Thread: Nissan X-Trail for towing boat

Originally Posted by gonetropo

the issue with the nissan is that the belt pushes force onto a pulley rather than dragging it, causes the belt to "whiplash" and the metal inserts get loose.
bloody awful things

Obviously by the comments about cvt's no one actually knows anything factual about them.

ALL the cvt's with a belt work on the principle of push to drive, and some chain cvt's also work on the principle of push to drive, while others work on the principal of pull to drive.
The belt and chain are kept tight during operation, otherwise they wouldn't drive, this is also the reason the bearings fail and become noisy, but the bearings aren't plain ball bearings they are built to handle the extra load.
The Jatco cvt's have a belt and Subaru's and others have a chain, btw Subaru have two different cvt's the Gen 2 TR580 and the Gen 1 TR690.

The Nissan cvt is made by Jatco and is used in multiple makes of vehicle, Mitsubishi, Renault, Chrysler, Fiat, GM, Jeep, Suzuki, and possibly some other makes.
Jatco makes several different versions of cvt's some are lighter duty, ie Tiida etc and others are heavier duty ie X trail, Maxima etc

One of the biggest problems with cvt's s the vehicle manufacturer and the owner, the manufacturer stretches the service intervals out for environmental and other reasons and the owner because NZ vehicle owners are neglectful of actual service requirements.
Jatco used to recommend a service, which was drop the pan replace the filter and clean the pan then flush the transmission at 60,000km

Yes you can fit an external transmission cooler to most cvt transmissions and if towing I would recommend it, Yes you can use a cvt for towing.
Towing creates extra heat so while the transmission has a bit of extra cooling capacity start towing and creating extra heat and you don't have any extra cooling capacity.

The transmission controller may have an inbuilt "safety" feature, if the fluid temp reaches a certain temp it limits the ability of the engine to rev and engages a higher ratio, no good if you are going uphil at the time. you pull over and allow the transmission to cool down. BTW that temp is around 160deg C from memory.

The Xtrail is a Mitsi Outlander with a few different body panels, there are several different make of vehicles that are the 'Same" as each other just with different body panels to make them look different.

There are problems with cvt's like there is with other transmissions, Colorado torque converter shudder, Ranger leadframes and valvebodies, cvt valvebody issues, everything is mechanical and can have a problem but some problems occur at higher km's while others appear earlier in life.

thanks @19Badger

if you are only towing occasonally towing and not long distances and you are buying new I would not get too concerned.
Check your boat weight and as long as its less than the tow rating for what ever car you chose then OK.
re CVT's a compromise like all gear boxes, ie look at the ranger 10sp box issues in the earlier models.
Ie Subaru Forester is 1800kg, the outback is 2000 or 2400kg in the top spec.

If planning lots of long trips and steep ramps then maybe a 2wd Ute would make more sense
Z

Originally Posted by ZQLewis

If planning lots of long trips and steep ramps then maybe a 2wd Ute would make more sense
Z

2wd ute with lightly weighted rear may not end well on steep or slippery ramps

Originally Posted by uk_exile

2wd ute with lightly weighted rear may not end well on steep or slippery ramps

Agreed on this having had to be towed out at low tide on a concrete ramp a few times! Fwd car far better

Originally Posted by uk_exile

2wd ute with lightly weighted rear may not end well on steep or slippery ramps

2wd anything on a steep slippery ramp is more likely to need a bit of help to get out. The front wheel drive loses a lot of the engine weight to the rear axle as the car sits back and the boat weight settles in. In the boat trade, we run 4wd tow vehicles just for this reason it's not to be cool or cute - it's trying to get the boat and trailer back out of the drink. Apart from that 60 seconds where they are vital the rest of the time the 4wd bits are along for the ride...

Re the xtrail and outlander being from the same platform - that seems to not be the case now with the latest generation. The earlier model outlander did run Jatco boxes, and also used the GKN one as well which I don't think the xtrail had as an option? I think those were the hybrid cars - deliberately never dived into one and still trying not too... The interesting one is Mitsi warranty theirs for 10 years powertrain, Nissan not even close and the Nissan's seem to not have the same reputation. The Outlanders share the same basic platform with several other misti offerings, the ASX is one other and all of those have a better rep than the xtrails with all having similar powertrains in the petrols. I have an outlander and an ASX here at the moment.

Originally Posted by No.3

2wd anything on a steep slippery ramp is more likely to need a bit of help to get out. The front wheel drive loses a lot of the engine weight to the rear axle as the car sits back and the boat weight settles in. In the boat trade, we run 4wd tow vehicles just for this reason it's not to be cool or cute - it's trying to get the boat and trailer back out of the drink. Apart from that 60 seconds where they are vital the rest of the time the 4wd bits are along for the ride...

Re the xtrail and outlander being from the same platform - that seems to not be the case now with the latest generation. The earlier model outlander did run Jatco boxes, and also used the GKN one as well which I don't think the xtrail had as an option? I think those were the hybrid cars - deliberately never dived into one and still trying not too... The interesting one is Mitsi warranty theirs for 10 years powertrain, Nissan not even close and the Nissan's seem to not have the same reputation. The Outlanders share the same basic platform with several other misti offerings, the ASX is one other and all of those have a better rep than the xtrails with all having similar powertrains in the petrols. I have an outlander and an ASX here at the moment.

3 year old pajero sport boom problem solved allready dropped 15-20K in value

Id say youd be renaming it an x fail if you tow a boat with it

Originally Posted by ZQLewis

if you are only towing occasonally towing and not long distances and you are buying new I would not get too concerned.
Check your boat weight and as long as its less than the tow rating for what ever car you chose then OK.
re CVT's a compromise like all gear boxes, ie look at the ranger 10sp box issues in the earlier models.
Ie Subaru Forester is 1800kg, the outback is 2000 or 2400kg in the top spec.

Z

I've been towing with my now aging Forester for three years now. It's not ideal, but 98% of my journeys are under 10 minutes (we live very close to the boat ramp), so what you suggest isn't unreasonable. Live in Whangarei and go to Whangaroa and BOI a few times a year. Unless I got a dedicated tow vehicle (i.e. diesel 4x4 ute or big SUV), I wouldn't take the boat further afield again which is a shame as we enjoy our trips down to Rotoiti. It's a lot of money to spend for a couple of trips a year though. More to think about and discuss at home.

I've never had a problem on a step ramp so far touch wood in 2wd ute. Petrol too thats over last 15 years. If I'm worried I turn the wheels towards ramp in case the handbrake let's up. And all my utes have been manuals . Not ideal but did the job.

Mate who just runs 2wd Utes has them with the limited slip and I've been Impressed were he can tow his work trailer with it.
A 5.2mtr power boat is not that heavy.
Just looked up a 6mtr glass boat Inc Trailer is approx 1500kg as assuming the posters looking at a 5.2mtr alloy boat its going to be way lighter so not a big deal for any 2lt or small turbo engine car. Have raced a number of trailer sailers 18-22' with front drive cars not ideal but it works if you take your time.

Vw tiguan 1.4 turbo is rated to tow 1800kg towing and day to day would be much nicer to live with than a ute.
Thats the one problem with Utes is that they are not that nice to live with day to day, particularly parking in urban areas.
Z

Id rather use a bigger motor that doesnt have to work as hard for towing

There ain't no replacement for displacement

Some good deals on new navaras too with it globally not doing well. Cpild be a car brand of the past soon.

we almost bought a navara years back, then tried the isuzu and went that way.
my boss at the time bought the navara, every time he used it to tow it smelt like hot oil, and this was from 1-1.5 tonne caravans