chamber with the old primer still in, or a dummy round, and some quick point / acquire / shoot type practice in the paddock will tell you a great deal about how you are likely to shoot in the mountains. When that firing pin hits the old primer you will instinctively know whether you were on target or not. There is a magic moment when you get your technique refined to the point that your barrel isn’t waving around like a conductor’s baton. It’s a great feeling and inspires a lot of confidence.

Managing the recoil in a super lightweight rifle is always an issue but again when shooting offhand you should have the advantage with the right posture, and definitely if you’re using the sling.

You are 100% on the right track with the 6.5 mm. A 140-150gr bullet at ~2,700fps+ with a G1 BC of 0.6 - 0.65 will outperform any of the hunting bullets in .308 at 400yds. The windage performance and retained energy numbers are impressive. This is why a little bit of savviness when setting up your next rifle will give you the best possible advantage at the business end of the bullet’s trajectory. We can go on and on about the rifle, the optic, the sling, your boots and what you had for tea last night, but ultimately it’s the bullet that does the killing and you want to make sure it’s the right one and it gets there with the best possible metrics.

Loved the photo at the beginning of this thread and wish we saw more of these on the forum. Sadly I think I’m going to need a whole body transplant in order to be able to do that kind of thing any time soon...

Originally Posted by Shearer

@hotsoup. Like you I had been using a 7mmRM (T3 with Southfort stock and VX5 3-15) and would grab it whenever I was heading to the tops. Recently I have come to the realization I was
A. Not a good enough marksman to take advantage of the long range potential of the cartridge. (I hate wounding animals and alpine conditions leave too much uncertainty with shot placement at longer ranges for my liking)
B. Enjoyed spotting and then stalking animals rather than just seeing and shooting them.
I have ended up putting the VX5 on my 16" suppressed T3 308 and using it for everything. This means I shoot it a lot and am getting better and better with it.
I have sorted a subsonic load which (with the quick dial up of 6MOA) is now my go to rabbit gun. I have shot pigs, deer and a chamois with it standing, kneeling, prone and resting on trees. The more I use it the more comfortable I am with it. Now, no matter what I am going to hunt, I reach for it and am happy shooting it out past 400 yards (under the right conditions).
I have still got the 7mmRM and it may get used again but for now it is sitting in the back of the safe "resting".
My 308 is probably heavier than what you would want and I had considered getting a VX5 2-10x but for the sake of 50 odd grams and an inch in length I have decided to stick with the bigger scope until I am sure about what I want. I'm sure that with the funds from the carbon lite you could build a similar, but lighter, do all rifle.
Attachment 149347

I have just taken the z5 off my 7mm fatmax and fitted it to my 14.5” kimber .308. It’s good to 500


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Originally Posted by Flyblown

Offhand shooting can be more challenging with a super lightweight rifle than a middleweight rifle. There is definitely a middle ground when it comes to overall rifle weight and how that weight is distributed.

If you haven’t already, you would be well advised to learn how to use the sling to stabilise your forend and sight picture. Done properly with the right kind of sling it makes a massive difference. But practice has got a great deal to do with it and you don’t even need to be live firing to practice.

An empty case in the chamber with the old primer still in, or a dummy round, and some quick point / acquire / shoot type practice in the paddock will tell you a great deal about how you are likely to shoot in the mountains. When that firing pin hits the old primer you will instinctively know whether you were on target or not. There is a magic moment when you get your technique refined to the point that your barrel isn’t waving around like a conductor’s baton. It’s a great feeling and inspires a lot of confidence.

Managing the recoil in a super lightweight rifle is always an issue but again when shooting offhand you should have the advantage with the right posture, and definitely if you’re using the sling.

You are 100% on the right track with the 6.5 mm. A 140-150gr bullet at ~2,700fps+ with a G1 BC of 0.6 - 0.65 will outperform any of the hunting bullets in .308 at 400yds. The windage performance and retained energy numbers are impressive. This is why a little bit of savviness when setting up your next rifle will give you the best possible advantage at the business end of the bullet’s trajectory. We can go on and on about the rifle, the optic, the sling, your boots and what you had for tea last night, but ultimately it’s the bullet that does the killing and you want to make sure it’s the right one and it gets there with the best possible metrics.

Loved the photo at the beginning of this thread and wish we saw more of these on the forum. Sadly I think I’m going to need a whole body transplant in order to be able to do that kind of thing any time soon...

308 has more energy @400yd but more wind drift. A 168 eldm driven hard out of a 308 would be a devastating round in the mountains. But agree the 6.5s are very good

Originally Posted by hotsoup

It isnt often that I need to do an offhand shot, that is only one issue.

- big bulky scope
- want to bring weight down
- requires a suppressor or muzzle brake to be manageable (for me)
- I don't want to keep the gun long term if theres a obviously better alternative that is better suited to my needs.
- established the fact I don't really need a magnum for my style of hunting

Obviously I can make do if I wanted to, but I don't

The only way down in weight from a carbonlight is ultralights like a howa mini 6.5 grendel in a ken Henderson stock or a kimber Montana
I'm a real fan of Kimber's for this type of work. Any 243-308 would be ideal. If they fit you
Nothing beats the sako handling in my experience (I have a 75 in 308) so I feel like maybe a more forgiving scope on your 7mm mag may be a better option if you arnt suffering from recoil shyness

Almost everything is a big step down from a sako 85 carbonlite

sounds like that sako is a real dog ill give ya 5 hundy for it

I agree with above just chop the rm back to 20 and put a can on drop back to the new vx3 with zero lock, Have one on my creedmoor and its a good scope.

Originally Posted by 199p

sounds like that sako is a real dog ill give ya 5 hundy for it

I agree with above just chop the rm back to 20 and put a can on drop back to the new vx3 with zero lock, Have one on my creedmoor and its a good scope.

Nah mate won't chop the RM, will keep original. Anything else would make a good option

Originally Posted by 7.62

308 has more energy @400yd but more wind drift. A 168 eldm driven hard out of a 308 would be a devastating round in the mountains. But agree the 6.5s are very good

Nope.

Probably not much point arguing about it but you can take a look for yourself using the Hornady 4DOF Calculator which is a handy one to use because it’s got all the variables preprogrammed.

Using real world velocity data from my own 6.5 and 308, with 22” and 20” barrels, respectively, the 6.5 is ahead by around 250m, 168gr vs. 147gr.

You really have to thrash the 308 to get it anywhere near the 6.5 down range and even then it still probably won’t make it. But I honestly don’t think it matters that much. The windage performance will always count for more because at the end of the day the bullet needs to end up where you want it, not 6, 7 or 10 inches away. Both the 6.5 and 308 versions of these soft bullets kill extremely well when they are put into the front of the boiler room.

lookout fellas Tracy S will be along soon to tell us you need a .30 cal and then Greg D will counter punch with 7mm figures and meanwhile we will run out of pop corn and the cuppa tea will get cold.