Thread: Mil/Mil vs MOA/MOA

MOA MOA for me, but doesn’t really matter which really as both are just angles. As other say, it’s easy to overthink this, but you can just think in clicks and have a drop chart taped to your stock. I don’t like busy reticles and measuring adjustments using mil dots isn’t my thing.

Don’t forget that drop charts are only as good as the info used to produce them. Differences in temp, pressure, altitude, azimuth and even spin drift all have to be accounted for, esp at long range. Some of those factors make very little difference but they all add up. That’s why I’m not a fan of CDS type reticles too. I don’t see the point of having a good quality dialling scope and then limiting accuracy to the set parameters dictated by the dialling system.

I did a test in the US on temp effects with my .300 Win Mag. Can’t remember exact temps now, but they were about -2C and +24C. At 500 yards there was a 19 inch difference in drop with the same loads. Admittedly that’s a big temp range but it makes the point about the limitations of fixed inputs.

If you gave me a scope in ether it wouldn’t worry me, it’s just a matter of dialing the drop from drop chart or ballistic app.
I’m a old dog and the 15+ years since I have had dial up scopes I’ve been using MOA and know the system well. My next scope will probably be a Mil/Mil scope because smaller numbers to remember as dial that much shooting at long range.

Eg is was on the hill yesterday shooting goats. I setup for the shot, range 860m and get MOA dialup solution needed 19.66 MOA but dial 19.5 MOA and hold 7 MOA for wind.

If it was a Mil/Mil scope 5.7 Mil and 2 Mil for wind, smaller numbers but the same.

We should never have moved from pounds, shillings and pence. That ruined everything.

At 433m 1 click on a Mil/Mil scope will be 4.33cm (this took me longer to write than to work out)

At 433 yards 1click on a Moa/Moa scope will be............. I honestly have no idea. There is a baby climbing on me and I can't be arsed working it out. I have had 7 MOA LR scopes and One Mil scope.

Both do the same thing. If you have a Mil/Mil or Moa/Moa reticle, match it to a meters or yards range finder. This is the main thing. You want to be able to measure the fall of the shot on the retical and wind that straight onto the turret. If it is not set up this way, in my not so humble opinion (please don't over state the value of opinions) it is not an LR scope. Its just a scope.

My Schmidt and Bender never required a second round when sighting in. Shoot one, measure, wind it on, spot on.

If you have imperial math down, then go Moa/Moa but if not, don't bother. There is simply no argument to justify the more complex math of imperial.

Mil/Mil is so easy and simple to learn, you would be mad not to. The whole idea is not having to think about it too hard so you don't stuff up.

The shootings not so tough. Its the wind and not making fuck ups that is the challenge. Mil gives less scope for fuck ups.

I use MOA and yards but if I was starting over again I’d buy MiL scopes.

my brain has been wired for moa over years of doing the math in my head & you certainly get a finer adjustment in moa than mils.
Having said that mil/mil will work just fine too.
Have both, but most moa/moa.
@Tussock the answer is real quick & easy... 1 inch or if you're really fussy & super accurate shooter you might try to argue 1.14 inches.

Gravity and wind always exert the same dimensions at any one point in time. Mils, inches, MOA, potatoes give it any number you want. It still does the same thing. I don't get the hang-up, especially for hunters. A hits a hit, a miss is a miss. It's just the target usually fucks off after your first go so if you're not shooting stationary targets I struggle to see the difference.
I'd dial 3 potatoes up and an aubergine right if thats what was needed.

Originally Posted by kiwijames

Gravity and wind always exert the same dimensions at any one point in time. Mils, inches, MOA, potatoes give it any number you want. It still does the same thing. I don't get the hang-up, especially for hunters. A hits a hit, a miss is a miss. It's just the target usually fucks off after your first go so if you're not shooting stationary targets I struggle to see the difference.
I'd dial 3 potatoes up and an aubergine right if thats what was needed.

A MIL is one fist. Simple enough and saves carrying around the potatoe.

I'm sure hes asking for advice that will allow him to keep his options open.

If you don't think this helps with follow up shots, is it possible there are a few techniques you are not aware of?

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We still use Imperial to measure heads ( Douglas score ) to the closest 1/8th of a inch , the math seems tricky at first but like anything you do it a bit you get used to working it out .

Originally Posted by Tahr

We should never have moved from pounds, shillings and pence. That ruined everything.

Even luddites like you

Have to admit that metric makes more sense

Lots to consider guys.

Thank you for all the advice

I'm happy with either, though I've not used MIL. I prefer MOA as it is a finer adjustment. It is also handy at the range where 7mm holes are about the size of a click and my 24mm dot targets are about 3 clicks. Makes it easy to make adjustments to zero and work out rough group sizes from the bays. I'm happy doing the mental arithmetic to convert in either units or a mixture of the units. The reason I buy MOA is there are more of them on the used market, I'm a cheap bastard.

I have a mixture of Mil and Moa scopes. Its doesn't actually matter a single bit when it comes to having to dial something. Think of it as a number that is actually meaningless; you dial the number calculated by your ballistics solver and do the thing you do (shoot the target). Recording and verifying the data is likely to be more important.

Mixing the two within the same scope is about the dumbest thing you can do. An example of this would be a Mildot reticle with MOA adjustment.

Originally Posted by Tussock

A MIL is one fist. Simple enough and saves carrying around the potatoe.

I'm sure hes asking for advice that will allow him to keep his options open.

If you don't think this helps with follow up shots, is it possible there are a few techniques you are not aware of?

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There's ample shit I'm not aware of. That's why I like simple. It suits me well, and potatoes, I like potatoes.

Originally Posted by 7mmsaum

Moa Moa

Praise the lord and pass the sausage rolls, the correct answer has been outed.