Thread: Very Powerful Firearms

Originally Posted by csmiffy

None taken-the rules are the rules no matter how stupid they are.
BUT if you are a fit and proper person for one firearm, it shouldn't matter what you have.
As an aside I believe that some of the English laws are a pain also. You can get a permit for a rifle and its your favourite, but if another one of these darlings comes on especially in the same calibre you may not get it as the question is asked "why do you need another one". I think it can just apply to calibres too-cant have 2 308's for example

Very true, the English rules drive my gun luvvin' rellies batshit.

I left England in 1987 as a youngster set on a life less ordinary, just after the Hungerford shootings which started the clampdown on firearms ownership in the UK. And then of course Dunblane after that in '96. I've not lived their since!

My rellies went through a world of pain as they had to surrender all their suddenly illegal guns that they used very effectively and exclusively for pest control, e.g. my Franchi 5 shot semi auto that I mentioned in the rabbit virus thread earlier. When I found out that gun was gone, despite living on the other side of the world, I was pretty bloody heartbroken. Somethings you just develop an attachment to.

I know for a fact that a few of these suddenly illegal guns were kept, as you might expect, though I've always looked at that action as a bit selfish and liable to end in great regret.

The thing that annoys my rellies the most about the UK gun laws is how variable they are application wise, from constabulary to constabulary. It is a fact that if your firearms officer likes you, drinks real ale and is an all round good bloke, you'll pretty much get what you want, in terms of bolt action hunting centrefires, within reason. If he's a bitter and twisted useless knob pushed into paperwork cos he didn't cut it as a proper policeman, you'll have a hard time getting a .22 rimfire.

From what I understand, everyone with a rifle the same or greater than .300 win mag are getting these letters.

There’s a bloke and his wife on YouTube that I met at a fair in Perth who likes to do improbable and really rather pointless stuff with rifles of all shapes and sizes at extreme range. Visited him in the Wheatbelt and ended up putting mate from a Gasgoyne station onto him for a long range 7mm build, can’t remember which one, RUM or SAUM whatever. And that was for camels!

I’ll send him a message and see if he’s got one of these letters, he had a .50 cal and a whole walk in safe full of Very Powerful Firearms last time I saw him!

Is that Mark and Sam?

I can't remember off hand the chamber designation I put on Sams, barrels it certainly didn't have Cheytac in it...

Just remember the Aussies are putting pressure on the Kiwis to align our gun laws with theirs........

The issue I have with the Aussie gun laws in regards to the "very powerful" ones etc; Is that so what if that guy put to shoot camels? You are most definitely right @Flyblown, he may of well wrote down the wrong recreational use. But that is where the problem lies, things change. People's circumstances change over time and what they want one day may change the next.

This is the luxury (freedom) of being a fit and proper person - I can choose what I want, when I want it. What colour it is and how big it is and I shouldn't have to justify why/how to anyone especially to the police.

Not a good time to sit back and laugh guys, the NZ Police have put a recommendation forward that you will need to provide a valid reason to have a FAL, or belong to an authorised shooting organisation or club. They have also publicly acknowledged that they are worried that MSC wont be able to deliver the required amount of firearms courses for applicants, or to the required standard. One of the reasons MSC won the tender against far more qualified organisations is that Mike Daisley, the CEO of MSC, the one and the same CEO that has dragged MSC to its knees, the one and the same CEO that recently sacked all the volunteers all over the country - is very good friends with Greg OConnor, the previous anti gun nutter that was head of the Police Assn. And another recommendation to government is that you will only be able to buy ammunition for the particular calibre of firearm you are licensed for.
So lets not be complacent, we need to stand united, we need to stir these bastards at every opportunity. Starting with turning up to the Police road show Scam thats happening all over the country right now and let them know we have some excellent gun laws, leave them alone!

Originally Posted by Husky1600

Not a good time to sit back and laugh guys, the NZ Police have put a recommendation forward that you will need to provide a valid reason to have a FAL, or belong to an authorised shooting organisation or club. They have also publicly acknowledged that they are worried that MSC wont be able to deliver the required amount of firearms courses for applicants, or to the required standard. One of the reasons MSC won the tender against far more qualified organisations is that Mike Daisley, the CEO of MSC, the one and the same CEO that has dragged MSC to its knees, the one and the same CEO that recently sacked all the volunteers all over the country - is very good friends with Greg OConnor, the previous anti gun nutter that was head of the Police Assn. And another recommendation to government is that you will only be able to buy ammunition for the particular calibre of firearm you are licensed for.
So lets not be complacent, we need to stand united, we need to stir these bastards at every opportunity. Starting with turning up to the Police road show Scam thats happening all over the country right now and let them know we have some excellent gun laws, leave them alone!

If that bit about the MSc and Greg O'Connor is true then I wouldn't be surprised.

And they say that there's no corruption and vice in NZ government.

Sent from my TA-1024 using Tapatalk

A repeat of a post I put up last year. Perhaps some of you might now take the time to read and digest. The agenda is set. It will not change. The only options are to capitulate, or resist. Appeasement is not an option. That is just stupidity working for the enemy.

Originally Posted by Beavis

The more I read it, the more it seems clear that they are trying to weasel in Australian gun laws.

This is what you are up against.

COMMUNIQUÉ
Law, Crime and Community Safety Council, 27-28 April 2016
The first meeting of the Law, Crime and Community Safety Council for 2016 was held over 27 28 April 2016 in Queenstown, New Zealand. Ministers from New Zealand, the Commonwealth and each state and territory with portfolio responsibility for law and justice, police and emergency management were in attendance, as was a representative of the Australian Local Government Association. The meeting was chaired by the Hon Nikki Kaye MP, New Zealand Minister of Civil Defence the (Emergency Management Session), the Hon Judith Collins MP, New Zealand Minister (Law Enforcement session), the Hon Amy Adams MP, New Zealand Minister of Justice (Family Violence and Community Safety session) and the Commonwealth Minister for Justice and Minister Assisting the Prime Minister for Counter-Terrorism, the Hon Michael Keenan MP (Law Reform).
On 28 April 2016, the Hon Rene Hidding MP, Minister for Police and Emergency Management for Tasmania, asked Ministers to pause for a minute of silence to commemorate the passage of 20 years since the events of the Port Arthur tragedy – to reflect upon the ongoing suffering of those mourning the loss of the 35 people who died and the ongoing distress of many who survived appalling physical and mental trauma. Ministers noted that the tragedy shaped the Australian community’s notions of trauma, loss and suffering and how these events resulted in an extended community recovery program which became the benchmark for similar international events in following years. Ministers reflected on the decisive actions of all Australian jurisdictions in developing and achieving consensus on the historic National Firearms Agreement, which is the envy of many countries around the world and agreed to again restate all jurisdictions’ commitment to maintaining a national consensus on firearms as embodied in the National Firearms Agreement.
[Session 2: Law enforcement
National Firearms Agreement and other firearms measures
Ministers noted a number of measures to deal with illegal firearms and the ongoing work of senior officials to update the National Firearms Agreement.

I suggest you download your own copy of the National firearms agreement to see what your government ministers and police policy makers have bought into. Note it is the Australasian police ministers council. Not the Australian police ministers council.

AUSTRALASIAN POLICE MINISTERS’ COUNCIL
SPECIAL FIREARMS MEETING
CANBERRA
10 MAY 1996
RESOLUTIONS
2
1. Bans on Specific Types of Firearms
RESOLUTION
Council resolved:
(a) that all jurisdictions ban the sale, resale, transfer, ownership, possession, manufacture and
use of those firearms banned or proposed to be banned from import other than in the
exceptional circumstances listed in paragraph 1.2 of the Commonwealth proposal (see
below).
para 1.2 The only need for the use of an automatic or semi-automatic longarm would be:
 military;
 police or other government purposes; and
 occupational categories of shooters who have been licensed for a specified
purpose (eg extermination of feral animals).
(b) that all jurisdictions ban competitive shooting involving those firearms banned or proposed
to be banned from import.
Council agreed to implement its resolution via the following action plan:
1. All jurisdictions to ban the sale, resale, transfer, ownership, possession, manufacture and
use of those firearms banned or to be banned from import other than in the following
exceptional circumstances:
 military use;
 police or other government purposes; and
 occupational categories of shooters who have been licensed for a specified
purpose (eg extermination of feral animals).
2. All jurisdictions to ban competitive shooting involving those firearms banned or proposed
to be banned from import.
3. The Commonwealth to ban the importation of all semi-automatic self-loading and pump
action longarms, and all parts, including magazines, for such firearms, included in Licence
Category D, and control the importation of those firearms included in Licence Category C.
2. Effective Nationwide Registration of All Firearms
RESOLUTION
Council resolved:
(a) that New South Wales, Queensland and Tasmania immediately establish an integrated
licence and firearms registration system and that all other jurisdictions review their existing
registration systems to ensure that all systems are compatible.
(b) that these databases be linked through the National Exchange of Police Information (NEPI)
to ensure effective nationwide registration of all firearms.

Police and Government have complete contempt for your views. What you are seeing is merely the Govt's nodding dog technique. Your future is already decided.

This lecture is well worth watching. Very very relevant perspectives.

I encourage all forum members not to write abusive or slander-like posts about the authorities in this matter, if you think they don’t read these threads then think again. As posted above, its a very serious issue to NZ shooting sports.

https://youtu.be/0dOEON-H9BQ

Originally Posted by Flyblown

I encourage all forum members not to write abusive or slander-like posts about the authorities in this matter, if you think they don’t read these threads then think again. As posted above, its a very serious issue to NZ shooting sports.

Why? Servile behaviour and the attendant grovelling while attempting to point a bureaucrat's attention to another shooting discipline, while leaving yours alone, failed for you in your previous places of residence.

In 1996, as Australia adopted their National firearms agreement, our senior Police policy makers, persuaded the Govt. of the day to open an inquiry headed by a retired judge named Thorp. This firearms inquiry produced a report titled "The Thorp Report" in 1997, which among other gems recommended universal registration of firearms, the banning of semiautomatic firearms, and all private firearms held in state armouries as required security.

A Bill was speedily produced and passed it's first reading in Parliament. Thousands gave up their time and travelled great distances to make their voices heard at the select committee meetings held around the country in 2000. The Govt. of the day decided not to proceed with the Bill, and so the status quo was maintained.

Senior police and their fellow travellers have never got over this defeat, and moved on to administering the firearms laws of NZ. Police are always pushing to implement the recommendations of the "Thorp report", through illegal policy, which the average licence holder cannot afford to dispute, and constant lobbying of their minister and parliament to change the law according to police direction.
Police and their Union have no conscience about lying to Parliament, and the public, in order to achieve their agenda. Most NZ media are fools or complicit, as they are a major force in demonizing firearms owners.

You would be wise to recognize the enemy.

Originally Posted by Flyblown

This lecture is well worth watching. Very very relevant perspectives.

I encourage all forum members not to write abusive or slander-like posts about the authorities in this matter, if you think they don’t read these threads then think again. As posted above, its a very serious issue to NZ shooting sports.

https://youtu.be/0dOEON-H9BQ

She is very good. I can't believe I just said that about an Aussie.

Originally Posted by JWB

Why? Servile behaviour and the attendant grovelling while attempting to point a bureaucrat's attention to another shooting discipline, while leaving yours alone, failed for you in your previous places of residence.

In 1996, as Australia adopted their National firearms agreement, our senior Police policy makers, persuaded the Govt. of the day to open an inquiry headed by a retired judge named Thorp. This firearms inquiry produced a report titled "The Thorp Report" in 1997, which among other gems recommended universal registration of firearms, the banning of semiautomatic firearms, and all private firearms held in state armouries as required security.

A Bill was speedily produced and passed it's first reading in Parliament. Thousands gave up their time and travelled great distances to make their voices heard at the select committee meetings held around the country in 2000. The Govt. of the day decided not to proceed with the Bill, and so the status quo was maintained.

Senior police and their fellow travellers have never got over this defeat, and moved on to administering the firearms laws of NZ. Police are always pushing to implement the recommendations of the "Thorp report", through illegal policy, which the average licence holder cannot afford to dispute, and constant lobbying of their minister and parliament to change the law according to police direction.
Police and their Union have no conscience about lying to Parliament, and the public, in order to achieve their agenda. Most NZ media are fools or complicit, as they are a major force in demonizing firearms owners.

You would be wise to recognize the enemy.

You mate, have completely missed the point.

If you go about your business being offensive and slandering your opponents and telling the world you think those that make the law are stupid etc etc then lets see how far you get. My experience of life says keep your friends close, keep your enemies closer.

If you think the Sporting Shooters Association of Australia appreciate gun owners making vile and gratuitous comments about the police on internet forums, then you are sorely mistaken.

Read my post again. I said “I encourage all forum members not to write abusive or slander-like posts”. Since when does choosing not to approach this serious matter in an abusive manner make me a serville groveller ffs? Are you for real? I will put this down to simply misunderstanding my point of view, if that’s not the case then you are foolish.

Believe me, if you fight this battle from the gutter, you’ll loose. There is a zero tolerance attitude for the kind of crap that gets written about the police on these forums, they will ise it against us, it makes the job so much harder, just like it does in all aspects of life.

Originally Posted by Flyblown

You mate, have completely missed the point.

If you go about your business being offensive and slandering your opponents and telling the world you think those that make the law are stupid etc etc then lets see how far you get. My experience of life says keep your friends close, keep your enemies closer.

If you think the Sporting Shooters Association of Australia appreciate gun owners making vile and gratuitous comments about the police on internet forums, then you are sorely mistaken.

Read my post again. I said “I encourage all forum members not to write abusive or slander-like posts”. Since when does choosing not to approach this serious matter in an abusive manner make me a serville groveller ffs? Are you for real? I will put this down to simply misunderstanding my point of view, if that’s not the case then you are foolish.

Believe me, if you fight this battle from the gutter, you’ll loose. There is a zero tolerance attitude for the kind of crap that gets written about the police on these forums, they will ise it against us, it makes the job so much harder, just like it does in all aspects of life.

I agree. Keeping it civil is the best way to show we are reasonable and rational.

Originally Posted by Rushy

Nah the truth is my missus sat down on the couch beside me.

It's OK Rushy, we have your back. As we look into our computers if we see someone sneaking up behind you we'll let to know.

That does remind me of a couple of 19 year old Perth hitch hikers we picked up on the coast, back probably about '78-'79. Now there is plenty of talk of us having extra digits down here on the mainland, but bugger it, they seemed to have excess bloody hands.