Thread: Versatile hunting dog test

you can run a cross breed just not at a champ trial - go along for a look Wirehunt - I dont know where in the south the clubs are but theyre there and if like anything like our clubs"most" are very friendly

you can run a cross breed just not at a champ trial - go along for a look Wirehunt - I dont know where in the south the clubs are but they're there and if like anything like our clubs"most" are very friendly.As far as breeding goes -around the clubs has to be better than the her say breeding of dogs that are not peer access me thinks Ruff but that's just my thoughts .Pointers and Setters -Robynn does a great job , English Setters have always been good but we are now few but growing agian ..by one new bitch in this month -there is a dog in from UK from a well known trialist and hunter Damian Gortaub ..but where is it ? Pointers ,I dont know but there is a member here importing a new one also,Pointer may be able to elaborate more on Pointer breeding .GSPs Ive seen plenty work well at Pigeon trials but few venture to live game -in saying that the ones Ive seen have hunted well .Wirehairs ,no idea but need an experienced rider to get the best lol
Springers , cockers and labs type dogs -no idea at at all and have not watched to many do their thing -talking with Bob the other day he said there was some good dogs around -that wwas just after he sent me packing in my trial ..I cooked him breakfast gave him lunch ..what more can a man do LOL

I've got a mate who has got into spaniel trials over the last 2 years. He has really taken to it and is doing quite well. He finds it a good social activity and he has made some new friends.

Although his dogs in the past have always been lovely and did what they were bred for, they were always deer chasers and the discipline was rather second to the close relationship he has had with them.

But now, the transformation is amazing.

This latest trial dog is the most obedient and well trained gun dog I have ever seen. The dog is a pleasure to hunt with, and now its my dog that looks a bit naughty

So big ups for the trials. My friend has gained a new interest, his dog is amazing, its great to hunt with and he has set a new bench mark for me to aspire to.

Originally Posted by el borracho

Pointers ,I dont know but there is a member here importing a new one also,Pointer may be able to elaborate more on Pointer breeding.

Couldn't possibly speak on pointer breeding in NZ as there are more qualified to do so. There is, however at least one working litter in the pipeline from Rotorua this year, and two confirmed working imports this year, with talk of another two later this year or next

Originally Posted by Tahr

I've got a mate who has got into spaniel trials over the last 2 years. He has really taken to it and is doing quite well. He finds it a good social activity and he has made some new friends.

Although his dogs in the past have always been lovely and did what they were bred for, they were always deer chasers and the discipline was rather second to the close relationship he has had with them.

But now, the transformation is amazing.

This latest trial dog is the most obedient and well trained gun dog I have ever seen. The dog is a pleasure to hunt with, and now its my dog that looks a bit naughty

So big ups for the trials. My friend has gained a new interest, his dog is amazing, its great to hunt with and he has set a new bench mark for me to aspire to.

Great stuff Thar !!! and so true .This morning I spoke with a GSP owner who was working his dog . He said he had been to a couple of shows and a trial but didnt like the fact you couldn't have your dog of a lead so flagged the lot . By the end of the conversation he was a new man as I had sprinkled fairy trial dust all over him and he had a new sense of what he could achieve if he got a little more involved and spoke to others that work on the finer point of manners and hunting prowess -I hope to see him again at a trial . I think you can only take positives away from a trial even if your dog ran like a corgy .

Look guys, I know it might not appear that way but here's the rub... for the very reasons outlined I AM A FAN OF TRIALS.... I AM A HUGE FAN OF THE CONCEPT OF THE VERSATILE TESTS!

I also take a shot at NO INNOCENT PARTY... I SHOOT BACK... TAKE A SWING... I'LL BRING A COMBO BACK. I don;t Target ANYONE... EVER, NEVER HAVE!

Live game trials have advanced NZ gundog handling massively, we have gone from some of the very worst handlers in the world to some of the not so worst handlers in the world in a very short space in time. The versatile tests are doing NOTHING but should be doing something... the only thing standing between them and success is the quality of people who put value in them, the quality of the people who participate in them. Maybe I'm wrong, but my view is that certain people would rather NOT have knowledgeable people involved because it render them redundant... call it a pissing contest if you must, but it's not. I don;t have a dog in the fight... I have no versatile, I run springers, i run them in live game when I can, when I'm not i shoot game over them....

BUT as a trainer i get calls constantly from folks... if the NZVHDTA stood for more I could recommend their participation... instead of viewing me as a threat I could be viewed as the very best recruitment tool they EVER had... but... my thoughts differ from hers... now I cannot be a member, I cannot attend a test... why? Cause she said so... oh yeah and some waffle about rules... it's all clear... this is her thing, she believes she has the right to ban me... she does. I couldn't give a shit... i didn't want to go anyway... but HUNTERS can do better... She is the issue standing between what the assn can do for HUNTERS and what it can do for her... we'll leave it be. Gail... I'll leave you out of it and give you your one shot... I don;t take shots... i respond to them, you took yours... take another and I might not play so nicely... I stand for nothing other than better dogs for NZ hunters. I have NOTHING to sell, no crusade, other than better dogs.... help yourself if you think you have the higher ground. I will outline and defend my position with all of my INTEGRITY of which I have a lot and will stand by. I am here to discuss, argue and defend anything I say. I run from nothing and have nothing to hide. people know who i am, I will front up with a dog to show what i believe is good dog work and I hide behind no nom-de-plume...


Come get me... or maybe we can all just be sensible and do more for the dogs and less for our egos.

Ye gods, is this still going on...

The ruff doth protest too much, methinks

Originally Posted by ebf

Ye gods, is this still going on...

The ruff doth protest too much, methinks

I don;t think so... what the f do you stand for???... anything but online shit stirring???... I stand for better dogs. end of story... get it?

Ok, smart arse, what do you think my agenda is???... I'll tell you if you've been to slow to work it out by now, but if you want to keep prodding, I 'll prod back... what's your problem, what bit didn't you understand?????

Have YOU got a dog that meets any of this criteria or are you just shit stirring?

Whatsa problem Ruff getting a bit tense there ?

Just wondering why you feel the need to paint yourself as the Virgin Mary of the NZ dog world. You keep repeating that you stand for better dogs in just about every second post, so I do get it, in fact, I think just about everyone gets it Ruff...

This thread has moved on, you seem to be the one insisting on pulling it back into the mud. You've made your position crystal clear, what it is you want, should we all gather for a public forum lynching, or would you like some other form of validation ?

Meh

Originally Posted by el borracho

you can run a cross breed just not at a champ trial - go along for a look Wirehunt - I dont know where in the south the clubs are but they're there and if like anything like our clubs"most" are very friendly.As far as breeding goes -around the clubs has to be better than the her say breeding of dogs that are not peer access me thinks Ruff but that's just my thoughts .Pointers and Setters -Robynn does a great job , English Setters have always been good but we are now few but growing agian ..by one new bitch in this month -there is a dog in from UK from a well known trialist and hunter Damian Gortaub ..but where is it ? Pointers ,I dont know but there is a member here importing a new one also,Pointer may be able to elaborate more on Pointer breeding .GSPs Ive seen plenty work well at Pigeon trials but few venture to live game -in saying that the ones Ive seen have hunted well .Wirehairs ,no idea but need an experienced rider to get the best lol
Springers , cockers and labs type dogs -no idea at at all and have not watched to many do their thing -talking with Bob the other day he said there was some good dogs around -that wwas just after he sent me packing in my trial ..I cooked him breakfast gave him lunch ..what more can a man do LOL

I didn;t say no one at trials was breeding good dogs... i said the trials themselves were no longer much of a breeding tool. By that I mean that is meant to be their intended purpose... but it doesn;t really fill that function anymore.

As for Bob, you could try wine vouchers.. but realistically... only good work wins him over.

Originally Posted by ebf

Whatsa problem Ruff getting a bit tense there ?

Just wondering why you feel the need to paint yourself as the Virgin Mary of the NZ dog world. You keep repeating that you stand for better dogs in just about every second post, so I do get it, in fact, I think just about everyone gets it Ruff...

This thread has moved on, you seem to be the one insisting on pulling it back into the mud. You've made your position crystal clear, what it is you want, should we all gather for a public forum lynching, or would you like some other form of validation ?

Meh

yes!

OK to p-ut it context i would rather spend time discussing improving dogs.. not politics... I think the discussion could be focused on how to get more hunters with dogs involved... sadly, instead of discussing constructive stuff anything that threatens some folks just draws more personal attacks and bullshit.

Even with all the best intentions Ruff some times we must appreciate perfection is mostly a dream and rarely a reality

Originally Posted by el borracho

Even with all the best intentions Ruff some times we must appreciate perfection is mostly a dream and rarely a reality

I get that... my point is this... the test is designed to test hunting dogs, yet few hunting dogs do the tests... we, meaning people who are obessed with gundogs, need to open our minds a little more and ensure what we are doing is relevant to hunters with dogs... when the tests/trials etc become the end we become a group of myopic hobbyists... what we do needs to produce better dogs, reliable breeding programs and something of relevance to hunters... while we only do more to futher the "game" we play it constitutes nothing more than our own game and as such has little relevance to anyone else.

Trials are a breeding tool...funny how trials can be breeding tools but exemplary work by the rough shooters dog is what exactly...no measure of the dogs prey drive or tenacity, endeavour, intent...what of those on chukar in the South Island high country where their runs are not in increments of 15 minutes but hours?

Originally Posted by EeeBees

Trials are a breeding tool...funny how trials can be breeding tools but exemplary work by the rough shooters dog is what exactly...no measure of the dogs prey drive or tenacity, endeavour, intent...what of those on chukar in the South Island high country where their runs are not in increments of 15 minutes but hours?

No where did I say they were the only breeding tool... in fact my point is/was they are not a very efficient breeding tools anymore... even though that is/was their primary purpose.

You can choose to be part of a solution or be part of the problem if you wish!