Thread: Teaching NO !

EeBee....

J'aime un coeur tendre......?

I like tender hearts???

Originally Posted by jakewire

No No No,
your bloody wrong.

NO-
means, cease and desist, your not to eat your food till i say so, do not chase the cat, do not fetch the duck until i say so, stc etc.

Stop means
STOP.

So when you say no what is the dog meant to do?

Originally Posted by Wirehunt

So when you say no what is the dog meant to do?

God I hope no one is dumb enough to say stop or there'll be 50 more posts on it ! Talk about yre loaded question !

Originally Posted by Tussock

Ut!

Exactly that ! Well done ..

Originally Posted by Twoshotkill

EeBee....

J'aime un coeur tendre......?

I like tender hearts???

Yes! Twoshotkill, I abhor meanness.

Whoa up!!! We use short two letter words because phonetically and physically they are the easier for us and the easiest for the dog...but it is not about the word you are using, it is about the corrective action and the modification of the unwanted behaviour that is important here...so the word is used to gain the dogs attention by mostly it tonal quality which imitates the gruffness of the growl...the bitch remonstrating her puppies isnt growling in a trill like fashion!!

Wirehunt, doing something anti-social, really...!!! If he wants to clean his finger nails with the butterknife....well, who are we to question...UT UT UT!!!

I guess it would be determined by what the behaviour is doing to you...if you sought advice, was given it and used it and it worked, well, it is a proven solution for that behaviour. One thing our dogs are and that is they are haphazard and pretty hopeless mind readers... If the solution was not proven, then your advisor is incorrect and you have tried to use an invalid or purposeless solution...in which case the only member of the triage which is going to be more confused is the poor dog.

Originally Posted by EeeBees

Whoa up!!! We use short two letter words because phonetically and physically they are the easier for us and the easiest for the dog...but it is not about the word you are using, it is about the corrective action and the modification of the unwanted behaviour that is important here...so the word is used to gain the dogs attention by mostly it tonal quality which imitates the gruffness of the growl...the bitch remonstrating her puppies isnt growling in a trill like fashion!!

I have to disagree... Tonal training gives more importance to one tone over another. If every command is given the same importance it gets the same response. I, likewise, have no place for meanness in training... my father always taught me "Give an animal a lesson in meanness and you have to be careful it did not learn a lesson in meanness".

People using "no" teach a dog that the current behavior is unacceptable... without offering up another behavior. Dogs are not that lateral. the same effect is gained (the sound No, Ut, whatever is irrelevant) buy using the same command it already knows "Stop" (Whatever sound you use) stops the current behavior... the smart handler then gives a command to offer up another behavior which is acceptable. This keeps the lines of communication open, the dog keeps respect for the handler because it understands and everyone can play happy, non-confused families. The dog remains relaxed in taking a command without a confusing tirade from the handler.

I knew you would disagree, goes without saying. I thought the question was what corrective action should be taken with the command NO, how to teach what NO means...this has been a cool thread...tangled and messy but interesting. It is, as you say, confusing when there are a whole wodge of negative tones and commands...thats when the dogs ears turn off...which brings us to that mystical self-hunting problem...too many commands, too much whistle blowing...the recall, it doesnt work, then the stop, it doesnt work...dog sticks middle claw in air and cranks the gears up...the respect factor wasnt taught first because so many of us want a dog fully trained and mechanical by six months old.

Originally Posted by EeeBees

I knew you would disagree, goes without saying. I thought the question was what corrective action should be taken with the command NO, how to teach what NO means...this has been a cool thread...tangled and messy but interesting. It is, as you say, confusing when there are a whole wodge of negative tones and commands...thats when the dogs ears turn off...which brings us to that mystical self-hunting problem...too many commands, too much whistle blowing...the recall, it doesnt work, then the stop, it doesnt work...dog sticks middle claw in air and cranks the gears up...the respect factor wasnt taught first because so many of us want a dog fully trained and mechanical by six months old.

Instead of preparing the preposition... read what was said.... You can;t teach what NO means... it's a dog. You are still crediting a dog with more thinking power than the universe endowed it with. Vicci. Let's make it simple... we can battle bullshit on a forum day in and day out.... what say we actually front up... you bring a dog, I'll bring a dog, we can invite forum members to attend, I know several who will... let's just front up with some dogs and run them together, see who has serious hounds, correct control without inhibition and just put this to sleep. I find the online argument to be tedious to be frank... i reckon if we just run some dogs, the point of it all, in front of people who can give considered opinion, we could have much more fruitful discussion in future, discussion that will benefit others trying to train dogs, all it takes is for us to run a couple of hounds together... we're not putting man on the moon, just running dogs. If you're right it'll show, if I'm right it'll show, let's stop pissing each other off and just run some dogs, one of us might have an edge... it is what the spectators want to see.

Yes!!!!! What Ruff said!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Ruff

Instead of preparing the preposition... read what was said.... You can;t teach what NO means... it's a dog. You are still crediting a dog with more thinking power than the universe endowed it with. Vicci. Let's make it simple... we can battle bullshit on a forum day in and day out.... what say we actually front up... you bring a dog, I'll bring a dog, we can invite forum members to attend, I know several who will... let's just front up with some dogs and run them together, see who has serious hounds, correct control without inhibition and just put this to sleep. I find the online argument to be tedious to be frank... i reckon if we just run some dogs, the point of it all, in front of people who can give considered opinion, we could have much more fruitful discussion in future, discussion that will benefit others trying to train dogs, all it takes is for us to run a couple of hounds together... we're not putting man on the moon, just running dogs. If you're right it'll show, if I'm right it'll show, let's stop pissing each other off and just run some dogs, one of us might have an edge... it is what the spectators want to see.

Cool, lets do this!! When and how??!!

I dunno, yu sort it out, you seem to have the biggest issue.

I teach my dog very little,, turn ,stop, fetch and come. I use a tonal arghh arggh if I dont like an action theyre doing - basic and effective . the only thing i have failed on is with my dog in blind cover at trials willfully hunting for himself . I dont know that is a battle I can ever win with many years of absent training