Thread: Waikato News

People with semis I reckon help dent the population through the wounded and killed, add pump actions too I can empty a mag at a mob sometimes.

Uummmm I had a 1 hour convo with a F G rep this Arvo I m awaiting more info but I m gonna have to get involved and put ones money where the mouth is or whatever. I was stunned that he knew nearly as much as me but not at grounds root level. All I can say really for now as left slightly realigned and slightly stunned I ll pay my fees same as for 50 days bot only getting. 28. But will have more to say when and if he sends me the info requested There seems to be more happening in the back ground than we are aware of and woe is them for shit education but ??? from what I gathered there stuff both camps need to learn and if half was correct times are gonna change and we all need to move deep south ( past R93 country tho )

Tim there is no doubt duck nos in A/W have declined but I for one don't believe hunter harvest or improved hunting technology is the cause of this decline. The reduced nos of ducks shot each year over the past 10 years revealed in surveys support this.
As to manipulation of stats etc A/W hunters were last asked year do you want 3 shots or a short season? They responded by indicating 3 shots was ok but season length would be unchanged.
So what happens - we got both!
Some shooters have suggested that those hunters selected for survey were less than "random". There is little doubt that remits from several A/W clubs were orchestrated by sitting councillors.

Hmmm license bought last few or more years never got surveyed bugger ?

I just drove up to Kawhai and Aotea Harbours from Bell Block, in via Otorohanga and out via Piripiri and Waitomo, seen lots of parries and perhaps dozen mallards, theirs hardly a pond with any water anywere, just a few ducks in the inlets and bays. never seen a grain crop in the whole drive, lots ponds all overgrown with bullrushes, flax and weeds. The few creeks all had stock threw them,
You guys have a habait problem,
No amount of shot gun and date dittering is going to fix you duck number problem.

Hard to know exactly what you’re referring to in regards to your conversation with F&G, but the information is there if people are willing to educate themselves about it.

Maybe you’re referring to the research work into wetland productivity that is being done by a Master’s student? or maybe the National research program that A/W staff are heavily involved in? Or maybe the initiatives to encourage hunters to rear and release gamebrids to establish new populations?

I don’t disagree that F&G could do a better job at promoting themselves (as an organisation) and unfortunately have next to no profile and relationship with their stakeholders. Clearly, things need to change in that space if they wish to have any longevity. However, aside from a few who have been in the job for far too long, the majority of staff that have a science / bio background are actually very good. They know there are huge gaps in the knowledge base and are seeking to fill those gaps by undertaking research etc. However, it will take time (National project is 5 years) and I sincerely hope it is not a case of ‘too little, too late’.

However, that is not to say I agree with some of the decisions that are being made in terms of Gamebird Regulations, and in particular the rationale behind them. However, the staff are the paid experts and we must have confidence that they will make the right decisions for the long-term survivability of our Sport. Our Sport has been controlled by the same dozen or so people for the last 20 years. It has taken considerable efforts over the last 5 or 6 years to start breaking down the barriers to new ideas and direction. I see there are at least 3 members of this forum who stood for A/W F&G Council last elections, unfortunately unsuccessfully (myself included). I wonder how many of you actually bothered to vote, given you all seem so concerned now that the decisions are having a direct impact on you?

Writing emails to Robyn (the office lady) and arguing for a reduced licence cost is pointless. The recommendation has been made and accepted by the Minister, a Whole Season licence is $90. Suck it up and move on.

Some of the language used on this forum that is being directed to staff / Councillors is quite shameful. The anonymity of an internet forum is fantastic if you wish to take a cheap shot at someone without any fear of them having a crack back at you. I suggest you put your money where your mouth is and turn up to Council meetings. Look those same people in the eye and call them “fuckheads”……I predict you will soon lose some of your bottle.

Well said GQ!

[QUOTE=gqhoon;97338]
Writing emails to Robyn (the office lady) and arguing for a reduced licence cost is pointless. The recommendation has been made and accepted by the Minister, a Whole Season licence is $90. Suck it up and move on.

QUOTE]

As above my post said Id had a discussion with both Robin (we were laughing and chatting thanks not arguing at all there were no personal conflicts or harsh words on either side) and a couple of others in the office and also that Ive sucked it up as you put it ...

They were also more than happy to take on board some one elses side of the story as well and thats that... There is work to be done on their side for sure getting us stakeholders on side through maybe education same as the fish guys do and various other ways.

Now unless we get some seriously serious rain it seriously aint even going to be an issue this season with a visit to our three ponds last night and as expected not a lot of water....

Nice reply gqhoon, and some good points made. I do vote each time, as I am not prepared to put myself up for election for a number of reasons, so I feel I owe it to the sport to try and elect those who I feel will best represent my interests. I was concerned that my area (Eastern F&G) had a bias towards the fishing side due to the Rotorua lakes and the income derived from fishing licenses, so I chose those who seemed to have a greater gamebird background.

I think every license holder should vote at each F&G election. It will take time, but democracy does work, and those who are no good should be weeded out.

As far as the "fuckheads" comment goes - I don't think anybody would say that to a councillors face. Maybe it is just someone showing a bit of passion, and chose the wrong words. I do agree however, that this forum is an ideal vehicle to express ideas etc, and that personal attacks are counter productive and I do not like to see them. I do like some of the freely expressed ideas, and while they may lack the eloquence of your reply, they can carry some important messages. Again - democracy at work.

Originally Posted by Fitzy

Tim there is no doubt duck nos in A/W have declined but I for one don't believe hunter harvest or improved hunting technology is the cause of this decline. The reduced nos of ducks shot each year over the past 10 years revealed in surveys support this.
As to manipulation of stats etc A/W hunters were last asked year do you want 3 shots or a short season? They responded by indicating 3 shots was ok but season length would be unchanged.
So what happens - we got both!
Some shooters have suggested that those hunters selected for survey were less than "random". There is little doubt that remits from several A/W clubs were orchestrated by sitting councillors.

Is there a chance better technology could be helping to extract more from a dwindling resource? (giving a false read of what is going on until it is plainly obvious). Surveyed bags- if people tell the truth it still doesn't tell the entire story of hunter mortality. I simply do not buy the "theory" that hunter harvest has no effect on population. Why have a limit at all if that is the case? If you thought your hunter survey was odd our hunter survey asked if you were using 2 3/4 or 3 inch shells. While I do know who that information might benifit I know it doesn't help waterfowl management. The surveys are better than nothing, but only just.

On the "technology" thing- would you say there is as much "etiquite" or "sport" involved in duck shooting or duck hunting (how ever you view it) as there was in the past? I'm interested in anyones thoughts on this....

Interesting points Tim. For clarity I don't think I'm saying harvest has no affect on population, just that it has not been the root cause of the pop decline in A/W over the past 10 years. Based on anecdotal comments from several shooters whom I respect it would seem probable that the pop level has now dropped to a point where hunter harvest could have a detrimental affect on the ability of the population to recover. On that basis regulation changes to reduce hunter harvest should be supported.

No one has yet explained the logic of banning pond feeding in the middle of what could be the worst drought in 50 years - how does this assist the duck population? Why has the A/W council not had the balls to reconsider this decision?
In reality banning pond feeding is just an example of mis guided socialism and smacks of the petty jealousies which affect so many of this councils decisions.

Originally Posted by Fitzy

Interesting points Tim. For clarity I don't think I'm saying harvest has no affect on population, just that it has not been the root cause of the pop decline in A/W over the past 10 years. Based on anecdotal comments from several shooters whom I respect it would seem probable that the pop level has now dropped to a point where hunter harvest could have a detrimental affect on the ability of the population to recover. On that basis regulation changes to reduce hunter harvest should be supported.

No one has yet explained the logic of banning pond feeding in the middle of what could be the worst drought in 50 years - how does this assist the duck population? Why has the A/W council not had the balls to reconsider this decision?
In reality banning pond feeding is just an example of mis guided socialism and smacks of the petty jealousies which affect so many of this councils decisions.

I don't think feeding is banned just shooting over a fed pond I'd imagine. The problem with feeding is luring alot of ducks into a defined area. I can take or leave pond feeding.

One of my theories (an I have many) is that flappy ducks are particularly harsh on young birds. I think we are taking out a much greater % of young than we ever did. Over a number of years I think there is the potential for an aging duck population to become less productive. I have used the analogy before of a farmer killing off all the ewe lambs. No replacements and eventually no breeding.

Originally Posted by Tim Allen

I don't think feeding is banned just shooting over a fed pond I'd imagine. The problem with feeding is luring alot of ducks into a defined area. I can take or leave pond feeding.

One of my theories (an I have many) is that flappy ducks are particularly harsh on young birds. I think we are taking out a much greater % of young than we ever did. Over a number of years I think there is the potential for an aging duck population to become less productive. I have used the analogy before of a farmer killing off all the ewe lambs. No replacements and eventually no breeding.

so would you think a drake heavy limit might help as opossed to our self imposed one??for say the last month[2months for those with 3 month seasons], of the season ??
it would get the shooters out of the road in the first month then the hunters can concentrate on bieng just that.

Originally Posted by gsp follower

so would you think a drake heavy limit might help as opossed to our self imposed one??for say the last month[2months for those with 3 month seasons], of the season ??
it would get the shooters out of the road in the first month then the hunters can concentrate on bieng just that.

I don't know if it would help. I don't think it would be a bad thing. I practice shooting mainly drakes myself. I think it would be great if those in positions to influence peoples attitudes and actions embraced a culture of selective moderate hunting.

Well I'm away for a few days. Anyone else heading into the hills have a good safe time. Best of luck.

Guys I am not sure whether you know or not but I have just read on the Herald website that the Eastern BoP area will only have a 4 week duck shooting season this year.