Thread: Kayaker and great white shark

Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst

A few years back as part of shark tours on Foveaux one operator was using old wetsuits to stuff full of fish frames as it was "the perfect medium" for the sharks to rip apart for the tourists to see... teaching them that wetsuits are full of yummy fish, now that's a farking smart idea...

Really? That's got to be a piss take, surely. The same outfit was running dolphin swim tours probably haha.

That Whangarei one will be a mature female, apparently old mate from DOC (who's name is gone) that does the sharks seems to think that's a 'normal' size for an adult female white. I was sitting in at one of the talks he did a while back at the fishing club, really interesting. Apparently the things don't ever stop growing, and don't suffer from 'old age' like other species so if there's sufficient food and conditions are right... He seemed to suggest that the size we get now is mostly due to the reduction of feed in the oceans due to us fishing the hell out of everything, and that they have evidence of skeletons the size of extinct shark species but that seem to be to young to be them.

crap - evidence of skeletons of bigger - sorry mate but world wide evidence doe not support your claim - the size of our current great whites has something to do with old age but what - fact - the current measurements for great whites is what we have - but over 25 foot no - thats myth--a lot of study gone in on great whites all over the globe including here in NZ - Great whites over 25 ft are a myth - not one piece of evidence from any recent study puts a great white any bigger than 22-25- feet -if there is one bigger a very rare fish indeed and has not been recorded - yes ones imagination with this can run riot but I will go with actual proven fact

Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst

A few years back as part of shark tours on Foveaux one operator was using old wetsuits to stuff full of fish frames as it was "the perfect medium" for the sharks to rip apart for the tourists to see... teaching them that wetsuits are full of yummy fish, now that's a farking smart idea...

A mate was at the Chathams and got the chance to go out on a boat that was taking DNA samples from Whites.
The most effective way of bringing them up was troll a kids flutter board around and wait for the action.

yes had a bit to with that when I was on Chathams most big whites we came across were 14-16 feet we did not come across bigger and while I was there no one had seen bigger - but a 16 foot white is big believe me when one comes up to ya boat

Originally Posted by Barry the hunter

but a 16 foot white is big believe me when one comes up to ya boat

Or kayak like the young lad in the video.

yes thats a 15 - 16 footer he would have been worried especially when it followed him

anyone keen on buying a surf board, there ain't no way I'm getting back in the water with 20 meter great whites and eyes on them the size of tractor wheelers

and ya cant get the jaws theme out of ya brain

Originally Posted by Barry the hunter

crap - evidence of skeletons of bigger - sorry mate but world wide evidence doe not support your claim - the size of our current great whites has something to do with old age but what - fact - the current measurements for great whites is what we have - but over 25 foot no - thats myth--a lot of study gone in on great whites all over the globe including here in NZ - Great whites over 25 ft are a myth - not one piece of evidence from any recent study puts a great white any bigger than 22-25- feet -if there is one bigger a very rare fish indeed and has not been recorded - yes ones imagination with this can run riot but I will go with actual proven fact

Have a re read of what I typed - which was reporting that what the guy suggested was that they have evidence of skeletons the size of prehistoric sharks but that the age of the skeletons does not seem to tie in with what they expected on dating evidence. I don't know any more than that as I was sitting in the club listening. It showed a 'gap in the knowledge' more so than a statement of fact. Like a mako recorded caught in a net in Turkey and swung off a battleship that is bigger than the largest size you could expect for a female GW, there's always outliers to the accepted norm. I dunno, if the accepted size range for Mako's is 11-13 feet in today's oceans - there are a lot measured at bigger/longer through to the early 1900's. I would assume a similar stats set for other species in similar conditions, although I would be the first to admit assumptions are dangerous.

Further, if you have a look at the info that's available - GW's do not age the same as the rest of the animals which is why they are being studied to such a level overseas (anti-aging gold mine stuff if you could put it in a pill). There's actually been several articles over the last few months discussing this, go do a search and hunt those down - interesting in and of themselves.

Also, of interest the footage coming out of sharks getting handily munched by orca for their livers - as I typed in the bit up there, the amount of food available in the oceans and the structure of the ecosystems appears to be changing as a result of what we are doing as people and it would seem to be modifying the behaviour and activities of the apex predators. The bigger the shark, the bigger the target is what I took away from the reporting on the orca's hunting sharks so if that behaviour spreads we will be less likely to see large sharks. I think the most recent of those orca articles mentions one named Sophia, and shows footage of her munching the liver out of a shark.

Everyone knows divers goggles are just like beer goggles....

Everything is bigger, better and way more beautiful.

I’ve been looking forward to Bunji coming back. Maybe he never left..

"The largest white sharks that have been reliably measured are right around 20 feet, and any larger than this is likely impossible.

I remember hearing a story back in thr 89s about a shark fisherman I think Dunedin Harbour.
He was using small 60l drums with a wire trace to catch and tire out sharks.
Had a couple disappear and realistically he had to make a bigger one to catch the bigger shark.
Considering a normal biggish shark couldn't do much more than make the 60 pop under for only a few seconds.
Made one from a 44.
Whilst setting up the next line, his fishing mate remarked how it had disappeared completely he realized how big a fish it would take to do that and promptly buggered off to shore to have a think about things.
A long time ago and very much an urban myth so happy to be corrected.
I do remember reading about Zane Grey I think, out sports fishing for marlin hooking a whale shark somehow.
Must've been a solid system as it started to pull the boat under until they cut the line

Originally Posted by Barry the hunter

"The largest white sharks that have been reliably measured are right around 20 feet, and any larger than this is likely impossible.

Righto - you got me interested enough to question what I've been told seen or learned so I spent a time bracket dipping into the scientific rags about sharks, and whites specifically. This is the paperwork behind what goes on the public facing web pages. Interesting - seems there is a wee bit of discussion about length/size/weight and the general methodology of measuring these critters and estimating weights and lengths specifically. One point for contention seems to be how the tail sits when measuring - if the fish is on the hard and the tail (caudal) is lying flat it's likely to add a foot or more compared to when it's in the upright position as if the fish was swimming. Same if the fish is measured hanging it would seem, the caudal pulls back if the fish is hanging mouth down. There doesn't seem to be much recording of "how" these fish are measured so it tends to throw a bit of a ? for everything...

As far as the maximum length, I found the original report that gives the Google quote copied up there about anything longer than 20ft being likely impossible. The same report lists a few 'reliably measured' specimens that were longer at 23 feet, which Google doesn't mention. DOC's own handout on the things lists the longest reliably measured female at 21 feet. A few other sources list the longest reliably measured one at 19ft, 20ft, and 5.5m which is a smidge over 18 feet. Monterey Bay aquarium comes back at max size of 7m, 23feet. These are all govt agencies, outfits like National Geo or aquariums with research arms. Weight gets even more interesting, most quoting low end max of 2tons up to 2.5metric tons with one at 7500lbs (3.75 US ton).

So buggered if I know, I think the one consensus is there really isn't a consensus apart from these buggers can get BIG. One thing I've learned on the water is there is always the outlier and the exception to the rule when it comes to animals and you are going to find the one that bucks the norm and is either way smaller than it should be or blows the other end of the size chart out as well. I've had a spiny dog on the boat at 1.2m, these are listed commercially at a max of 1.1m. My wife won a rod and reel in a fishing competition a few years back for an 80cm Blue Mackerel, 4.5Kg - simply for it being the biggest one anyone had ever seen and far in excess of the normal max. Kept us in bait for a couple of charters that did. I caught a 10.1Kg Kahawhai at Astrolabe reef on a full size skirted lure, it is still the biggest kahawhai I've seen to date.

As far as the fish I saw on the IPC up north - one possible explanation is a big arse basking shark which is apparently very similar in appearance and does get to a bigger size than the GW's - but we kind of wrote that off at the time as that species is not really common in our waters and we were not in an area that has a lot of reports of that species (being quite a way north of the 39 deg S line below which is considered their prime patch). Never say never though, but the basking is really the only other species that would explain the behaviour shape and size of what we saw.

Originally Posted by Bush Basher

I’ve been looking forward to Bunji coming back. Maybe he never left..

At least some have finally twigged

Sent from my SM-S936B using Tapatalk