Thread: ARMS OFFICE NEWSLETTER WAIKATO DISTRICT

Originally Posted by mikee

You don't, after the last fiasco they had to accept hunting as a legit reason however much they hated it (well for a while). Once you have your E there are no mandatory club shoots to attend as far as I am aware.
Had my E for 15 years.

From the opening post.

"To get an E endorsement for an MSSA - you must provide good reason such as proof of being a professional 'culler', or of belonging to a club/organization that participates in regular shooting events with MSSA guns."

This shows that in this region at least it would be exceptionally hard (ie impossible for the foreseeable future)for me to fitt there description of fit and proper.

How long untill all regions are like this?

This is the problem with a lot of AO's they "interpret" the regulations themselves. VC if you want to do it I would be more than happy to be a referee for ya, We allow "associate" members to join the club at a reduced fee if they want to shoot in "service rifle type" events. His comments in the article are misleading. pistol NZ only looks after IPSC and IPSC 3 gun events run by its members it has nothing to do at all with similar events run by others.

Sorry mikee, "had" your E? You don't anymore? Why is that if you mind me asking? Was it because it was revoked or asked to be revoked because you weren't hitting up a club or knocking over goats and being paid for it? Just interested, not trying to be rude.

He has had and still has it, I assume

I cannot see why I cannot just own an E cat firearm just because I enjoy them for what they are. Needing any other reason seems wrong if I am a fit and proper person to have a FAL. It's seems to bring in double standards. Same with pistols, would love to shoot pistol again, I have the chance to go with someone every week and shoot theirs, I also enjoy the mechanics and the work of art of a lot of firearms, especially old English shotguns and double guns. But the hassles of a B & E are too much for me. A C wouldn't work either as some times I like to put lead down the barrel, makes you feel like your a criminal or maybe becoming one.

Cheers Mikee.
One day I will get there.

Sent from my GT-S5360T using Tapatalk 2

I had my security visit last weekend and all of the serials are now recorded - even though I don't have any E types. In Wellington they only check E cat security it would appear.

It would be good for a political party to push for a independent authority to administrate firearms instead of the useless Police bureaucrats and then I would know who to vote for next.

Originally Posted by Dougie

Sorry mikee, "had" your E? You don't anymore? Why is that if you mind me asking? Was it because it was revoked or asked to be revoked because you weren't hitting up a club or knocking over goats and being paid for it? Just interested, not trying to be rude.

Sorry Dougie my bad gramma, I have had and still hold my E endorsement, won't be giving it up anytime soon either

Originally Posted by Maca49

I think your right, there seems to be an underlying intention to reduce licences or downgrade cats.

I agree Maca.

Surrender by stealth.

I've had an E endorsement since they were invented and every relicencing since then I have been asked in a subtle way to surrender it along with my C.
The conversation usually goes along the lines of "I dont appear to be using these endorsements much so don't really need them do I" with comments like it's "Something to consider" then you won't have to have higher security costs or you could sell those firearms for a good price and use the money for a holiday or something etc.

The inspectors around here are all ex detectives and are all quite good but they also know what they're doing when they ask these questions, they may catch you at a weak moment or even sway your better judgement on the spur of the moment and with one stroke of their pen your endorsement/s, your legal right if judged a fit and proper person, is gone.... maybe for good.

My standard response is "No thanks I'll be keeping these" end of story.

I have also been asked each time to supply a list of all my non endorsed firearms for Police to hold on my behalf for "Insurance purposes" which I believe is just another way of obtaining information by stealth that the Police are not currently entitled to.
I always politely decline by saying my insuranced company already has this information.

Cheers
Pete

Originally Posted by P38

I agree Maca.

Surrender by stealth.

I've had an E endorsement since they were invented and every relicencing since then I have been asked in a subtle way to surrender it along with my C.
The conversation usually goes along the lines of "I dont appear to be using these endorsements much so don't really need them do I" with comments like it's "Something to consider" then you won't have to have higher security costs or you could sell those firearms for a good price and use the money for a holiday or something etc.

The inspectors around here are all ex detectives and are all quite good but they also know what they're doing when they ask these questions, they may catch you at a weak moment or even sway your better judgement on the spur of the moment and with one stroke of their pen your endorsement/s, your legal right if judged a fit and proper person, is gone.... maybe for good.

My standard response is "No thanks I'll be keeping these" end of story.

I have also been asked each time to supply a list of all my non endorsed firearms for Police to hold on my behalf for "Insurance purposes" which I believe is just another way of obtaining information by stealth that the Police are not currently entitled to.
I always politely decline by saying my insuranced company already has this information.

Cheers
Pete

That just makes me pissed. Why not be straight up with somebody than beat around the bush with clever wording. Interviewing you like you're a criminal, great. My AO has voiced his distaste for semi autos to me, but at least he is straight up and knows what he is an is not able to do under the law. He's great to deal with. I really feel for you guys who have to put up with all the bullshit from vetting officers and AO's who just can't keep their beak out of your rightful business.

Originally Posted by Col.Whiplash

I had my security visit last weekend and all of the serials are now recorded - even though I don't have any E types. In Wellington they only check E cat security it would appear.

It would be good for a political party to push for a independent authority to administrate firearms instead of the useless Police bureaucrats and then I would know who to vote for next.

Nows that's a brilliant idea and this forum could become that authority? You wouldn't find any party better equipped and with more knowledge!
Colonel I vote you president of the board!

Originally Posted by Beavis

That just makes me pissed. Why not be straight up with somebody than beat around the bush with clever wording. Interviewing you like you're a criminal, great. My AO has voiced his distaste for semi autos to me, but at least he is straight up and knows what he is an is not able to do under the law. He's great to deal with. I really feel for you guys who have to put up with all the bullshit from vetting officers and AO's who just can't keep their beak out of your rightful business.

They way to really stuff them up would be for everyone on this forum to apply for a C cat, problem would be cost, but if I did apply I don't see how it could be refused based on my life long interest alone. I'll think about that.

The system is used to intimidate law abiding firearms owners away from doing things we're legally entitled to do. We're made to feel like criminals for wanting things we're legally entitled to own and discouraged from perfectly legal and honest actions like applying for import permits or mail order forms.

Well looks like there will be over 250,000.00 registered NZ cullers businesses soon.

Problem solved

Like it or not, its all in black and white.......... (until it changes....???)

Cut and paste from: Arms Code Section 3: Understanding firearms | New Zealand Police

Military-style semi-automatics (MSSAs)
MSSAs are used for hunting, pest control, and target shooting. The reason for which the endorsement is sought becomes a condition of granting the endorsement. This means that you must obtain Police approval for each activity you wish to undertake with your MSSA.

MSSAs may only be used by a person who holds an E endorsement, and only if they have obtained from the Arms Officer a permit to procure the MSSA they wish to use.

Cut and paste from: Arms Code Section 4: Firearms Licensing | New Zealand Police

‘B’ Endorsement (29(2)(a) Arms Act 1983)
Target Shooting Pistol Club Members This allows the holder to possess and use pistols as a
member of an incorporated pistol club recognised by the Commissioner of Police. Pistols may only be used on a range approved by the Commissioner of Police.

‘E’ Endorsement (30( b) Arms Act 1983)
Military-style semi-automatics

This is required for people to have military style semi-automatic rifles and shotguns. MSSAs can only be used by people with an ‘E’ endorsement. An MSSA cannot be used ‘under supervision.’ No one may use an MSSA without this endorsement.

Revocation
A licence may be revoked as a result of irresponsible behaviour with firearms.
Your firearms licence or endorsements can be revoked by a Commissioned Officer of the Police if you act in such a way that indicates you are no longer a fit and proper person to be in possession of a firearm.

Domestic violence
Police may seize firearms and consider revocation of a person’s firearms licence if that person is thought to be involved in family (domestic) violence.

A protection order issued under the Domestic Violence Act automatically revokes a firearms licence. If you wish to keep owning or using firearms when a protection order applies to you, you must ask the Court to allow you to keep your licence. This is usually done by responding to the notice sent to you by the Court when the order is first taken out.

It is an offence to be in possession of firearms or airguns after your firearms licence has been revoked.

Licence expiry
A firearms licence expires after 10 years. You should apply for a new licence, or surrender your current one, before it expires. Once a licence expires it costs much more to obtain another one. (This higher fee reflects the actual cost of issuing a licence.)

The application is for a ‘new licence’. Full vetting is carried out by Police. Security will be inspected. Police will ask how many firearms you possess so as to ensure that the security they inspect is adequate.

Endorsements
Any endorsements attached to your firearms licence continues if you apply for a new licence before the current one expires. Otherwise the endorsements expire with the licence and an additional fee is required to apply for any new endorsement(s). When you apply to renew your licence you will be required to justify continuing to hold the endorsement.

This is the requirements by law for any endorsement, you sign your life away to abide by when getting your endorsement:http://www.police.govt.nz/sites/default/files/services/firearms/safe-storage-requirements-for-endorsements-pol67n.pdf

I thought I had a copy of the E application form. It does state you must prove you have known your referees for at least .... years. Your referees must be people involved in the firearms industry or a club who can prove you are a fit an proper person.

I will look harder and see if I can get a copy of what is written on the form.