Thread: The real reason for B/E-cat storage requirements and inspections

Originally Posted by Sasquatch

I wouldn't say it's illegal, more so, it is frowned upon by 'law enforcement'. There is no law stipulating it is a criminal offence to defend yourself with necessary force. Necessary being so, that if your dwelling is being invaded by armed burglars who want your guns.

Yeah true, but having it ready for defence is surely not legal. And by the time the safe is opened and the ammo loaded etc its probably gonna be too late. Unless you just so happened to have the gun out already for maintenance etc then its unlikely to be any use.

Personally I think that any intruder in your home should be treated as an immediate threat to you and your families safety. (Regardless of any weapons visible)
I'm not speaking from experience, but if someone came into my house I would assume I was being flanked by their fellow scumbags (going around to the other doors/windows and attempting to surround me or get to my family) and the only reasonable defence would be to try to incapacitate, with no hesitation whoever I see first then move onto the next guy and give my family as much time as I can to hide or escape etc. (watched enough movies eh)

As for reasonable force in a situation like that, How would an aggressive intruder in your home react if you tried to defend yourself but didn't hit hard enough, or missed? Do they deserve to be hit softly or carefully?
HELL NO! the only reasonable amount of force in a situation like that is to use all of it! what ever is the best tool you have immediate access to: bat, gun, kung fu, what ever you can to ensure they do not get up while your back is turned, so you can continue to protect your family from the next guy who is probably climbing in your daughters window by now.

makes me mad thinking about scumbag tough guys.

Originally Posted by Sasquatch

@Cordite season 9 is the latest one, AMC have a break over the holidays then part two of S9 will commence mid Feb.

I'm worried about you too Sasquatch. (<:

Originally Posted by 40mm

Yeah true, but having it ready for defence is surely not legal. And by the time the safe is opened and the ammo loaded etc its probably gonna be too late. Unless you just so happened to have the gun out already for maintenance etc then its unlikely to be any use.

Personally I think that any intruder in your home should be treated as an immediate threat to you and your families safety. (Regardless of any weapons visible)
I'm not speaking from experience, but if someone came into my house I would assume I was being flanked by their fellow scumbags (going around to the other doors/windows and attempting to surround me or get to my family) and the only reasonable defence would be to try to incapacitate, with no hesitation whoever I see first then move onto the next guy and give my family as much time as I can to hide or escape etc. (watched enough movies eh)

As for reasonable force in a situation like that, How would an aggressive intruder in your home react if you tried to defend yourself but didn't hit hard enough, or missed? Do they deserve to be hit softly or carefully?
HELL NO! the only reasonable amount of force in a situation like that is to use all of it! what ever is the best tool you have immediate access to: bat, gun, kung fu, what ever you can to ensure they do not get up while your back is turned, so you can continue to protect your family from the next guy who is probably climbing in your daughters window by now.

makes me mad thinking about scumbag tough guys.

Be vary careful confronting an intruder. May be loaded up on drugs to cope with their fear, they can be addicted to the buzz of the burglary but have to take something to cope with the fear. Sometimes the fear is what makes them suddenly have to defaecate in your living room. Basically, confronting someone drugged up, all bets are off and you can end up with a biro kicked into your brain through your ear. Definitely don't sneak up on them, make a racket rather.

Originally Posted by 40mm

Yeah true, but having it ready for defence is surely not legal. And by the time the safe is opened and the ammo loaded etc its probably gonna be too late. Unless you just so happened to have the gun out already for maintenance etc then its unlikely to be any use.

Personally I think that any intruder in your home should be treated as an immediate threat to you and your families safety. (Regardless of any weapons visible)
I'm not speaking from experience, but if someone came into my house I would assume I was being flanked by their fellow scumbags (going around to the other doors/windows and attempting to surround me or get to my family) and the only reasonable defence would be to try to incapacitate, with no hesitation whoever I see first then move onto the next guy and give my family as much time as I can to hide or escape etc. (watched enough movies eh)

As for reasonable force in a situation like that, How would an aggressive intruder in your home react if you tried to defend yourself but didn't hit hard enough, or missed? Do they deserve to be hit softly or carefully?
HELL NO! the only reasonable amount of force in a situation like that is to use all of it! what ever is the best tool you have immediate access to: bat, gun, kung fu, what ever you can to ensure they do not get up while your back is turned, so you can continue to protect your family from the next guy who is probably climbing in your daughters window by now.

makes me mad thinking about scumbag tough guys.

I'm not saying this is the best option, @Cordites post about making a secondary obstacle for them to get past is a bloody good one, cheers cordite.

Originally Posted by 40mm

Yeah true, but having it ready for defence is surely not legal.

Yeah but how is it not? If the firearm is under your supervision then how is it 'illegal'? The bollocks in the arms code about self-defence not being a valid reason to own firearms is not law. It's your dwelling, you might live on a farm and carry a rifle around with you some of the time.

Obviously firearms must be locked away securely when not in use but lets say hypothetically, your neighborhood had one or two aggravated burglaries during the night in the past week. What are some viable options for protecting you and your family? Must be law-abiding recommendations and concur logical and rational thinking:

- Alarms, sensors and dogs. Yep, great but if intruders are persistent enough or 'cracked-out' you need a back up plan. Alarms can be ignored and dogs wounded or killed.

- Panic room? Yeah sure but have you got the funds for that? You renting like most of the country? Not an option for most.

- Your bare hands, I wouldn't recommend it. If you did decide to go that route you need a lot of discipline and training to be proficient enough to defend yourself and others. High level of training and years of experience is required for disarmament too, hardly an option for the physically challenged and the elderly.

- Bat or other blunt weapon, yep good, up until a certain point...

- Knife, sword or machete, yep good, up until a certain point...

- Blank firing pistol, probably a viable option for most people, no license required other than must be 18+ (make sure it's not a top venting model, has to be front) but other then making a lot of noise, at the end of the day, you are only bluffing.

- Telephone or cellphone calling the police, your kidding right? Even with a 5 minute call out time (that's me being overly optimistic!) a LOT can happen in 5 minutes... If doable, a sensible option is to get another family member dialing 111 WHILST attending to the immediate threat yourself. Note: Short call out times are only realistic for city slickers, the average call out time is more like 10-15+ minutes for big towns.

- Loaded firearm, the equalizer and best option for home D. Deals with lethal and non-lethal threats. Non-lethal threats may deter from the mere presentation of one. And then there is also a warning shot - That would make most criminals scat and used in a non-lethal way, can defuse very tense situations.

Some here may disagree with this and say 'we don't need firearms' for defence radi raa, but at the end of the day it's you and your families lives you're wanting to preserve. May only be a point-of-a-percent chance it could happen to you but we still all wear seat belts when we go driving.

Originally Posted by 40mm

@Beaker, Who do I need to hang around if I want to find abandoned pistols?

The police... https://kiwigunblog.wordpress.com/20...-a-little-bit/

Originally Posted by Sasquatch

The bollocks in the arms code about self-defence not being a valid reason to own firearms is not law.

I suggest that the Arms Code summarizes society's rules for the legal possession and use of firearms.

When there are intruders into our houses and our families are at risk, these ferals have broken the agreements and rules that sustain our society - into tiny little pieces - and by their presence in our dwelling they intend harm to our families. The Arms Code does not, can not* then apply.

(* I suspect after the event a moiety of the Crown's lawyers will disagree, and pursue the citizen defending his/her family with more tenacity and zeal than has ever been seen directed at home invaders... but that speaks far more to the hypocrisy and treachery of some legal Pharisees than it does to the right to protect one's family from intruders).

Originally Posted by 40mm

I'm not saying this is the best option, @Cordites post about making a secondary obstacle for them to get past is a bloody good one, cheers cordite.

Your driveway alarm, I have one acquaintance with one - he had it combined with a camera that would freeze frame whatever drove past, effectively increases the security of your front door as you won't be surprised there either, never mind needing the secondary zone. To have a secondary zone effective, you'd need to be able to respond to door callers through a video link to upstairs as well as to downstairs. Anything too inconvenient, and eventually it won't be used.

A simple driveway sensor system. Does look like it needs some more weather protection and camo paint, except over the sensor window.
https://www.trademe.co.nz/home-livin...22f6e3bfe30186 There are el-cheapo ones for less than $20, but with only 60m range, but even they can easily get their range extended to several hundred metres by longer aerial wires. I had a garage opener I got working out to 300m by extending aerials of controller and receiver - no real purpose for it, just playing.

@Sasquatch, a simple measure like a sturdy beam or bolt inside your bedroom door can buy you time. Mistake to focus on the whole Jodie Foster panic room movie thing with food for 5 days, CCTV screens, running water and toilet. Over the top -- except there is the usual civil defense preparedness supplies to consider. Also bear in mind that you can have your old mobile phone with an old sim sitting ready there - you do not need a plan or credit to dial 111, just need to have it charged (knowing sod's law, your new phone will be downstairs on the sofa). The older the better as it will have a more powerful transmitter to cope with the old days of poorer cell tower cover. Having a video/voice system from bedroom to front door is useful - if someone calls uninvited in the early hours, they won't find you bleary eyed and half conscious just inside when they break down what appears to be your only front door.

Originally Posted by Sasquatch

Yeah but how is it not? If the firearm is under your supervision then how is it 'illegal'? The bollocks in the arms code about self-defence not being a valid reason to own firearms is not law. It's your dwelling, you might live on a farm and carry a rifle around with you some of the time.

Obviously firearms must be locked away securely when not in use but lets say hypothetically, your neighborhood had one or two aggravated burglaries during the night in the past week. What are some viable options for protecting you and your family? Must be law-abiding recommendations and concur logical and rational thinking:

- Alarms, sensors and dogs. Yep, great but if intruders are persistent enough or 'cracked-out' you need a back up plan. Alarms can be ignored and dogs wounded or killed.

- Panic room? Yeah sure but have you got the funds for that? You renting like most of the country? Not an option for most.

- Your bare hands, I wouldn't recommend it. If you did decide to go that route you need a lot of discipline and training to be proficient enough to defend yourself and others. High level of training and years of experience is required for disarmament too, hardly an option for the physically challenged and the elderly.

- Bat or other blunt weapon, yep good, up until a certain point...

- Knife, sword or machete, yep good, up until a certain point...

- Blank firing pistol, probably a viable option for most people, no license required other than must be 18+ (make sure it's not a top venting model, has to be front) but other then making a lot of noise, at the end of the day, you are only bluffing.

- Telephone or cellphone calling the police, your kidding right? Even with a 5 minute call out time (that's me being overly optimistic!) a LOT can happen in 5 minutes... If doable, a sensible option is to get another family member dialing 111 WHILST attending to the immediate threat yourself. Note: Short call out times are only realistic for city slickers, the average call out time is more like 10-15+ minutes for big towns.

- Loaded firearm, the equalizer and best option for home D. Deals with lethal and non-lethal threats. Non-lethal threats may deter from the mere presentation of one. And then there is also a warning shot - That would make most criminals scat and used in a non-lethal way, can defuse very tense situations.

Some here may disagree with this and say 'we don't need firearms' for defence radi raa, but at the end of the day it's you and your families lives you're wanting to preserve. May only be a point-of-a-percent chance it could happen to you but we still all wear seat belts when we go driving.

Man, I fully agree with you.

Originally Posted by Cordite

Be vary careful confronting an intruder. May be loaded up on drugs to cope with their fear, they can be addicted to the buzz of the burglary but have to take something to cope with the fear. Sometimes the fear is what makes them suddenly have to defaecate in your living room. Basically, confronting someone drugged up, all bets are off and you can end up with a biro kicked into your brain through your ear. Definitely don't sneak up on them, make a racket rather.

Is that "biro kicked into your brain" from an action movie? It rings a bell @Cordite

Originally Posted by 40mm

Is that "biro kicked into your brain" from an action movie? It rings a bell @Cordite

You may be showing your age. It stuck in my brain (pun intended) from watching a TV crime reconstruction in my early teens. Horrifying. It was actually a fountain pen used. A couple of druggie burglars vs old pensioner. I think one or both of them got a prolonged shock later on, courtesy of Thomas Alva Edison's invention, some interviews with then while on the usual prolonged death row (now THAT is cruelty).



I like this one better than some others. Sitting completely upright is uncomfortable.

@Cordite sturdy beam or bolt is a good idea, buying time is crucial during a home invasion. Funny thing is when you mentioned panic room, that's the movie I was thinking of ;-)

@40mm I don't know about the biro, but I know the Joker can make a pencil disappear...

Originally Posted by Sasquatch

@Cordite sturdy beam or bolt is a good idea, buying time is crucial during a home invasion. Funny thing is when you mentioned panic room, that's the movie I was thinking of ;-)

@40mm I don't know about the biro, but I know the Joker can make a pencil disappear...

They used to be called "safe rooms" until that movie, since then always "panic" rooms. Must say "safe room" is much better. "Panic" room almost conditions you to start screaming hysterically on entering it - a bit like when the aircraft oxygen masks pop out from their overhead compartments. The whole point of having such a zone / room is to avoid the need for panic.

"Safe Zone" has got to be the better term.

Originally Posted by Cordite

You may be showing your age. It stuck in my brain (pun intended) from watching a TV crime reconstruction in my early teens. Horrifying. It was actually a fountain pen used. A couple of druggie burglars vs old pensioner. I think one or both of them got a prolonged shock later on, courtesy of Thomas Alva Edison's invention, some interviews with then while on the usual prolonged death row (now THAT is cruelty).

Attachment 103745

I like this one better than some others. Sitting completely upright is uncomfortable.

I think it is funny how, when they do death by lethal injection, they swab the needle site before injecting

Originally Posted by 308

I think it is funny how, when they do death by lethal injection, they swab the needle site before injecting

It's also funny that they worry about inflicting 10 seconds of pain by using a certain type of chemical is not OK. By my reckoning, if your subject to death row, maybe you have done some bad (that may have lasted longer than 10 seconds to someone) things to people.

As long as the rust doesn't stop the flow of juice, and maybe the alcohol wipe May help it - I'm ok.