Thread: 300 blackout

Originally Posted by Jhon

Mmmm... I watched a Gunblue59 vid a while ago, last year sometime, where he dismissed the Blackout as the least useful/appropriate calibre ever sold to hunters. Does nothing well enough that existing calibres don't already do and better. Best left for its intended military purpose- an AR platform round for quiet close quarters fighting. Well that was his opinion anyway - after a lifetime of military and police weapons training, hunting and gunsmithing. Some validation for that view in this thread so far (ducking and diving)

But each to their own and if soneone wants to lend me one I'll happily try it out lol

Yes and no. To use modern woke terminology, my 300BLK "journey" started when I went rabbit shooting with a forum member many years ago. He turned up with an AR15 in 300BLK. I thought, yeah whatever, but he explained that he used subs on rabbits and supers on goats to good effect. I wasn't the slightest interested in the AR platform, but the cartridge intrigued me, seeming to be versatile. Roll on a few years, Hornady released the Sub-X round supposedly designed to expand at subsonic speeds which was of interest because I don't reload. Around the same time, I had a landmark birthday, so bought my novelty gun, a Bergara BA13 in 300BLK with a 16.5 inch barrel. Loved the format of the rifle, but found the Sub-X rounds extremely lacking at killing animals when taking classic chest shots, even at short range. Switched to supersonics (Hornady FTX) and it's been great. Despite things not turning out as intended, I have a very short, capable, relatively quiet bush rifle with low recoil. For reference, energy levels are around the same as .223, but obviously the ballistics are very different. Muzzle energy is 1303 ft.lb. It does fall off very quickly, but that's not an issue for close range bush hunting. I've yet to have a goat not fall down with the FTX rounds. Others use suppressed, subsonic rounds to good effect when taking CNS shots under more controlled circumstances. I wouldn't write it off.

Originally Posted by MB

Yes and no. To use modern woke terminology, my 300BLK "journey" started when I went rabbit shooting with a forum member many years ago. He turned up with an AR15 in 300BLK. I thought, yeah whatever, but he explained that he used subs on rabbits and supers on goats to good effect. I wasn't the slightest interested in the AR platform, but the cartridge intrigued me, seeming to be versatile. Roll on a few years, Hornady released the Sub-X round supposedly designed to expand at subsonic speeds which was of interest because I don't reload. Around the same time, I had a landmark birthday, so bought my novelty gun, a Bergara BA13 in 300BLK with a 16.5 inch barrel. Loved the format of the rifle, but found the Sub-X rounds extremely lacking at killing animals when taking classic chest shots, even at short range. Switched to supersonics (Hornady FTX) and it's been great. Despite things not turning out as intended, I have a very short, capable, relatively quiet bush rifle with low recoil. For reference, energy levels are around the same as .223, but obviously the ballistics are very different. Muzzle energy is 1303 ft.lb. It does fall off very quickly, but that's not an issue for close range bush hunting. I've yet to have a goat not fall down with the FTX rounds. Others use suppressed, subsonic rounds to good effect when taking CNS shots under more controlled circumstances. I wouldn't write it off.

Yeah I hear ya. I have a few novelty guns and the only excuse I need is I want it. If I didn't have a selection of Rossi levers from 357mag to 454 Casull to choose from, not to mention a short barrel 303 "bush" rifle that shoots heavy cast at 1600fps just fine I would be more tempted I guess. I suppress my hi velocity rifles but for the shooting i do I don't have a need to go subsonic other than for rabbits with .22lr. 1400 to 1800fps is pretty quiet to me in bush. If I want to carry one rifle and cover the bases I have slow cast loads in 308 and 7x57mm with reticule references to suit when zeroed for hi vel. If didn't already have all that in whats already in the safe then a Blackout might be tempting.

subx has 465 foot pounds at the muzzle

223 has 1252 foot pounds

7RM has 3109 foot pounds

308 has 2955 foot pounds

12ga with a solid has 2533 foot pounds

the mouse fart 222 has over a thousand foot pounds

so you need to make up for this deficiency by stalking closer and shooting at the important parts inside the animal you wish to stop
or use the supersonic 135gr and take a step up to 1350 foot pounds

300 Blackout is still developing along as people figure out ways to maximize it, better bullets, powders, more development and testing etc. Having reloaded 300 BO for almost 10 years, the level of knowledge and the products available specifically for it is way different now than then.

I do 300 Blackout reloading and stuff on my YT channel, same user name. I will be doing much more to come on the channel with 300 BO, with ARs and a bolt action, and suppressors and other stuff. Will experimenting for years to come with it. This year with Hornady 110 VMax and Winchester 296 powder got up to around 2500 FPS with it.

The advantages for 300 BO is 30 cal bullets in a 223 sized package. Yes, it's a short range cartridge, not meant for hundreds of yards out. However people do shoot it at longer distances for fun though.

Originally Posted by wanneroo

.................................................. ..
The advantages for 300 BO is 30 cal bullets in a 223 sized package. Yes, it's a short range cartridge, not meant for hundreds of yards out. However people do shoot it at longer distances for fun though.

It was designed for a purpose.................to fit an AR magazine and be super sonic or subsonic for use on special interest targets which are apparently not too difficult to kill unlike deer etc.

There are better 30cals based on the 223 case, 30Apache, 300Hamr., 30-204 etc but they are all wildcats so then why not just a 308 as you can get ammo virtually everywhere and it has a better supersonic performance which is what almost everyone actually uses in the field despite their best intentions.

Originally Posted by mikee

It was designed for a purpose.................to fit an AR magazine and be super sonic or subsonic for use on special interest targets which are apparently not too difficult to kill unlike deer etc.

There are better 30cals based on the 223 case, 30Apache, 300Hamr., 30-204 etc but they are all wildcats so then why not just a 308 as you can get ammo virtually everywhere and it has a better supersonic performance which is what almost everyone actually uses in the field despite their best intentions.

On my property I can't typically see much more than 100 yards due to all the trees, so for practical size and weight constraints, the 300 BO AR is more handy and convenient than my 308 rifles and more pleasant to shoot. True, nothing wrong with a 308, just depends on the situation.

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/member/1296599 this guy on the yellow site had Maker Bullets 30cal (300 BLK) 200gr Sub for sale, Americans seam to like them. I've been using 125g SST reloads without any complaints. Playing with Sub X reloads and targets. Good groups at 50 meters but just want a little more velocity, as to close to manafacutrues min velocity, wondering if I'm doing the right thing as don't always have time/opportunity for head/neck shots. Also working up 125g Sierra TMK that apparently is designed for 300BO. I like the caliber, don't mind its limitations and have a nice light/little hunting rig.

Originally Posted by Bushwalker

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/member/1296599 this guy on the yellow site had Maker Bullets 30cal (300 BLK) 200gr Sub for sale, Americans seam to like them. I've been using 125g SST reloads without any complaints. Playing with Sub X reloads and targets. Good groups at 50 meters but just want a little more velocity, as to close to manafacutrues min velocity, wondering if I'm doing the right thing as don't always have time/opportunity for head/neck shots. Also working up 125g Sierra TMK that apparently is designed for 300BO. I like the caliber, don't mind its limitations and have a nice light/little hunting rig.

The 125gr TMK works good on deer along with 125gr SST and Nosler 125gr BT, they seem to be the right constconstruction for the 300 blackout speeds at 150m and under distance.

if going to use supers /factory ammunition and reload your subs...you just about the same or indeed better off to use a 7.62x39mm and yes you can use .308 projecties in them to good effect..said it many times before,the x39mm is a 150yard rifle/cartridge so you dont require 1/4" accuracy...a 2-3" group /pattern will do chest shoulder shots with ease out to that range...but like others have said,the novelty wears off when deer are at 200-250yards.

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

if going to use supers /factory ammunition and reload your subs...you just about the same or indeed better off to use a 7.62x39mm and yes you can use .308 projecties in them to good effect..said it many times before,the x39mm is a 150yard rifle/cartridge so you dont require 1/4" accuracy...a 2-3" group /pattern will do chest shoulder shots with ease out to that range...but like others have said,the novelty wears off when deer are at 200-250yards.

Thanks ! validation of the conclusion I came to when I grabbed a Howa Mini in x39, chopped to 16" added a DPT and a red dot - light weight quiet and ideal for goats and maybe deer in the Marlborough sounds bush I reckon - ammo darn cheap too.

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

if going to use supers /factory ammunition and reload your subs...you just about the same or indeed better off to use a 7.62x39mm and yes you can use .308 projecties in them to good effect..said it many times before,the x39mm is a 150yard rifle/cartridge so you dont require 1/4" accuracy...a 2-3" group /pattern will do chest shoulder shots with ease out to that range...but like others have said,the novelty wears off when deer are at 200-250yards.

30tc/ 308/ 30-06 /300wm too
theres nothing special about a 300blk to make it push a 30cal pill 1000fps

if you are able to handload any of your 30cal rifle will do exactly the same as a 300blk
and with trail boss it is so simple

Originally Posted by Bill999

30tc/ 308/ 30-06 /300wm too
theres nothing special about a 300blk to make it push a 30cal pill 1000fps

if you are able to handload any of your 30cal rifle will do exactly the same as a 300blk
and with trail boss it is so simple

The hard part is finding Trail Boss,
I have just had a .300 BLK built mainly as a cast bullet test rifle and a small game rifle I don't own an accurate .22RF
and I don't want to waste Trail Boss, 3.5 to 6.0 grains of any fast Shotgun or pistol powder will do for sub loads
the expense is in the primer.

Originally Posted by shooternz

The hard part is finding Trail Boss,
I have just had a .300 BLK built mainly as a cast bullet test rifle and a small game rifle I don't own an accurate .22RF
and I don't want to waste Trail Boss, 3.5 to 6.0 grains of any fast Shotgun or pistol powder will do for sub loads
the expense is in the primer.

I know where a big pottle is of it just around the road from you...99% sure the owner would part with it ...or most of it to you....

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

I know where a big pottle is of it just around the road from you...99% sure the owner would part with it ...or most of it to you....

Thanks for the heads up but I don't use it that much anymore, I have a enough powder to last quite a long time,
I will run out of primers before powde.r

Originally Posted by shooternz

The hard part is finding Trail Boss,
I have just had a .300 BLK built mainly as a cast bullet test rifle and a small game rifle I don't own an accurate .22RF
and I don't want to waste Trail Boss, 3.5 to 6.0 grains of any fast Shotgun or pistol powder will do for sub loads
the expense is in the primer.

Yes indeed, been using some old ICI Nobel Shotgun No78 powder for exactly that. 12-13 gns max in my old 303 gives 1600-1800 fps with Walker 215gn (approx) gas checked boolits. Accuracy is not outstanding from the old girl but will hit and drop minute-of-goat out to 80m no problem.
10-12 gns gives around 1400fps in my Marlin 30-30 with Walker 151gn GC HPs with better accuracy. They hit pretty hard too. Neither is suppressed- don't have much interest personally in subs other than for rabbits with 22lr. More interested in emulating 19th- early twentieth century woods style hunting for table meat out to 120m with least wastage. Think 32-40, 44-40 for e g. Whitetail size ( Fallow, Goats, here) and 30-30 for the bit bigger ( Sika, Reds, Pigs)