Thread: At least it's a nice colour green - NZDF choose AR to replace Steyrs

Unfortunately not everyone in the Army is capable of being a dedicated marksman.
I shot in every competition I could during my career because I enjoyed it and it got you out of some dull boring everyday stuff and away from the battlion.
Rugby was another bug bear to Plt commanders and the like😆

It was also the only time due to cost, the Army put anything into shooting apart from the yearly AWQ that everyone had to do.
Shooting used to be a hi priority when I first joined and before I left some years later training and time doing it was very limited.

Pretty much the same faces were present every year in most of those competitions.

A mere handful compared to the potential selection base of shooters.

I do not have an opinion on what caliber should be used unless it is role specific.
5.56 is adequate for its general role imo.
Changing caliber for individual weapons would have to be done elsewhere in the world for us to consider it.

The first priority in any contact is to try and gain fire superiority. Win the initial fire fight.
Deliberate shooting has no use or place in the first instance.
Rounds in volume on the ground do.
Therefore the amount of a munitions a soldier can carry has to be considered. Not only does he carry for himself but he will likely be carrying ammo and mines for other assetts.
I believe first line ammo is still 280 rounds and 2 grenades minimum so a change to a larger caliber would increase weight or reduce amount carried, so which ever way you look at it there would be substantial changes needed and quite frankly above any pay grade I would have made had I stayed in longer.


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Originally Posted by R93

Unfortunately not everyone in the Army is capable of being a dedicated marksman.
I shot in every competition I could during my career because I enjoyed it and it got you out of some dull boring everyday stuff and away from the battlion.
Rugby was another bug bear to Plt commanders and the like��

It was also the only time due to cost, the Army put anything into shooting apart from the yearly AWQ that everyone had to do.
Shooting used to be a hi priority when I first joined and before I left some years later training and time doing it was very limited.

Pretty much the same faces were present every year in most of those competitions.

A mere handful compared to the potential selection base of shooters.

I do not have an opinion on what caliber should be used unless it is role specific.
5.56 is adequate for its general role imo.
Changing caliber for individual weapons would have to be done elsewhere in the world for us to consider it.

The first priority in any contact is to try and gain fire superiority. Win the initial fire fight.
Deliberate shooting has no use or place in the first instance.
Rounds in volume on the ground do.
Therefore the amount of a munitions a soldier can carry has to be considered. Not only does he carry for himself but he will likely be carrying ammo and mines for other assetts.
I believe first line ammo is still 280 rounds and 2 grenades minimum so a change to a larger caliber would increase weight or reduce amount carried, so which ever way you look at it there would be substantial changes needed and quite frankly above any pay grade I would have made had I stayed in longer.

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Yep still at 280 rounds but given the typical combat load is 2xfront line you can see how the weight builds up. The DMW on the other hand has a first line of 140 rounds which as a designated marksman is fine but as we know any member within the section must be capable of assaulting just like the other rifleman so they end up caring a min of 2 frontline, which you can imagine gets rather heavy very quickly.

Originally Posted by Shooter

Yep still at 280 rounds but given the typical combat load is 2xfront line you can see how the weight builds up. The DMW on the other hand has a first line of 140 rounds which as a designated marksman is fine but as we know any member within the section must be capable of assaulting just like the other rifleman so they end up caring a min of 2 frontline, which you can imagine gets rather heavy very quickly.

lets not forget the poor bugger who also carries macine gun belts and 40mm rounds and oh yes the radio.

those 40mm are flaming heavy.

...those PRC77's were flaming heavy... with a spare battery as well...

The radios today are far lighter than the 77 set that's for sure. Front line for the gun is 800rounds so once again 2xfrontline brings in a lot of weight, although this canbe distributed across the section. All in all the 5.56 is the best of both worlds, like R93 said the aim of the initial contact is to win the firefight thus gaining the initiative/upper hand over the enemy allowing you to launch an assualt. So the more rounds you have the longer you can sustain a high rate of fire.

It pretty quickly becomes apparent that light infantry is anything but light!

An interesting thread. Enjoying it.

Apparently the NZ Army uses, or is planning on using, heavy 77 grain 5.56mm ammunition

Have also heard that, probably a sensible change given that they are losing 4" of barrel. And the military 77gn stuff is moving impressively fast out of those short tubes-the same as the max I can get handloading for a 22" tube

Originally Posted by res

Have also heard that, probably a sensible change given that they are losing 4" of barrel. And the military 77gn stuff is moving impressively fast out of those short tubes-the same as the max I can get handloading for a 22" tube

I had a lot of problems getting velocity from 77grain projectiles and a 18" barrel. Wounder what the secret is?

I would guess a blended powder mix

I have heard around the traps , that each one will come with a suppressor , as they are a tad loud .....

What is the story with the calibre ? , is this in 5.56 or 7.62mm , and why did the Scar do so poorly ?

And as far as recent small arms buys by the Army , I think buying the LSW in 7.62mm was stupid , if you want a 7.62mm LMG , buy a real one , like the GPMG/MAG58 .

OMG. Really?
I would have thought the term LMG was obvious.




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