Thread: Lab to take me through to old man status

It's great to see. Also why you see the odd cocker still set game. Was it a kennel boy of Nash's? He could tell some stories!

Keith Erlandson.

Yep!

Originally Posted by Ruff

Not sure what you are on about. I have worked with many Keepersmoors Labradors and Chris has used my spaniels in his breeding program time and again. They are a kennel I recommend and I have no doubt you have a great dog, don't be so sensitive. I have also referred people to Chris, one bought a started dog for a good sum and took it out and it was gunshy. Extremely soft nature, to the point of requiring extremely subtle handling to make something of it. I do not know if Chris got that dog going well or not and as a man of integrity he took the dog back and fully refunded the mans money. He has since got a "Greymist" he is extremely happy with. As a commercial trainer who has worked with literally thousands of dogs over the years your contention that handling dictates nature is completely flawed. Glad your ONE is OK, I was being a bit more broad!

I would gladly hunt over and own most Keepersmoors I have seen over the past 12-13 years or so of knowing Chris on a first hand basis, discussing dogs, drinking wine, having a cuppa at his Kaharoa kennels and being involved in his breeding programs and working with on at least four different pheasant shoots with him and I will say to anyone, use due diligence to ensure you are not getting a dog too soft for most people to make into something useful, they are in the minority of what he produces, but they are there. Chis is a good man with good dogs, but like all of us, nothing is perfect and it is not unrealistic for me to warn people to be careful. If you get a good one it will be as good as anything going. Hell the man has even bought two VERY good bottles of whiskey for the referrals I have made, just take a breath dude.

true enough ruff its like the people who choose the shy runt of the litter cos ''it needs us more'' but later cant figure why they have problems with it.
or the bold pup while a good start boldness could be intractability to.
you can make or break a dog but nature starts from whelping almost.

It's good watching the debate on the Lab V the WCS but at the end of the day if they do their job does it matter? the WCS I've got was also the runt of the litter but put him alongside his siblings now and he's so much bigger and stronger "Doesn't necessarily make him a better dog" but he doesn't have any trouble in carrying a full sized big hare and he even retrieved a fox I shot. Don't be put off by the runt or quiet pup of the litter! The quiet ones I've found all have more sense I think and use their judgement better as they aren't the !rush in merchant!

I agree Topdog, everything is relative, I have placed several dogs because they were "too soft" for me but were perfect for someone else.

In the instance I refer I have seen dogs requiring extremely advanced handling to make anything of them. It's not just "soft" but soft to the point of constant timidity. Very hard to overcome and almost as bad as way too rambunctious.

I agree Topdog, everything is relative, I have placed several dogs because they were "too soft" for me but were perfect for someone else.

In the instance I refer I have seen dogs requiring extremely advanced handling to make anything of them. It's not just "soft" but soft to the point of constant timidity. Very hard to overcome and almost as bad as way too rambunctious.

I reckon a dog that can't take training pressure at all, is as bad as a dog that takes too much. I have certainly had both ends of the scale.

I reckon the pro might want a softer dog, that retains its training. The novice wants one hard enough that it will take every mistake you make with it and still be happy to see you in the mornings, despite its training!

I think that soft and timid are very different things...a timid dog is as useful a rubber spear...a soft dog on the other hand can prove to be a thinker...it is the human in the equation that will make or break...

That's true. I didn't mean to put kind and compliant on the same page as timid

Originally Posted by Topdog

It's good watching the debate on the Lab V the WCS but at the end of the day if they do their job does it matter? the WCS I've got was also the runt of the litter but put him alongside his siblings now and he's so much bigger and stronger "Doesn't necessarily make him a better dog" but he doesn't have any trouble in carrying a full sized big hare and he even retrieved a fox I shot. Don't be put off by the runt or quiet pup of the litter! The quiet ones I've found all have more sense I think and use their judgement better as they aren't the !rush in merchant!

im not saying it cant or doesnt happen topdog but what i am saying is that if your paying upteen dollars for a pup you want to minimise any chances of problems ie the sulky, shy , poorly done or even overly bold pup [read agresive] yes some overcome thier poor start but just as many if not more dont and end up becoming a sold offf nightmare.

what can i say ,if you can't train a Labrador, should i say any more

Originally Posted by 00 buckshot

what can i say ,if you can't train a Labrador, should i say any more

Nailed it.

what can i say ,if you can't train a Labrador, should i say any more

if you cant get a lab to eat or root id say your done

Yep time for a cat