Thread: Somethings to just have a look through..

'Its eaasy to piss and moan and demand a reduction in licence fees, but few put their money where their mouth is and go do something about it'.

Hi gqhoon, im on your side mate, (believe it or not) im not 'demanding' anything! but if another wildfowl hunter who pays exactly the same fee as me gets twice as long to use it, i 'expect' to pay less.....and im pretty sure
if i go along the banks of the mighty Waikato where i hunt, setting traps and trying to shoot/catch pests, ill be on the wrong side of the law in no time and lose my FAL........

just my angry 2c worth, had to get it off my chest, if my 'double fee' cash is going into conservation, those who get paid to do it....can!

I think we have to be a bit more philisophical than that Scouser. Our licences allow us to shoot anywhere in NZ, its simply we choose to live (and presumably hunt) in the A/W area. Thats our choice, not F&G's.

For those who feel they are not in a position to help, because the issue may seem to big, then there are all opportunities to assit other community groups.

Feel free to contact Waikato RiverCare Welcome To Waikato RiverCare - Waikato River Care and talk to Kevin Hutchinson (Operations Manager) about how you can assist. Kevin is ex DoC (he's also a keen duckshooter) in the Whangamarino and his role is to implement the objectives of the group (2ha of river bank planting per year). Interestingly, Kevin's boss is David Klee (A/W F&G), so you can read between the lines that there are opportunities there to enhance the lot of our gamebird populations with projects such as RiverCares.

Just had a reply from the 'Fish & game Auckland & Waikato region'......you can guess what my email concerned.......his reply.....

'So far there doesn’t appear to be any clear consensus on mechanical decoys by hunters with strong views both ways.'

Best regards

Ben Wilson
Chief Executive
Fish & Game Auckland/Waikato Region


Bet my 'left hairy nacker' i will have to sell my 'flappy duck' before the year is out, or find another region to hunt in!

The idea of banning motorised decoys was put forward last year by the geriatrics at EPCM who want to be seen to be doing something, but are so stuck in the dark-ages they need a torch to find their way. Unfortunately, it was latched onto by David Cocks and Eaun Williamson as a means of garnering support for last year's elections. As Ben has stated, there is no correlation between mechanical decoys and declining populations and was knocked on the head when the regualtions were set for this past season.

Best thing you can do is to get in the ear of those Councillors who want decisions made based on evidence, and not emotion.

Originally Posted by gqhoon

The idea of banning motorised decoys was put forward last year by the geriatrics at EPCM who want to be seen to be doing something, but are so stuck in the dark-ages they need a torch to find their way. Unfortunately, it was latched onto by David Cocks or Eaun Williamson as a means of garnering support for last year's elections. As Ben has stated, there is no correlation between mechanical decoys and declining populations and was knocked on the head when the regualtions were set for this past season.

Best thing you can do is to get in the ear of those Councillors who want decisions made based on evidence, and not emotion.

That is very cynical. I could counter your comments by simply saying you could have an emotional attachement to the ongoing use/sale of such decoys by aquaintance. I can happily say without knowing either Cocks or Williamson - they have most likely done some investigations with the intent of improving the resource for all. They haven't taken a position to protect their own hunting or anything so selfish I'd suggest.

There is a line of thought that mechanical decoys cause over harvest in the young population resulting in an ageing and less productive breeding population over time. This has been studied. States like California ban the use of flappy ducks until a set time in their season when the migratory ducks arrive in order to protect their resident duck population. Perhaps they have a few misguided emotional councillors also?

There is no correlation between declining duck populations and mechanical decoys in NZ because it hasn't been studied.

Originally Posted by Tim Allen

That is very cynical.

Cynicism is an emotive opinion that you hve attached to my comments. It is your issue, not mine.

Originally Posted by Tim Allen

I could counter your comments by simply saying you could have an emotional attachement to the ongoing use/sale of such decoys by aquaintance.

If that is your firm belief, then you are simply wrong. Again. I have no attachment to the continued use / sale of any item of equipment. Much like your previous incorrect allegtion that I support certain individuals because I might get some hunting. You are simply grasping at straws.

Originally Posted by Tim Allen

I can happily say without knowing either Cocks or Williamson - they have most likely done some investigations with the intent of improving the resource for all.

Incorrect. By their own admission, they had no evidence to support their postion. They did / do genuinely feel that we 'had to do something'......that not really my idea of an informed decision making process.

Originally Posted by Tim Allen

There is a line of thought that mechanical decoys cause over harvest in the young population resulting in an ageing and less productive breeding population over time. This has been studied. States like California ban the use of flappy ducks until a set time in their season when the migratory ducks arrive in order to protect their resident duck population. Perhaps they have a few misguided emotional councillors also?

There is no correlation between declining duck populations and mechanical decoys in NZ because it hasn't been studied.

Correct. So when NZ studies also show the same correlation, I would happy support such a restriction. Until then, it is simply guess work.

Originally Posted by gqhoon

Correct. So when NZ studies also show the same correlation, I would happy support such a restriction. Until then, it is simply guess work.

I wasn't expecting you to feel the need to be defencive. My post casting the assertion you were speaking out of self interest was only to draw attention to your comment suggesting other councillors tried to address a very real concern purely to garner votes.You seem aware there is material supporting restrictions so likely know it was less than vote buying and not contrived from the dark ages?

Back on topic, it's great to see predator control gaining some spotlight. Have you or anyone you know had much to do with those gas cannister traps?

Thanks guys, as you both well know, sometimes whats 'typed & printed' on the posts can be misconstrued to the reader.....looks like we are all 'preaching to the converted' here....i shoot for sport, i need to lose fukin weight as it is.....

Im new to game bird hunting, and the crew i go duck hunting with all yarn about the 'good old days' and have photos in the hut with 15-20 ducks draped around their necks looking like 'dame Nellie Melba' on the fukin stage!!!!!

those days have gone, (by Port Waikato anyway) its just very frustrating to be a 'law abiding game permit holder' and be squeezed year in year out, (half hunting time, dowel in shottie, flappy duck ban?) it will get to the point

of, why bother....they were even checking boaties at the wharf for alcohol consumption FFS, before they went out!!!!!....this is a social occasion for us, we dont need/want to hunt/kill ducks because we will starve without them!!!

Thanks gqhoon for mentioning names & places where i can get off my (fat) arse and do something about it......dont hold your breath though!......'warm barrels' guys

You’re right Scouser, seems to be a bit of miscommunication.

I used to have a fairly jaundiced view of F&G (and still do to some degree) until I chose to become more involved and understand how the organisation functions and what its drivers are. I very quickly learnt that in the most part, the staff are quality individuals, passionate about their jobs. While these guys are a considerable asset, unfortunately there were / are some who see it as a job for life and contribute fuck all to the organisation and effectively hamstring the useful ones. Add to that there are similar issues with Councillors (who employ the Managers / CEO’s, who in turn employ the staff), then you can only imagine the degree of dysfunction that exists within the organisation. The role of national Council isn’t even worth mentioning to be perfectly honest.

Add in a healthy dose of hunter apathy (one Region hasn’t had an election in a decade or so as no one wants to stand) and you can see there are some major ‘legacy issues’ that the organisation needs to overcome before it will find favour with its constituents again.

In the meantime, our gamebird populations are in a decline never before been documented and our licence sales have decreased 44% since 1985 (or thereabouts). It’s actually a lot worse than that in the North Island, but the decrease has been less in the South Island, so it props up the national average.

The conclusion I’ve come to, is that I can’t be bothered waiting for ‘someone’ to fix the problem, so choose to do what I can to assist. Advocating for and carrying out predator control, rearing and releasing of gamebirds, nesting and rearing planting etc are all things that are within my means (and that of those I shoot with). We combine resources, time, money and effort and do what we can to improve our lot, and hopefuly help educate others along the way to do something similar.

The thing to remember, is that we all have the means to assist, regardless of resources, wealth or time.

You fullas need a Dundee coy ...... Best of luck with the beaurocrats. All game bird hunters I know are doing there bit. I nearly smoked the neighbours cat tonight but after ID the mongrel sent a text and got back "Cease Fire!" lucky I checked.

If ya motor ducks are banned,think natural movement fullas

Originally Posted by Dundee

You fullas need a Dundee coy ...... Best of luck with the beaurocrats. All game bird hunters I know are doing there bit. I nearly smoked the neighbours cat tonight but after ID the mongrel sent a text and got back "Cease Fire!" lucky I checked.

If ya motor ducks are banned,think natural movement fullas

Do they travel ok on the courier ?

I'm sure the Happy waters up there are stocked with plentiful big decoy towing eels

Originally Posted by Dundee

I'm sure the Happy waters up there are stocked with plentiful big decoy towing eels

Ha ha we are lucky to be able to dump the water out of our main pond so it emptys Put the plug back in close to season start and fills up crystal clear so no eels except for tiny boot laces occaisionally. The Quakers love the new water as well

Its a doubled sided sword really cause the big eels eat the ducklings and the bigger ones eat the ducks. Can't mess with nature but seems we can't get any sense out of the dudes that make the rulz for our love of gamebird hunting.

The ducks have so many predators and the bloody councils have none

'I actually started the thread as a demonstration that our fees in Waikato were being put to some use.' (Happy)

Sorry i high-jacked your thread Happy, but yes, agree with you entirely, great to see some data coming out of our 'game permits' and hopefully pest eradication is on the way.....