Thread: Caller Mike

Originally Posted by Cordite

I'd say, legalise drugs (morphine, opium, cannabis, cocaine). Not methamphetamine - no one would use it if quality cocaine is available.

Have them sold from state outlets, 75% of tax collected above GST to be ring fenced for drug addiction treatments to avoid the moral abyss that is the current state with government alcohol tax revenue.

OK there will be some harm to the individuals choosing to use drugs, but I do wonder if there really would be additional harm. There always will be individuals who choose to self destruct. But let them do so without becoming burglars or having to sell their bodies.

As drug use automatically bars people from working for their upkeep (urine drug screens commonplace nowadays), it should automatically mean that WINZ treats users as non-jobseekers and consequently refuses to support them in their choice - unless on treatment.

Employers would likely move to a system looking at drug levels rather than just the detection of a substance.

Benefit to society will be that gangs and a wide range of criminals will have their precious incomes removed, drop in burglaries etc.

We can stop locking our doors, and cease worrying no matter how many Kiwi criminals, gang members etc that Australia decide to export back to us. They will just become harmless Kiwi motorcycle clubs ---- but with fewer Harleys, more Hondas.

The problem I would suggest here, is that they will move to other revenue streams. Violence, robbery, kidnapping / ransom, murder for hire.....They are gangs, they will make money doing things law abiding people won't, as that is where there is no competition for them (easier money) I am not suggesting that we should or should not legalise drugs, but the logic that it will reduce offending is flawed. These ass wipes of humanity will continue to prey upon others in any way they can. It is not all about the money, it is also about the power over other people.

Originally Posted by timattalon

The problem I would suggest here, is that they will move to other revenue streams. Violence, robbery, kidnapping / ransom, murder for hire.....They are gangs, they will make money doing things law abiding people won't, as that is where there is no competition for them (easier money) I am not suggesting that we should or should not legalise drugs, but the logic that it will reduce offending is flawed. These ass wipes of humanity will continue to prey upon others in any way they can. It is not all about the money, it is also about the power over other people.

@timattalon

Yes, to quote Jesus, "The poor you will always have with you."

But we are of course not talking here about creating Utopia, but of decreasing the sheer scale of the problem.

Apply the lessons of the Alcohol Prohibition era, just as we have done with alcohol. We are currently getting served the costly lessons of the Drug Prohibition era (drug prohibition is a relatively new phenomenon). The blows come down hard and painful, but there is a lag time before we get it and act accordingly.

Originally Posted by Cordite

@timattalon

Yes, to quote Jesus, "The poor you will always have with you."

But we are of course not talking here about creating Utopia, but of decreasing the sheer scale of the problem.

Apply the lessons of the Alcohol Prohibition era, just as we have done with alcohol. We are currently getting served the costly lessons of the Drug Prohibition era (drug prohibition is a relatively new phenomenon). The blows come down hard and painful, but there is a lag time before we get it and act accordingly.

Fair point. And used properly, most of those drugs do have medicinal uses.

Poor I can live with. Assistance and help can lift them up to a point where they are happier. Choosing violence, thuggery and power simply pisses me off. Especially if it allows them to be lazy as well. And you are correct, they will always be there.

let me advise you gentlemen -having had individuals whose lives were wrecked and probably will be forevermore by these wee social intoxicants pass through mental health systems over the years,and having to try and repair such devastation,i would NEVER vote for legalisation.
cannabis as analgesia in terminal illness yes.
ponder this
alcohol&tobacco are legal drugs -were allfamiliar with the wrecks these agents have left behind -wrecks paid for by you the taxpayer-has our heaslth system developed to cope with these,have polis,police judges got on top of the drinkdriving problem?
was it not a stupid poli Peter Dunne ,who in succumbing to social pressurelegalised that shitstorm synthetic cannabis(an absolute fucking nightmare++++++++++++++)to even begin to treat ,and highly likely never to be the same again.) then reversed that .as an aside the king of synthetics went bankrupt and fucked off like a malevolent snake to bangkok so his creditors cant touch him.
Im not pissing in you pocket or teacinyou to suck eggs ,just putting some very fucking nasty facts into print,gained from my frontline experience.
BTW-cocaine -most dangerous of all -it takes very little to deveolop a craving for"the colombian marching powder",it induces a cocaine psychosis characterised by extreme paranoia -;colombia is a catholic country -not need for contraception -your local drug lord gives you a bullet through ya swede cause "he hear" you open your mouth to authorities.oh yes prolonged usage will burn out the septum-the divider cartilage in your nose saw a colour photo once of a human skull at autopsy -septum looked like it was eaten by black tar-cocaine.
dental anaesthetics are based on cocaine derivatives -leave it there .where thers money there will always be unsrcupulous barstards wanting to reap it by legal means or not -legalisation =minimisation of harm is a fucking fallacy

hope it didnt upset your appetit ,have a nice day.

Originally Posted by kotuku

let me advise you gentlemen -having had individuals whose lives were wrecked and probably will be forevermore by these wee social intoxicants pass through mental health systems over the years,and having to try and repair such devastation,i would NEVER vote for legalisation.
cannabis as analgesia in terminal illness yes.
ponder this
alcohol&tobacco are legal drugs -were allfamiliar with the wrecks these agents have left behind -wrecks paid for by you the taxpayer-has our heaslth system developed to cope with these,have polis,police judges got on top of the drinkdriving problem?
was it not a stupid poli Peter Dunne ,who in succumbing to social pressurelegalised that shitstorm synthetic cannabis(an absolute fucking nightmare++++++++++++++)to even begin to treat ,and highly likely never to be the same again.) then reversed that .as an aside the king of synthetics went bankrupt and fucked off like a malevolent snake to bangkok so his creditors cant touch him.
Im not pissing in you pocket or teacinyou to suck eggs ,just putting some very fucking nasty facts into print,gained from my frontline experience.
BTW-cocaine -most dangerous of all -it takes very little to develop a craving for"the Colombian marching powder",it induces a cocaine psychosis characterised by extreme paranoia -; Colombia is a catholic country -not need for contraception -your local drug lord gives you a bullet through ya swede cause "he hear" you open your mouth to authorities.oh yes prolonged usage will burn out the septum-the divider cartilage in your nose saw a colour photo once of a human skull at autopsy -septum looked like it was eaten by black tar-cocaine.
dental anaesthetics are based on cocaine derivatives -leave it there .where there's money there will always be unscrupulous bastards wanting to reap it by legal means or not -- legalisation = minimisation of harm is a fucking fallacy

hope it didn't upset your appetite ,have a nice day.

@kotuku

I agree with everything you said, except for smokers being a cost to society. It is an old fallacy, since they more than cover the cost of their additional hospital treatments required through tobacco taxes, and also draw less pensions. Likewise, alcohol abusers also are covered by alcohol taxes, and very well covered. But try and get someone admitted for alcohol rehab. Remember the place we used to be able to send people to in Hamner Springs? My idea is to ring fence 75% of tax revenue from drugs to addiction treatment, and I'd be very happy to see a total ban on any drug advertising, including alcohol. Also, having drugs only legally sold through state outlets would prevent the synthetic cannabis disaster where unknown compounds were included.

Anyway, I don't propose legalisation in order to minimise harm to drug users themselves, but to recognise drug abuse as a nasty fact of life and to kill a massive criminal business feeding off the well-intended but futile effort at stopping it. My basic premiss is that if someone is hell bent on destroying themselves with drugs, dissuade them, don't encourage them, educate them, and then leave them the choice in a way that does not require them to come and burglarise my home.

My experience at school was that out of the three cannabis buggered students minds in a much more permanent way. It seemed to interfere with learning in a way nothing else did. Just my observation.

Originally Posted by 300CALMAN

My experience at school was that out of the three cannabis buggered students minds in a much more permanent way. It seemed to interfere with learning in a way nothing else did. Just my observation.

I have worked at several jobs where some of my work colleagues not friends were regular cannabis users, at the start of the work day they were fine but after their lunch break joint
they were totally usless their ability to do simple tasks probably dropped 50% their accident rate went up, Two uni dropouts i knew well would spend the weekend stoned at least they
never smoked during the week but they needed Monday to get straight, This was before drug testing in the work place became common,
Now I hear people bragging that they pasted the drug test and got the job they went for like it was a major achievement, our society is getting as sick as Americas
what is wrong with New Zealand that people need to be stoned or high to get by.

well its been scientifically proven that cannabis weakens the learning centres of the immature human brain, all so causes phycosis to all ready mentally unbalanced (chemically) minds.

yup what i put up was as i said based on MY experience 47yrs in the paddocks of psychosis. the biggest problem and theres no fucking way round it is that the human creature has a faculty called choice .
Ive had a case this week with alcohol thats gonna end in casket very shortly as sure as christ made little apples
-weve put our top guns on to this one but na "i havent got a problem ,i can sort it "4+bottles of wine a day ,a car written off ,nearly a fatality ,a mother +besty whose an addiction specialist ringing me experessing their gratitude for someone putting the brakes on -all this one wants to do is sool lawyers onto us for false detention!
Ladies and gentelmen -taxpayers all -despite your taxes being poured into the sector of mental health when it comes to addictions
YOU MAY LEAD THY HORSE TO WATER ,THY CANNOT MAKE IT DRINK!!!!!! in my case we cant fucking stop it.
I await the day when Im doing a discharge plan and under community care I will type"FUNERAL DIRECTOR".
It may be non PC under seen by softcocks as unprofessional but those on here who are in the frontline_coppers firemen ,secruity ambos lawyers(sheit did i say that)willsee my black sense of humour and hopefully appreciate it for what it is. the incumbent govts proposed monetary injection -go into the public bar pisser with your mates -flop em out let it flow -be as useful.
no amont of cash or softcock enquiry is gonna solve 2 decades+of mental health neglect .

Ahh the joy's of 'community' care.

The community largely doesn't care that's one problem the other is those that do are not capable of coping with the number of people needing help

mr proud kiwi .ive just had a very amiable discussion with the nursing council of new zealnd in which i raised a lot of issues i have commented on here -obviously more diplomatically couched of course.even they had to offer me an apology over recent dealings with me -an apology willingly accepted,and in return i expressed my appreciation of their going out of there way to hear me out! and we discussed a few salient points .
needless to say weve come to a very reasonable consesnus(IMHO) so youll be very pleased and destressed to know as far as im concerned its matter closed.
you do realise of course you are under no nobligation to read the offbeat meanderings of a presenile psychiatric nurse ,its a perfectly acceptable option to gaze intently upon the bust wee medical professionals on shortland street .may your bunions get soft and your haemmerhoids neer get hard .good day to you.
sorry to hijack the thread gents ,maybe time for a wee holiday for me .adios over and out!

Originally Posted by kotuku

mr proud kiwi .ive just had a very amiable discussion with the nursing council of new zealnd in which i raised a lot of issues i have commented on here -obviously more diplomatically couched of course.even they had to offer me an apology over recent dealings with me -an apology willingly accepted,and in return i expressed my appreciation of their going out of there way to hear me out! and we discussed a few salient points .
needless to say weve come to a very reasonable consesnus(IMHO) so youll be very pleased and destressed to know as far as im concerned its matter closed.
you do realise of course you are under no nobligation to read the offbeat meanderings of a presenile psychiatric nurse ,its a perfectly acceptable option to gaze intently upon the bust wee medical professionals on shortland street .may your bunions get soft and your haemmerhoids neer get hard .good day to you.
sorry to hijack the thread gents ,maybe time for a wee holiday for me .adios over and out!

@kotuku dont go too far, you are one of the sane ones we would like to keep.......