Thread: The results are in

Originally Posted by Mike H

The technical fault is that you cannot vote on something that wasn't on the agenda.

Technical fault? Standing orders are gazzetted same way as our fishing and hunting regulations I believe.

interesting fact, the vote taken in April can only be called "informal" I believe the word was used by the council last night as that vote was done in General business so is not part of an agenda and was used by them to gauge "support" to move to a agenda item in June

so the requests for info to hq the very next day were off the managers own bat and him not doing his job??

From what I can make out they agreed to it as a non agenda item but to formalize it needed to raise it and vote on it at the next meeting and have it on that meeting's agenda.

is that normal practise mike?
but then to call it a unanimous vote in favour from the aprill meeting??

decision made last night that they will not be consulting licence holders any further and new council to take over this month.

what any further than none
so they did some consultation or no??

We are not talking about inexperienced hicks we are talking about multi term councillors with a number having NZCouncil experience and chairman experience.]

yea i found the poor country boy in the big city a bit hard to swallow given mr d in the next sentence says he was away filming for a month and is a noted ballistic expert.

This was posted on the other forum by someone called Chris that was at the meeting. Sounds a bit more positive than Tony's summary of it:

"I went to the F&G HB meeting last night, the first time I've been to one, and it was good to see the council and its new staff in operation. The chairman welcomed about 30 members of the public to the meeting, got all attendees to say their name for everyone's information then proceeded to go through their agenda which for this meeting was largely about gamebirds, research and season conditions for the 2016 season. It was really pleasing to see the professional staff from Eastern Region giving scientific advice and helping the council through its decision making processes. The need for more and better research was a common theme.
Then in general business a simple statement of facts was passed around regarding how the council found itself in this situation regarding the decision to drop from 12 to 8 councillors, and what the options were going forward including a quote from Electionz for a new election. This was pretty much exactly as the chairman has already posted on this forum. The quote for a new election was $17,000 external costs, plus internal costs and staff time. The chairman put this figure into perspective by saying they had scrimped and saved to come up with $9000 out of their discretionary spending budget after staff wages and overheads to put towards the important Mallard Research Project.
The public were then invited to have their say, and Tony H certainly had his, pointing out (somewhat ad nauseum) the failure in procedure in the decision making process, which the council freely admitted as their chairman has repeatedly done on here. Then the unsuccessful candidate who had been told of this procedural failure by Tony H had his say, and accused the council of illegal voting, which was then proved to be incorrect when the deputy chairman showed him the standing orders which the council operates under. The acting manager then explained to the meeting that legal opinions received showed that there was nothing wrong or illegal in the election or election process, and there were absolutely no grounds on which to declare the election null and void. Other members of the public said they would be highly pissed off if the council wasted any money on a new election when the election they’d just had was totally valid. They also said they were sick of the time and money wasting going on because of only two members of the public’s worrying about a procedural mistake.
After being assured the election result was valid and would stand, the unsuccessful candidate retracted his call for a new election, saying he supported the change to 8 councillors and would support the new council.
In the end it was very positive meeting, seeing the council in action, seeing those who’ve been concerned by the election process get their answers, and seeing that almost everyone there supports the council and their handling of this situation. Hopefully now the incoming council can get on with the real issues, and that is managing the birds and fish for us licence holders!"

mm good to see both sides here at least

They also said they were sick of the time and money wasting going on because of only two members of the public’s worrying about a procedural mistake.

id hardly call the complete lack of consultation a procedural mistake and any idea that having it on the june agenda would have changed this past whateva the public at the meeting could have said is bollocks.
wonder if the lawyers and employment gag order costs are as big as a new election.
still if the electioneering attempted character assasination [via redacted emails and former councillers] and procedural failure can be swept aside then i guess a no hit no foul approach on the lack of consultation is nothing surprising.

Originally Posted by gsp follower

yea i found the poor country boy in the big city a bit hard to swallow given mr d in the next sentence says he was away filming for a month and is a noted ballistic expert.

Genuine mistakes can be made no less by anyone at anytime. I think F&G did what it had to but made some serious concessions to the integrity and fundamental purpose of elections. I am personally not surprised that process can be circumvented with such ease and such lack of regard for it's constituents- but many more people have had their eyes opened.

Just 550 people voted in HB (32%) of eligible voters. Imagine if everyone was automatically eligible to vote and region hoping wasn't allowed. Would any election give F&G a mandate to represent us?

Just 550 people voted in HB (32%) of eligible voters. Imagine if everyone was automatically eligible to vote and region hoping wasn't allowed. Would any election give F&G a mandate to represent us?

imagine there no countries imagine theres no wars IMAGINE
are you suggestig a bit of reverse region hopping as opposed to what was rumoured to have happened in aw and eastern last election tim?

It was really pleasing to see the professional staff from Eastern Region giving scientific advice and helping the council through its decision making processes.

ouch that must be cringe worthy
any eastern councillers present

Would any election give F&G a mandate to represent us?

possibly yes but candidate profile would still be a big part to.

If this becomes a contentious issue outside disgruntled candidates who didn’t get elected, we may well ask the licence holders via the email database what their thoughts are regarding whether its necessary to have a new election, as it’s their money that will be getting spent

meow.jesus dont strain yourselvesshame you didnt think this was a good idea before you made the decision and voted on it.

Originally Posted by gsp follower

are you suggestig a bit of reverse region hoping like what was rumoured to have happened in aw and eastern last election tim?

I'm not suggesting anything, but lets look at the figures. There's about 4,100 license sales in HB but I'll knock 400 off and work with 3700 eligible voters. Only 45% of these people bothered to register. This elections vote return represented 32% of those that expressed an interest or just 14% of license holders in the region. Not much of a mandate.

So the meeting ended in light and love...how jolly...

So the minuted incumbent manager's caution to the council reminding them that there is a statutory obligation to band birds was not agreed to at the time, yet we read $9000 ...the important Mallard Research Project. And was the $6000 for a feasibility study on a fish out pond also out of the discretionary spending wallet...hmmmm

true enough seems like you,d want to make voting easier or registering to vote compulsory.
but to a point you can lead a gamebirder to the maimai but you cant shoot the ducks for him.
[horse trough analogy]maybe when people realise not voting when they can is the biggest disservice they can do for thier sport it might change. vote cos you can not cos you have to or the right to elect f&g mightent be around to get many more chances.

So the meeting ended in light and love...how jolly...

So the minuted incumbent manager's caution to the council reminding them that there is a statutory obligation to band birds was not agreed to at the time, yet we read $9000 ...the important Mallard Research Project. And was the $6000 for a feasibility study on a fish out pond also out of the discretionary spending wallet...hmmmm

if you keep bringing commonsence into this thread EeeBees your gonna ruin it.

Originally Posted by EeeBees

So the meeting ended in light and love...how jolly...

So the minuted incumbent manager's caution to the council reminding them that there is a statutory obligation to band birds was not agreed to at the time, yet we read $9000 ...the important Mallard Research Project. And was the $6000 for a feasibility study on a fish out pond also out of the discretionary spending wallet...hmmmm

What about buying a scapegoat? That might have cost you 50 to 100 K easy as you like. Discretionary spending?

Originally Posted by Tim Allen

What about buying a scapegoat? That might have cost you 50 to 100 K easy as you like. Discretionary spending?

jesus add in ongoing legal costs what a flippin liberty

im probably flogging a dead horse and they can say whateva they like the evidence is clear.
the most irksome and unbelievable part is not once did they consider consulting licence holders.
its never been mentioned as one of the things the former manager didnt do or iniate.
they,d made up thier minds and were going with it hell or high water and thats the real shocker in this whole sorry affair.
they seem to think thier biggest failing is the manager didnt put a fait acompli on the agenda.
it just looks like an attempt to slip something by the licence buyers but if it was or wasnt tho crappy or negligent,is not the point.
not one statement from the chairman or former councillors has expressed any regret or shown any evidence that they intended to consult but instead belabour a procedural error and ''it wasnt me line''.
no the mistake you made wasnt expecting someone else to do your dirty work for you ie email elections nz and nzc.
[which i doubt he,d have done unless asked/told]
the mistake nay failing is you totaly ignored the very people you were supposed to represent.???
your motives in doing so are for your conciences alone to ponder and your licence holders to suffer till next election at least.

Time to see a counsellor gspf?

Originally Posted by Tahr

Time to see a counsellor gspf?

thank you tahr i hope your as blaise when the rot creeps your regions way

anywaY end of unless more comes to pass.