Thread: Another Aramoana???

I disagree tussock, NZ is training a Shi'ite dominated government/army which are a lot more palatable than the Sunni, Saudi backed enemy.

Islamic militants will never get past stage 3 because they are fucking idiots. Have you not seen how they conduct themselves on the battlefield? They are as dangerous to each other as they are to one of the 50 factions they are fighting.

Originally Posted by Tussock

Edit to add:

Police become militarised between 3 and 4
Suspicion of the populace, "terrorists" (an original Roman political concept) and "watch lists" cause stage 5 when the paranoid Roman structure starts interning citizens as "enemies of the State".

not quite how i see it happen, i think more like the docco here, but close:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fbvquHSPJU

The issue of the police bearing firearms is a fair response to the need for that sort of protection and deterrant...I believe our police should be armed...just as the police in Poland and wherever else...our society has changed...and if our firearms are at risk, then we, all FAL bearers should speak up and take a stand...

As Mussolini quoted...better one day as a lion than a hundred years as a sheep...

Originally Posted by Tussock

Look at our cops. NZ has never been richer (supposedly) and its never had more rules. You can't buy dynamite at Miter 10 anymore.

Yet supposedly the place has become so much more dangerous that we can't have guns and they desperately need them.

In other words, they want more power for failing to make the place safer.

This trend is not about to reverse.

Who has said "we can't have guns?"

The cops in Whangarei who were shot at a few days ago were reportedly unarmed and unable to stop the guy stealing their squad car.They were lucky he didn't hit and kill them.

He then hijacked another car at gunpoint and took off. I'm sure the people who were robbed of their car at gunpoint would have prefered the police were able to stop him before they were attacked.

Why shouldn't they carry guns to protect themselves and the public?

It sounds to me like the cops DO desperatly need more guns, or at least carry the ones they have.

Meh, they probably just lose them... again.

Originally Posted by systolic

Why shouldn't they carry guns to protect themselves and the public?

It has little to do with keeping the public safe.
My prediction is that would have little bearing on general public safety, just like any other country where the police are armed all the time.
Quite likely the complete opposite.

I would be ok with police carrying firearms if they demonstrated some trust towards the public and our own firearms usage.

Originally Posted by Beavis

I would be ok with police carrying firearms if they demonstrated some trust towards the public and our own firearms usage.

Exactly, but that is not happening and this distrust is trending globally in Western society. Subsequently the police themselves are undoubtedly becoming more militarized as we spiral towards an unprecedented, relentless war on terrorism

How much civil liberty will we lose trying to stop an invisible enemy? It appears the drones can't seem to connect all hits? Govt surveillance can't keep track of the terrorists and the analysts that work for these intelligence agencies seem to miss obvious suspects of extremism.

Terrorism has in recent times been used as leverage to gain more power for easier control.

Pretty much. I would rather live in a free society than give up guns for the greater good, just because a psycho or islamist might get one. Especially considering the state and the media as it were probably has a lot to do with festering people into committing acts of violence. I haven't done anything wrong, though I'm sure I meet Mr. Gillespie's criteria of what a "right wing terrorist" is.

Just turn the entire country into a prison and arrest people on the suspicion of intending to commit a crime at some time. How much safer could you get than that?

Originally Posted by Marty Henry

Just turn the entire country into a prison and arrest people on the suspicion of intending to commit a crime at some time. How much safer could you get than that?

George Orwell 1984 referred to it as "thoughtcrime"

As with some other authors he seems to have accurately predicted the direction governments are heading, you imprision your citizens to ensure their freedom.

Originally Posted by Sasquatch

Exactly, but that is not happening and this distrust is trending globally in Western society. Subsequently the police themselves are undoubtedly becoming more militarized as we spiral towards an unprecedented, relentless war on terrorism

Fantastic documentary on this on Al Jazerra here :
Deadly Force: Arming America's Police - Al Jazeera English

They dont have the necessary firearms skills to be armed all the time. one qualification shoot a year isnt it? a civilian pistol shooter does a minimum of 12 per year. They need ongoing firearms training every year to be armed full time. They dont have the money for it.