Thread: Why frontline cops should be armed

Originally Posted by kotuku

Dont take the piss lassie or I will let loose. Ignorance is not bloody excuse on this forum -consider yourself warned young un!
Sorry my arse

Obviously you like to think ya got it sussed well just sit quite take a deep breath and think on this
40yrs ago an old bloke gave me this wee gem to think on and I think on it every day
"tis the old dog who walks the footpath "
"the pups they run the street"

Dont bother replying in haste -you may well find Ive already bared me teeth .Take ya time and have a wee think then apply the conclusions youve reached to the point of debate -you may very well be suprised at the conclusions you reach,i
f so just open a new folder in the computer between your ears and call it lifes new experiences!
finally seasons greetings to you asnd yours and may all your days be happy ones.

You realise your posts are largely incomprehensible nonsense, right?

Originally Posted by gimp

You realise your posts are largely incomprehensible nonsense, right?

I have no problem. Mind you it can be a good ploy to make things difficult to read as then you really have to read them to understand.

It is a curly topic though and there is no clear clean cut answer as we do not live in a perfect world. There are enough crooked/bad/incompetent cops in the mix to not want them all armed. There is also the vast majority that would be fine. Then there is the criminal element that really don't give a toss about anyone else, and with some of the drugs like P they are unpredictable and very dangerous.

As far as the argument about citizens not being armed because they do not have the experience and training; this could be applied to the Police as well. Many of them do not and will not have the skills required to safely carry. Many also do not have the skills to negotiate situations that would be better handled my someone with mental or social worker training so would arguably be better leaving those situations to professionals in those arenas. The reality is we just about need cars with a copper, mental health worker, medic and fire fighter. This is obviously totally impractical.

The solution is not going to be at all easy. Perhaps step back a little and get back to a justice system that avoids the criminal sector from getting to such a state rather than the legal system that we have now that favours the criminal. The analogy of the guy at the top of the cliff stopping people jumping rather than the ambulance at the bottom.

Originally Posted by kotuku

Dont take the piss lassie or I will let loose. Ignorance is not bloody excuse on this forum -consider yourself warned young un!
Sorry my arse

Obviously you like to think ya got it sussed well just sit quite take a deep breath and think on this
40yrs ago an old bloke gave me this wee gem to think on and I think on it every day
"tis the old dog who walks the footpath "
"the pups they run the street"

Dont bother replying in haste -you may well find Ive already bared me teeth .Take ya time and have a wee think then apply the conclusions youve reached to the point of debate -you may very well be suprised at the conclusions you reach,i
f so just open a new folder in the computer between your ears and call it lifes new experiences!
finally seasons greetings to you asnd yours and may all your days be happy ones.

You are clearly already loose in the mental department, I'll leave it at that.

P.S go see the doc and ask him if he thinks you're fit to still have a FAL.

Originally Posted by Pengy

And so is arrogance....punctuation ...really.

Yes! Punctuation is a clear sign of intelligence or lack thereof!
Not to mention even with the correct punctuation it still spits up the vial nonsensical crap coming out of some mad mans head.

Originally Posted by gimp

You realise your posts are largely incomprehensible nonsense, right?

But apparently calling him out on it is ignorance. Interesting....

If I had been drinking tonight I would suggest you are a fwit Jexla. But I haven't, so I will leave it at that

ouch this has gone of the rails

Originally Posted by Pengy

If I had been drinking tonight I would suggest you are a fwit Jexla. But I haven't, so I will leave it at that

Think what you will.
Haven't seen you add anything to the conversation.

I really hope we can keep the Police as they are, not openly armed. I think we have a relationship with our Police force like no other Country that I know.

On the topic of CC I have to say that although I have no problems with firearms even in a public place but I prefer not to carry one. It is an extra stress and responsibility. On the other hand if I was living somewhere that was particularly violent? Maybe.

Originally Posted by MassiveAttack

Of course the police got called in to deal with him. Nobody else in the country is allowed to carry an effective means of defense and if they used it then it's likely that they would end up on the wrong side of a court case even though their intentions were to defend life and property. Basically what you are advocating is disarming the public and then arming the police more in order to protect a disarmed public.

Exactly, Police get called to deal with it, it's their job, not the average member of the public.

You obviously know nothing of the law and how it is applied, I recommend you don't comment on what you don't know about. Have you ever even read S48 of the Crimes Act? Let alone looked into case law surround possessing offensive weapons?

When and where did I mention, let alone advocate, disarming the public? Stop making up my opinion for me in order to suit your argument, I said nothing of the sort.

I may have used the wrong word when I said satistics. My info came directly from the blokes on the RO course and it wasn't second hand. I don't think they release public stats on police range accidents but if they do let me know where they are. To the best of my knowledge there has been one firearm related injury at a civilian range.

Statistics is a pretty specific word, hard to get that one wrong unintentionally. So the info came straight from civilians that wouldn't have been present at the time of the incidents? But wasn't second hand? I still don't know of any Police related firearm injuries on a range. You can't compare what happens off range, apples with apples.

Here is an article detailing the eight accidential dischanges by police between 2010 and 2013, it doesn't make for great reading.
Police shooting still unresolved a year on | Stuff.co.nz

He was being helped to his feet when a police officer's Bushmaster rifle discharged. Pere spent several weeks in Wellington Hospital recovering.

The officer involved has since returned to work on restricted duties, and was stood down from the armed offenders squad.

That doesn't contain the Chch one so I will see if I can find that.

Another sensationalist news article, much like some parts of your posts, you can't tell me there hasn't been any AD/NDs on civilian ranges? The guy getting shot in the back was tragic and steps have been taken to remedy the cause of that accident.

Originally Posted by MassiveAttack

If it's a safe place to live then front line police don't need to be armed...

Because Police are the ones that are deployed into the small unsafe areas trying to keep NZ safe, stop being arrogant.

Originally Posted by Jexla

But apparently calling him out on it is ignorance. Interesting....

Well when you can understand the message but choose to ignore it because it lacks punctuation, that means you are choosing to remain ignorant.

Originally Posted by Banana

FAL holders (b endorsed in particular) hold the required attributes for the purpose of CC, and any deficiencies can be made up through classes and training. Concealed carriers wouldn't be getting the power and responsibility of a police officer, so directly comparing attributes is pointless.



I think it's the exact same issue. The only gain police are getting from full time arming is immediate access to a firearm for their own self defense. Why should only the police be afforded that ability. Increased risk doesn't make their life any more valuable.

Massiveattack directly compared them stating FAL holders carry the same attributes, as I was merely pointing out he was a long way from the truth.

I know a lot of FAL holders that most certainly don't hold the required attributes, but then that is just my personal opinion, just as your ideas on what attributes are needed are just your opinion.

It's not the same issue at all, I see it as a selfish argument the 'Police shouldn't be armed because I can't'. It's got nothing to do with you being armed, it's about whether they need to be armed or not.

Originally Posted by Savage1

Another sensationalist news article, much like some parts of your posts

Speak for yourself!

But mine is first hand personal experience

No I can't sleep, yes I'm bored.