Thread: Feeling sick after reading this !

Hello friends ,
Well this morning I was browsing and scrolling social media and I came across this from Kiwi gun blog.
Yuck I felt sick after reading this :

WELCOME TO 2023 from Sporting Shooters Association Blog
You probably thought the last four years (2019, 20, 21 & 22) have been bad for law abiding citizens who have been vetted to be fit and proper people to own a firearm.
YOU AINT SEEN NOTHING YET.
2023 will see the start of the registration of all your firearms, with increased fees for every interaction you make with your new Police “Regulator”.
Many of your favourite shooting clubs and ranges are likely to close as they face intrusive bureaucracy and costs from the “Regulator”.
Many of your favourite gun related businesses will close as they face increased costs and interference by the “Regulator”.
Public events will no longer feature military reenactments or displays of firearms such as seen at Armistice in Cambridge, thanks to new costs and interference from the “Regulator”.
Gun Shows and Auctions are likely to become a thing of the past, as the “Regulator” imposes more restrictions and costs on these events.
The “Regulator" is already proposing to issue expensive permits to allow collectors to transport their guns to events, how long before they apply the same permit to carry to hunters?
The “Regulator” claims to want the safest firearm environment in the world - the sad reality is that we already had that in New Zealand prior to 2019.
The whole ethos of the 1983 Arms Act was - make it easy and most people will comply with the law, and we did; sadly the police have forgotten this.
Conversely over regulation leads to resentment and non- compliance.


Not sure if I managed to copy the whole article but... Bad news.
Why do we need to be 'the safest firearm enviroment in the world' ??

Having the aspirational goal of being the safest firearm environment in the world is admirable however for that to ever occur there first needs to be a paradigm shift away from the head in the sand denial by authorities that countless illegal firearms have been entering this country via sea freight shipping containers for decades now. The oppressive changes in firearms legislation that we law abiding firearms license holders have been subjected to over the last few years are predicated upon the wrongful belief by the law makers and their influencers that we are the most significant contributor to the existence of illegal firearms in this country and whilst it is true that legitimately owned firearms do sometimes end up in the hands of criminals and other non licensed people in society, in reality nothing could be further from the truth. Further to this, the refusal by the law makers and the administrators of the various firearms legislation to acknowledge their involvement in the failures that contributed to the wrongful issue of a firearms license has given rise to repeated actions of doubling down to support their denial of complicity. Given the above, it is understandable that we will face continuing changes to firearms legislation.

So how do we change this and bring an end to the nonsensical legislative amendments? I think we need to go loud! I think we need to say “Enough of this persecution” and “We will not stand for it any longer ”. We licensed firearms are highly law abiding, we did not contribute to the failings that lead to the Christchurch massacre and we absolutely do not deserve to be continually subjected to the hostility and ill treatment of those that did contribute to it just because they want to continue to deflect.

In my opinion the biggest challenge facing us is not continued legislative changes, it is spurring the apathetic among us into meaningful action and convincing the public that a large sector of law abiding Kiwis have been wrongfully blamed and made scapegoats for reasons of expediency.

Rant over.

Originally Posted by Rushy

there first needs to be a paradigm shift away from the head in the sand denial by authorities that countless illegal firearms have been entering this country via sea freight shipping containers for decades now.

If that was the case, we'd be seeing a lot more intercepts in sea containers than we do currently? I can hunt down the report if you are interested, but the amount of weapons seized via sea cargo vs air cargo was massively on the side of air cargo. And its not a case of they aren't looking because we see plenty of drug intercepts in sea cargo.

There are really only 2 ways that legal firearms get into the hands of crims in NZ, straw purchasing and theft.

Originally Posted by HG Man

If that was the case, we'd be seeing a lot more intercepts in sea containers than we do currently? I can hunt down the report if you are interested, but the amount of weapons seized via sea cargo vs air cargo was massively on the side of air cargo. And its not a case of they aren't looking because we see plenty of drug intercepts in sea cargo.

There are really only 2 ways that legal firearms get into the hands of crims in NZ, straw purchasing and theft.

Sorry but I simply don’t buy that. Of the three thousand million (rounded) containers that come in to New Zealand every year, how many are thoroughly checked by NZ customs let alone checked thoroughly checked for the presence of firearms. I would suggest that of those containers that are checked by customs, their primary focus would be on unwelcome organisms and drugs. I have no reason to believe that NZ Customs intercept all of the drugs that come in to the country in containers and I have even less reason to believe that there aren’t any firearms concealed with the drug shipments that get through. Hell, I wonder how many customs officers would even recognise firearms parts for what they were if they were on an X-ray screen in front of them. Customs simply do not have the resources required to comprehensively inspect every container that comes here.

Originally Posted by Rushy

Of the three thousand million (rounded) containers that come in to New Zealand every year

How much rounding are you doing on that? Thats 3 Billion containers. There are roughly 65-70K a month coming into NZ, thats 800K, rounded. Another thing, you are confusing Biosecurity and Customs. I'd suggest you have a read of the Customs Annual Report, it gives a good background on how they are doing.

'Customs simply do not have the resources required to comprehensively inspect every container that comes here'. No one says they do, but to suggest that somehow they are only finding the shipments with drugs and not the ones with drugs and guns doesn't make any sense.

Why would you go to all the trouble of importing guns, when you can just send an clean skin to a gun shop and buy what you need, or just rob someone and steal their firearms?

Originally Posted by HG Man

How much rounding are you doing on that? Thats 3 Billion containers. There are roughly 65-70K a month coming into NZ, thats 800K, rounded. Another thing, you are confusing Biosecurity and Customs. I'd suggest you have a read of the Customs Annual Report, it gives a good background on how they are doing.

'Customs simply do not have the resources required to comprehensively inspect every container that comes here'. No one says they do, but to suggest that somehow they are only finding the shipments with drugs and not the ones with drugs and guns doesn't make any sense.

Why would you go to all the trouble of importing guns, when you can just send an clean skin to a gun shop and buy what you need, or just rob someone and steal their firearms?

Happy to concede that my number relating to containers was grossly inaccurate (not intentional). But even by using your numbers that is still a couple of thousand containers per day and I don’t for a moment believe that they all get inspected. To answer your question as to why you would go to the trouble my answer is because it would be easy and would yield far greater quantities than your suggested clean skin or theft.

Originally Posted by Rushy

Sorry but I simply don’t buy that. Of the three thousand million (rounded) containers that come in to New Zealand every year, how many are thoroughly checked by NZ customs let alone checked thoroughly checked for the presence of firearms. I would suggest that of those containers that are checked by customs, their primary focus would be on unwelcome organisms and drugs. I have no reason to believe that NZ Customs intercept all of the drugs that come in to the country in containers and I have even less reason to believe that there aren’t any firearms concealed with the drug shipments that get through. Hell, I wonder how many customs officers would even recognise firearms parts for what they were if they were on an X-ray screen in front of them. Customs simply do not have the resources required to comprehensively inspect every container that comes here.

Customs have authored a document that listed the guns and parts seized over the past number of years. It is probably somewhere on the customs website

Originally Posted by HG Man

If that was the case, we'd be seeing a lot more intercepts in sea containers than we do currently? I can hunt down the report if you are interested, but the amount of weapons seized via sea cargo vs air cargo was massively on the side of air cargo. And its not a case of they aren't looking because we see plenty of drug intercepts in sea cargo.

There are really only 2 ways that legal firearms get into the hands of crims in NZ, straw purchasing and theft.

@HG Man. Yes and no. There is a lot that are bought for gangs and crims either by criminal-friendly types or under duress. Or stolen, the second one will be them doubling down on the security issues. Im sure though they don't want to admit that they are making the biggest shopping list when abused (and it will happen by stealth, mistake or hacking).
Also the rozzers freely, well not freely, admit that they only get less than 10% of all drugs imported to this country.
I could defer that they arent getting more as there isn't a bunch of proper sub-machine guns popping up all the time, especially with all the AK's and AR semiautos that were floating about but it will be happening more than you would like to admit

Originally Posted by HG Man

If that was the case, we'd be seeing a lot more intercepts in sea containers than we do currently? I can hunt down the report if you are interested, but the amount of weapons seized via sea cargo vs air cargo was massively on the side of air cargo. And its not a case of they aren't looking because we see plenty of drug intercepts in sea cargo.

There are really only 2 ways that legal firearms get into the hands of crims in NZ, straw purchasing and theft.

Ok, I’ll call you out. Let’s see the written proof to support your statements. Also be interested to know your background to stand by those statements. I have a nephew who spends time between ports of Tauranga and Auckland in container management and says container inspection numbers is pitiful.

Originally Posted by woods223

Ok, I’ll call you out. Let’s see the written proof to support your statements. Also be interested to know your background to stand by those statements. I have a nephew who spends time between ports of Tauranga and Auckland in container management and says container inspection numbers is pitiful.

https://www.customs.govt.nz/about-us...s-intercepted/

So its not a report, but its better. You can clearly see that air cargo intercepts of weapons massively outnumber sea cargo. My job is tangently related to the border and I deal with Customs on some things. I also try and read the annual reports of major Govt departments, so I know what my taxes are going towards.

Originally Posted by HG Man

https://www.customs.govt.nz/about-us...s-intercepted/

So its not a report, but its better. You can clearly see that air cargo intercepts of weapons massively outnumber sea cargo. My job is tangently related to the border and I deal with Customs on some things. I also try and read the annual reports of major Govt departments, so I know what my taxes are going towards.

What you fail to recognize is these are only the figures of what is being intercepted not what is being missed. Air freight is loose shipping and easily inspected, containers are not. The money being spent on this worthless firearms register would far better be spent on beefing up port customs and better screening equipment for packed containers.
FACT: Only 2%-5% of sea freighted containers are being inspected. Of this pitiful amount of containers being inspected they found over 5800 firearms. Now do the math on the amount of firearms that are getting in unchecked!

Once again people are under some illusion that this constant attack on lawful firearms owners is to stop some sort of crime occurring..
Firearms will still be stolen whether they are registered or not, what difference will it make if they are on a register to a criminal? You can bet your ass the small number of LFAO's that sell to crims wont register what they sell or just report them lost/stolen anyway.


https://fb.watch/hOdskv8J4f/

Originally Posted by HG Man

If that was the case, we'd be seeing a lot more intercepts in sea containers than we do currently? I can hunt down the report if you are interested, but the amount of weapons seized via sea cargo vs air cargo was massively on the side of air cargo. And its not a case of they aren't looking because we see plenty of drug intercepts in sea cargo.

There are really only 2 ways that legal firearms get into the hands of crims in NZ, straw purchasing and theft.

with only 5% of sea containers scanned, thats how illegal guns get in. Remember the container that was moved from the Auckland wharf to a holding facility and was then stolen the next night. A whole container was stolen and has never been recovered. The stolen truck was recovered though. One wonders what was in the container.

Originally Posted by HG Man

If that was the case, we'd be seeing a lot more intercepts in sea containers than we do currently? I can hunt down the report if you are interested, but the amount of weapons seized via sea cargo vs air cargo was massively on the side of air cargo. And its not a case of they aren't looking because we see plenty of drug intercepts in sea cargo.

There are really only 2 ways that legal firearms get into the hands of crims in NZ, straw purchasing and theft.

Are you dreaming...? If what you say was even close to being true there would almost be no drugs in NZ at all as they would be intercepted at the border. Here is something I learnt from a former customs officer, If you want 5x containers or two to get in without inspection, send 6- one to each port. We have limited xray machines (it was one for a long time) that are shared between ports. If a container gets picked up, then the machine is not at the other ports.......and considering the numbers of containers entering NZ exceed the population by about 50 to 1 (50 containers per year per person) there is no way every container can be checked . In fact the % is so low that it would scare most people....

They only check every 7th container .

Originally Posted by Steffan

They only check every 7th container .

Thats an awful lot more that I was informed of. Closer to 1:50. But the 1:7 could be the paperwork auditing where they are checking the tax revenue declarations.....