Thread: Cop beaten and side arm taken.

Originally Posted by ebf

Macca, had a think about your initial comments again (tighten controls and 12g), and thought that you might have been taking the piss by applying gun-control rhetoric to the police. If that was the case, my brain was obviously not in first gear yesterday.

But having read your latest comments, I don't know - it's kind of Genghis Khan meets Jane Fonda

ebf Most is tongue in cheek, except when Im serious. Your choice, but this should never happen to a cop, I dont go to work and expose myself to this type of treatment, when it happens to a cop hit it with a sledge hammer, No cop should be hurt or killed in doing their job,
It is unacceptable.

I don't think the problem is with lack of prison time, it's that life in prison is far to comfortable. They are in there with their mates and TV etc. Should be solitary confinement with nothing but educational books to read, you might even be able to reduce sentences if it is that much less desirable. IMHO

Most of the "hard" criminals I have met have either looked forward to prison or aren't fussed at all going back.

Pisses me off that the one assault charge that relates to assaulting Police holds less of a sentence than the equivalent common assault charge.

A bit on one news about excessive force.
ffs he was disarmed and beaten, clearly not enough force was used.

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Yeh with you on that VC. Seems that what was reported is being refuted by many good citizens.

See the thing on the news where they cut that guys hand off in mali or some place.

Missed that

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He broke the rules but they werent clear on what he broke.

Originally Posted by Toby

See the thing on the news where they cut that guys hand off in mali or some place.

Yes I did Toby. It has actually been a quite common punishment for theft in Islamic countries through the centuries. the reason it is on the news is that the Al Queda sympathisers that are trying to take control of Mali are using that sort of punishment to make the locals toe the line.

[QUOTE=veitnamcam;74280]A bit on one news about excessive force.
ffs he was disarmed and beaten, clearly not enough force was used.

No where near enough force & the wrong guy in hospital .
Almost makes me wonder if he was set up for that beating .

I'm gonna make myself unpopular and say that while it was an unfortunate outcome for the officer, he made a bad judgement call in deciding to push for an arrest. When he realised it was going sideways at the very beginning he should have backed off and waited for another day.

The only time he should really have pushed his luck with the arrest is if other members of the public etc would have been put in immediate and serious harm’s way if the guy was left to walk around.

Short answer is he fucked up and paid the price.

Typically sole charge cops are chosen (even though you actually apply for the slot) because they tend to be a little more relaxed, realistic, calm and have a bit of experience. Unfortunately I'm not seeing those traits in this example.

Everyone makes mistakes though and ultimately he got away pretty lightly given the depth of poo he got himself into.

I hope that he recovers quickly, learns from the experience and comes back an even better cop than before.

Hold on there Kiwi, the cop was tackled by a guy who ran across from the other side of the road. Then everyone pounced on him. Had he waited for backup, the guy who he had the warrant for may have bailed.
Kawhia is turning into a bad place compared to the quaint fishing town it used to be. Maybe Griff has been stationed there for ages?
Previous comments by others about prison being too nice, totally agree. It ought to be cold bare concrete floors, no windows, bad meals (with barely sufficient nutritional value) and make them work hard for no gain.
3 serious convictions = string em up. No pussy footing "oh he's had a hard life" soft touch sentences...

Peril 787b & 7mmwsm - I'm not sure if you have read and comprehended my post properly. My comments were based on facts submitted from both camps and regardless of those facts I still stand by my position.

Risk management is a factor in every job under the sun. For frontline cops, the consequences of managing the risk incorrectly are generally much higher than for say a retail assistant. I would like to think that every cop is aware of that when they sign up.

As for the guy on a warrant getting away before backup showed - who cares. Do you have any idea how many warrants are issued by the courts every week? A truck load!!!

As soon as he realised it was going pear shaped he should have backed off and sorted it another day. Instead we have what we have. It could have ended up WAY worse given he lost both his glock and taser.

In short, it was a fuck up.

Proudkiwi, it had the potential to go pear shaped irrespective of the actions or inactions of the constable. Imagine for a moment that the constable had acted as you suggest and stood down from attempting the arrest and the subject had then subsequent to leaving committed an heinous crime (assault, rape, murder). Those circumstances would attract similar criticism of the actions of the constable from certain quarters of society. The role of the Police is not an easy one and in my view they deserve far greater support from the community for the good (often thankless) work they do. I know that they choose to enter the job knowing what it entails and I for one am grateful that they do.

In short, it was a fuck up.

It was fucked up, fucked up at the lack of respect and help shown towards a Police officer.
Walking away would be a lot easier said than done with the adrenalin going, wanting to carry out your job/not wanting to empower the bastard criminals by showing both them and the public that your 'scared' (view that would be perceived) of them.

As far as I'm aware none of us were there so its all if, buts and maybes.

No one died and the gun made it back to police hands so maybe we should all just be thankful for small miracles?

Nibblet, you have just reinforced the position I have taken in my posts.

All of the reasons you have outlined for pushing forward with an arrest are the EXACT opposite of what a professional police officer should be considering. Its thought processes like that that lead to fuck ups.

Consider this. Offender is sitting with mates having a beer while fishing. Cop comes along knowing there is a warrant for his arrest and thinks to himself, 'score, I have been looking for you for a while.' He goes over and says "Hello sunshine, can I have a chat for a minute? Theres a warrant out for you that we really need to get tidied up"

Offender feeling all empowered bacause he has a bunch of mates around him says - "piss off

Cop realising that this could go sideways big time thinks to himself "yeah, this really isint worth me getting shit kicked over and its a warrant for a pretty minor offence" so says to the offender "sweet as, I'll do you a deal, if you come to see me at the station tomorrow we can sort it out then"

Offender doesnt lose face in front of his mates, cop looks like a seriously reasonable sort in front of everyone including the offender, his mates, all bystanders and the offenders family. And if he does come to the station the following day then even better. Not saying he will, but in my experience it happens at least 20% of the time depending on how you deal with it.

If the cop thinks there is very little chance he will come in, he waits and watches till the offender is on his own, ideally asleep, and goes and does the business on his terms.

Its what smart cops do.

What actually happened was anything but smart. It was a fuck up.