Thread: Police at it again

Originally Posted by ChrisF

Hi Guys ,

They will do what ever they want too , right or wrong , legal or illegal , those words are meaningless to them , by fair means or fowl they will get their way , we need to be more political , and either form own party ? , or get reps in a existing party , AND vote for the party that has our interests at heart , & that means to me , not sticking to maybe your normal party , ie National or Labour or NZ1st or Greens , BUT the ONE that best aligns with hunters/shooters etc , that is whats needed by US .
But few will do that , they will still vote for their usuall party reguardless .
I see firearm ownership as the main indicator of a truely free democratic country , so , it shows Freedom , & that should be a Major aspect to most people that understand real freedom .
Me I have always voted for National , apart from the one time social credit was around , as they are usually pro business , anti hand outs , and have worked in real jobs in the real world & tend to run country like a business , ie live within their means etc , not spent 15-20yrs at UNI , as professonal students/teachers , .
So next election I will vote for the party that was the best to offer for hunters etc , and that maybe a party I have never voted for before .
SO I vote for Freedom , thats more important than , being blinkered into always voting for your default party , also we need to make it clear that IF they lie & go back on thier word then we will vote against them next election , so as to hold them to account .
Funny thing is , that this is not Labour or any party pushing this , its the Police , they are un-affected my our voting , BUT the Parties that are thier Bosses , are affected by voting , maybe they will listen , Opps maybe not .

Rant over

I very nearly didn't vote last time round, and by very nearly mean I got to the polling booth at 3minutes to closing.
I hated every party equally, but at last minute remembered Paula Bennett and National were showing some good will towards forearm owners, so voted National solely on that.

Originally Posted by Cordite

That would be when "them and us" deteriorates into "them vs us". It's a fuzzy thin blue line.

Originally Posted by Beetroot

I very nearly didn't vote last time round, and by very nearly mean I got to the polling booth at 3minutes to closing.
I hated every party equally, but at last minute remembered Paula Bennett and National were showing some good will towards forearm owners, so voted National solely on that.

I gave the Cheshire Cat my vote thanks to quite shooter friendly policies. I did note PBs good performance too but Cheshire Cat unexpectedly chose to form a government with labour. I expect him and his party to inspire some straight thinking to whatever camp they're camping in.

Here's some inoffensive images:







I know, it's late...

Originally Posted by R93

Yeah I wouldn't touch them with a 10ft barge pole. I had a pistol made by them that was a 7k lump of shit and their warranty wasn't worth the paper it was printed on.

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What I dream of is someone resurrecting the Armalite AR180 stamped steel wonder in all its inexpensive glory, perhaps with a wee picatinny rail on the top this time round and a full length barrel as before but a faster rifling twist rate.

Ex-UK cops would grow haemorrhoids over that, for historical reasons I need not mention - sometink to do wit potatoes.

@GDNP
AR15s cheap? Yeah, I know. Just fantasising..

Nuff bout dem Armalites. Ah ttink tis tred has been continued by the tred on the Thorpe report.

Originally Posted by Tommy

I believe that moment to be past tense now

Agree i think they see it as them police vs the rest. This is the feeling i get from them anyway.

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I haven't waded through the 6 pages of replies but is there anyone who supports this new way of thinking apart from me?

The government has it's reasons and the vehicle they use is the Police. The Police don't just take on extra work in the general sense without a directive from up the food chain. So your angst should be at central government. Where is falls over is leaving it solely to the Police, they have a pretty crap system for managing all things firearms related (it not most things). The ground troops and most in the arms offices around NZ also have a poor understanding of the law and a lot of things related to firearms.

I know of one person in NZ that had a D class and was importing so called "A" cat parts. They were then on-selling them to a man of a middle eastern background who was believed to be supplying a well known gang in West Auckland in an "E" cat form. So instead of laying all this on the NZ Police, perhaps point the finger at some of our pairs who bend the rules daily while we sit by and say "its not us, its not our problem". Well if the replies here are anything to go by, it is now your problem and it is not going away.

Paraphrasing police statements and interpreting them to suit your own agenda or way of thinking is also pretty small time. Think of what the real issue is and try to get your thinking aligned before commenting. This is the internet however, it hardly reflects the real world at times.

I'm all for tougher laws around firearms and firearms related offences. It is however a complex machine involving a lot a working parts and government departments don't often get that right.

Originally Posted by 6x45

I haven't waded through the 6 pages of replies but is there anyone who supports this new way of thinking apart from me?

The government has it's reasons and the vehicle they use is the Police. The Police don't just take on extra work in the general sense without a directive from up the food chain. So your angst should be at central government. Where is falls over is leaving it solely to the Police, they have a pretty crap system for managing all things firearms related (it not most things). The ground troops and most in the arms offices around NZ also have a poor understanding of the law and a lot of things related to firearms.

I know of one person in NZ that had a D class and was importing so called "A" cat parts. They were then on-selling them to a man of a middle eastern background who was believed to be supplying a well known gang in West Auckland in an "E" cat form. So instead of laying all this on the NZ Police, perhaps point the finger at some of our pairs who bend the rules daily while we sit by and say "its not us, its not our problem". Well if the replies here are anything to go by, it is now your problem and it is not going away.

Paraphrasing police statements and interpreting them to suit your own agenda or way of thinking is also pretty small time. Think of what the real issue is and try to get your thinking aligned before commenting. This is the internet however, it hardly reflects the real world at times.

I'm all for tougher laws around firearms and firearms related offences. It is however a complex machine involving a lot a working parts and government departments don't often get that right.

I hope you reported that to the Police then.

There are issues with what is happening, firstly the Police could say every part for every semi auto is E cat because the rifle it is part of can be configured in an Ecat configuration (ie magazine or pistol grip). Then there is the implication that an Ecat rifle is significantly more dangerous to the public and the police, which it is not.

Even in your example above you emphasized that the rifles were being supplied to gangs in Ecat config. Personally I am more concerned about rifles vs no rifles being supplied to people who shouldnt have them, than whether some one who shouldnt have a rifle has an Acat or Ecat

I haven't waded through the 6 pages of replies but is there anyone who supports this new way of thinking apart from me?

Not many as you can see

I'm all for tougher laws around firearms and firearms related offences. It is however a complex machine involving a lot a working parts and government departments don't often get that right.

Correct. The cat up North who supplied that nutcase with 10 firearms, resulting in 2 deaths of innocent people - 12 months home D, what a sick fucking joke. The other 275000 of us didn't. Your unnamed dealer - what did he get? Did they recycle the same wet bus ticket? If they are going to push for something to be done, decent sentencing would be the first thing to look at. Making more laws for criminals to also ignore is taking the piss quite frankly. Mind you, this is the "100kmh = safe, 104kmh = deeply unsafe'' kind of thinking that seems ingrained in Bullshit Castle

Unfortunately there are some in Police who are hell bent on getting rid of AR rifles and they will keep trying it on until they succeed, we also now have a govt who wants to let criminals out of prison early as apparently we are locking to many up and oh it costs a lot to keep them there (and the public safe) which is why we won’t see decent sentences handed out for gun crimes. That guy up north who let that unhinged bloke use his licence and trade me account to buys guns should have been done for manslaugther.

The govt and police are to scared to face the real issues but still want to been seen to be doing something, like attacking the mostly law abiding FAL holders.

Originally Posted by outdoorlad

Unfortunately there are some in Police who are hell bent on getting rid of AR rifles and they will keep trying it on until they succeed, we also now have a govt who wants to let criminals out of prison early as apparently we are locking to many up and oh it costs a lot to keep them there (and the public safe) which is why we won’t see decent sentences handed out for gun crimes. That guy up north who let that unhinged bloke use his licence and trade me account to buys guns should have been done for manslaugther.

The govt and police are to scared to face the real issues but still want to been seen to be doing something, like attacking the mostly law abiding FAL holders.

Just like they bang on about the road toll being so high, so put cops and speed cameras all down the Waikato express way tobping people for doing 110kph amd do absolutely nothing about the absolutely atrocious drivers who shouldn't be allowed to drive, but they don't speed so never get pulled over.

Also lowering the drink driving limit whilst giving people back their licenses after 8 or 9 drink driving convictions when they are 3 times over the limit.

Originally Posted by 6x45

I haven't waded through the 6 pages of replies but is there anyone who supports this new way of thinking apart from me?

The government has it's reasons and the vehicle they use is the Police. The Police don't just take on extra work in the general sense without a directive from up the food chain. So your angst should be at central government. Where is falls over is leaving it solely to the Police, they have a pretty crap system for managing all things firearms related (it not most things). The ground troops and most in the arms offices around NZ also have a poor understanding of the law and a lot of things related to firearms.

I know of one person in NZ that had a D class and was importing so called "A" cat parts. They were then on-selling them to a man of a middle eastern background who was believed to be supplying a well known gang in West Auckland in an "E" cat form. So instead of laying all this on the NZ Police, perhaps point the finger at some of our pairs who bend the rules daily while we sit by and say "its not us, its not our problem". Well if the replies here are anything to go by, it is now your problem and it is not going away.

Paraphrasing police statements and interpreting them to suit your own agenda or way of thinking is also pretty small time. Think of what the real issue is and try to get your thinking aligned before commenting. This is the internet however, it hardly reflects the real world at times.

I'm all for tougher laws around firearms and firearms related offences. It is however a complex machine involving a lot a working parts and government departments don't often get that right.

I think we would all like to see tougher sentences and the bad people with firearms be delt with, but most of don't see how these new rules do anything other than punish the good guys, when the Police should try harder to get the bad eggs.

The UK had their firearms rules toughened up after a few events that could have easily been prevented had the Police actually done their job and in one case were given multiple tip offs about the guy being a lunatic.

I was bought up to respect the Police and authority, but over time I've slowly lost that respect after seeing them going after the low hanging fruit and ignoring the people out their doing the real damage.

I was explaining this to my wife who has no real interest in firearms. I simplified it for her and the convo went something like....
Wife: so your rifle is legal and your allowed it.
Me: yes
W: But if you change some parts you are not allowed it.
M:right
W: But if you try to buy a part from overseas that is already on your rifle, not one of the illegal parts, you are not allowed to .
M:no
W: Even if you already have that part?
M: Yes
W: and you are allowed that part....
M: Yes
W: ....and that part wont make it illegal
M: No
W: (after looking at me for a moment to gauge if I was taking the piss) ........ Well thats just stupid.
M: yes

Originally Posted by Beetroot

I think we would all like to see tougher sentences and the bad people with firearms be delt with, but most of don't see how these new rules do anything other than punish the good guys, when the Police should try harder to get the bad eggs.

The UK had their firearms rules toughened up after a few events that could have easily been prevented had the Police actually done their job and in one case were given multiple tip offs about the guy being a lunatic.

I was bought up to respect the Police and authority, but over time I've slowly lost that respect after seeing them going after the low hanging fruit and ignoring the people out their doing the real damage.

Nail on the head

Originally Posted by 6x45

I haven't waded through the 6 pages of replies but is there anyone who supports this new way of thinking apart from me?

The government has it's reasons and the vehicle they use is the Police. The Police don't just take on extra work in the general sense without a directive from up the food chain. So your angst should be at central government. Where is falls over is leaving it solely to the Police, they have a pretty crap system for managing all things firearms related (it not most things). The ground troops and most in the arms offices around NZ also have a poor understanding of the law and a lot of things related to firearms.

I know of one person in NZ that had a D class and was importing so called "A" cat parts. They were then on-selling them to a man of a middle eastern background who was believed to be supplying a well known gang in West Auckland in an "E" cat form. So instead of laying all this on the NZ Police, perhaps point the finger at some of our pairs who bend the rules daily while we sit by and say "its not us, its not our problem". Well if the replies here are anything to go by, it is now your problem and it is not going away.

Paraphrasing police statements and interpreting them to suit your own agenda or way of thinking is also pretty small time. Think of what the real issue is and try to get your thinking aligned before commenting. This is the internet however, it hardly reflects the real world at times.

I'm all for tougher laws around firearms and firearms related offences. It is however a complex machine involving a lot a working parts and government departments don't often get that right.

Your entire argument falls over with your basic assumptions. Government have told Police that the laws are not changing, the laws they already have are sufficient, and that they need to get on with policing those laws that they have generally failed to police. They have been told to get out and deal with the criminal element. They were also told to have meaningful consultation with licensed firearm owners, which they just finished playing inadequate lip service to. So no, Police are not listening to the directives of government and are showing utter contempt for government, the courts, licensed firearm owners and dealers.